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Ryan Miller signs extension with Sabres $6.25M/5yr

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Old
07-22-2008, 12:21 PM
  #201
The Real
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Originally Posted by Refuse View Post
handiddly doo. I wouldn't say Osgood was handily outplayed by Fleury.

Stats: W L GAA SV% GA SO
Fleury 2 4 2.52 .923 17 0
Osgood 4 2 1.47 .930 10 2

Hmm. I wonder who was handily outplayed?
EDIT: How funny is it that you are such a homer that you include every statistic but shots. Oh my god, the more research I do the less I respect your argument. Twice in that series Osgood had a save percentage of .875. His inflated statistics are based on facing 40 total shot during the first two games when Detroit was playing incredibly tough defense. Fluery's .889% is the lowest and it was the first game of the series. In the Red Wings highest shot total, MAF stopped 55 of 58 shots.


I don't think those statistics are really fair. Consider shot on goal as a borometer for how well they played. Fluery's action was 30,58,30,34,34,36. Osgood? 22,32,23,24,22,19. 222 shots faced opposed to 142. You are using a statitistical value that is incredibly flawed.

Fleury was the better goalie in that series and he kept Pittsburgh a float when they couldn't mount any game plan what so ever. I'm not saying Osgood played bad, he just wasn't nearly as tested. Horrible statistical argument.


Last edited by The Real: 07-22-2008 at 12:30 PM.
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07-22-2008, 12:54 PM
  #202
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Originally Posted by The Real View Post
EDIT: How funny is it that you are such a homer that you include every statistic but shots. Oh my god, the more research I do the less I respect your argument. Twice in that series Osgood had a save percentage of .875. His inflated statistics are based on facing 40 total shot during the first two games when Detroit was playing incredibly tough defense. Fluery's .889% is the lowest and it was the first game of the series. In the Red Wings highest shot total, MAF stopped 55 of 58 shots.


I don't think those statistics are really fair. Consider shot on goal as a borometer for how well they played. Fluery's action was 30,58,30,34,34,36. Osgood? 22,32,23,24,22,19. 222 shots faced opposed to 142. You are using a statitistical value that is incredibly flawed.

Fleury was the better goalie in that series and he kept Pittsburgh a float when they couldn't mount any game plan what so ever. I'm not saying Osgood played bad, he just wasn't nearly as tested. Horrible statistical argument.
Homer? I'm not a Wings fan. About it being a horrible stats argument, not really. Osgood saved the ones he needed including a bunch of 3-5 pks. In order to get a shutout you have to save every shot, doesn't matter if its 25 or 35 shots. All the shots stats tell us basically are that Red Wings shot more and Fleury's stats are worse. In order to handily outplay Osgood, in my books, his stats need to be about equal despite the shots factor.

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07-22-2008, 01:51 PM
  #203
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106 wins and 2 conference finals the last 3 years

I think those 2 stats are the reason why he got this nice deal.

Good job Darcy.

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07-22-2008, 02:09 PM
  #204
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Originally Posted by Refuse View Post
Homer? I'm not a Wings fan. About it being a horrible stats argument, not really. Osgood saved the ones he needed including a bunch of 3-5 pks. In order to get a shutout you have to save every shot, doesn't matter if its 25 or 35 shots. All the shots stats tell us basically are that Red Wings shot more and Fleury's stats are worse. In order to handily outplay Osgood, in my books, his stats need to be about equal despite the shots factor.


Yes really. You are picking and choosing which statistics to post in your argument. If you don't think that shots are important why didn't you list them in your original post? You listed every major statistical category except for that one. It does matter and if you aren't a homer then you're kidding yourself. Facing 80 extra shots does make a difference. 13 extra shot a game doesn't create any statistical evidence that is justifiable in saying they played equally. Maybe not over an entire season but in head to head playoff series certainly. Further, if you don't think Fluery was the better goaltender in that series I don't know what you were watching. I don't like either team to be honest. I just can watch a game from a neutral corner and appreciate all the talent.


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07-22-2008, 02:22 PM
  #205
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I think this is a great move by Buffalo to keep Miller. They will definitely make the playoffs next season and have a shot at getting to the 2nd round. Buffalo should probably focus on giving Pominville an extension and then they can have a good 1st line for years to come (Vanek-Roy-Pominville).

With regards to this Osgood-Fleury debate, Fleury allowed 4 bad goals in the final. Because of this, I think Osgood outperformed Fleury in that he didn't cost his team any games. The four bad goals were...Samuelsson wrap around in Game 1, Hudler GWG in Game 4, Filppula goal in Game 6 and the Zetterberg GWG in Game 6.

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07-22-2008, 02:30 PM
  #206
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It's fairly obvious Fleury was the better goaltender in the SCF. He faced twice as many shots and put up a nearly identical save percentage as Osgood, who was playing behind a better D.

Game five alone shows Fleury's worth. If it weren't for him, the Pens would have been swept. I'm quite sure Detroit could have played just as good with any other decent goaltender. Osgood's stats were more a product of Detroit's system and HOF defensemen than his actual skill.

Not saying he didn't make big saves, because he did. But Fleury stood on his head.

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07-22-2008, 03:22 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by kingswillwinthecup View Post
It's fairly obvious Fleury was the better goaltender in the SCF. He faced twice as many shots and put up a nearly identical save percentage as Osgood, who was playing behind a better D.

Game five alone shows Fleury's worth. If it weren't for him, the Pens would have been swept. I'm quite sure Detroit could have played just as good with any other decent goaltender. Osgood's stats were more a product of Detroit's system and HOF defensemen than his actual skill.

Not saying he didn't make big saves, because he did. But Fleury stood on his head.



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07-22-2008, 10:45 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by gnr25 View Post
With regards to this Osgood-Fleury debate, Fleury allowed 4 bad goals in the final. Because of this, I think Osgood outperformed Fleury in that he didn't cost his team any games. The four bad goals were...Samuelsson wrap around in Game 1, Hudler GWG in Game 4, Filppula goal in Game 6 and the Zetterberg GWG in Game 6.
He also allowed a Samuelsson wrist shot from the boards to beat him in Game 3, closing the gap to 3-2.

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07-24-2008, 06:47 AM
  #209
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Originally Posted by The Real View Post
Yes really. [You are picking and choosing] which statistics to post in your argument. If you don't think that shots are important why didn't you list them in your original post? You listed every major statistical category except for that one. It does matter and if you aren't a [homer] then you're kidding yourself. Facing 80 extra shots does make a difference. 13 extra shot a game doesn't create any statistical evidence that is justifiable in saying they played equally. Maybe not over an entire season but in head to head playoff series certainly. Further, [if you don't think Fluery was the better goaltender in that series I don't know what you were watching]. I don't like either team to be honest. I just can watch a game from a neutral corner and appreciate all the talent.
Picking and choosing? I included all the important stats except shots which in retrospect might seem odd. One stat. You want to compare minutes? They're pretty equal. What else? Overtime losses? Assists?

Whatever, call everyone who disagrees with you a homer if it makes you feel better, I don't feel like explaining such a simple word now.

Or maybe I just have a different opinion than you do? If you were really watching the games I have no idea how you could miss the softies Fleury let in during the series.

Anyway this went completely off topic.

I think what the Sabres have in Ryan Miller is a borderline top 10 goalie in the league and thats all you need to win a championship if you put a better than decent team in front of him, like they had in 06 and 07.


Last edited by Refuse: 07-24-2008 at 06:55 AM.
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Old
07-24-2008, 08:27 AM
  #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Refuse View Post
Picking and choosing? I included all the important stats except shots which in retrospect might seem odd. One stat. You want to compare minutes? They're pretty equal. What else? Overtime losses? Assists?

Whatever, call everyone who disagrees with you a homer if it makes you feel better, I don't feel like explaining such a simple word now.

Or maybe I just have a different opinion than you do? If you were really watching the games I have no idea how you could miss the softies Fleury let in during the series.

Anyway this went completely off topic.

I think what the Sabres have in Ryan Miller is a borderline top 10 goalie in the league and thats all you need to win a championship if you put a better than decent team in front of him, like they had in 06 and 07.
I agree with that statement. He's 28 and entering the prime of his career and could take the next step. Having the right team in front of him will determine if he wins a championship or not.

Sorry if I offended you. Debating sports especially hockey is a very big part of my every day activities. This board lets me go wild.

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