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Old
05-06-2008, 03:04 PM
  #51
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Yeah it's like $25 in New Brunswick and P.E.I.

I got hit with the 'Possession' for having an open bottle of Blue in my front pocket back in '06 so hopefully it's been lowered since then lol.

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05-06-2008, 05:20 PM
  #52
Twisted Tales
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Then they wonder why cops are killed and oil stations are blown up.

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05-06-2008, 05:28 PM
  #53
Guillemin
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Originally Posted by Tuggy View Post
It's because you are a Bruins fan.
Clearly.

Just pay the fine and play "**** the Police" by NWA a lot.

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Old
05-06-2008, 05:39 PM
  #54
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I'm 25 and I was also eligible to get the "Carte Étudiante Privilège" since I was full time at University last year. However, when I went there to make it, there was a line of 500+ people waiting for 2 straight days. As for earlier this year, when I was part-time student, I always buy the student pass at the dépanneur and always have 6 tickets (adult) with me so that I can use them when cops are around the metro.

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Old
05-06-2008, 05:44 PM
  #55
HabsoluteFate
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I'm sure you could get out of paying it...it all depends how much time you can put into it. I'm no lawyer so honestly what you do is your own decision in the end.

Theres someone i used to know that used to get caught for pretty much everything and managed to come out of most of them on top.

This might not apply to you but you could ask for a court date. I know that if you used to get caught speeding and went to the court and the cop didnt show up you automatically won...not sure if that applies to you ...(or still works)

One thing to remember is the lack of knowledge of the law is NOT a valid reason for being able to break it...(thats why its always important to know the law before travelling to another country!)

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Old
05-06-2008, 06:02 PM
  #56
Twisted Tales
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As I said earlier, I understand the fine and its law. What I do not understand is the amount I have to pay for something like that. It just doesn't make much sense.

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Old
05-06-2008, 07:36 PM
  #57
Megaforce
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Great thread. Here's what you should have done. Now, I assume the bus pass doesn't have your name and address on it. Therefore they wouldn't know your real identity.

If that's the case when they ask you for ID, tell them you don't have any. And when they ask your name, just make one up as well as a fake address. They're not allowed to search you for ID.

This practice works for all non-car tickets. It's ethical as far as I'm concerned because the tickets they give are often for ridiculous stuff, like not wearing a bicycle helmet or jaywalking.

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Old
05-06-2008, 07:44 PM
  #58
Travis Moen
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Originally Posted by Megaforce View Post
Great thread. Here's what you should have done. Now, I assume the bus pass doesn't have your name and address on it. Therefore they wouldn't know your real identity.

If that's the case when they ask you for ID, tell them you don't have any. And when they ask your name, just make one up as well as a fake address. They're not allowed to search you for ID.

This practice works for all non-car tickets. It's ethical as far as I'm concerned because the tickets they give are often for ridiculous stuff, like not wearing a bicycle helmet or jaywalking.
I once got a ticket for crossing the road on a red light as a pedestrian and they searched my wallet to find an ID.

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Old
05-06-2008, 07:51 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruins77 View Post
Ok. So this morning I walk inside the montreal metro with my student weekly pass (I am 19years old) and I am stopped by a cop. Basically, I am told that I am not allowed to have the student pass because I am 19 and that I should have the adult pass. Therefore, I receive a nice 214$ ticket. I just don't understand why so much for buying a student weekly pass. I am a student (college and stuff), and even if they have the right to fine me, which I assume they do, why that much? Isn't that the same amount as if I were to be speeding in a school zone or causing danger to the public? Anyways, any advice or similar problems.
Life is unfair. If that is your major stressor of the month life is great. Get a weekend McJob and pay the man. It won't be the last time. Basically you committed the equivalent of fraud. Try stealing $150. Be thankful a full cavity search wasn't involved.

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Old
05-06-2008, 08:17 PM
  #60
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In the city I live in you can purchase either an Adult, Post Secondary (University) or Youth (High School) pass. You can purchase at the Transit office or special Transit agent locations (drug stores, grocery stores etc.). If you go in and ask for a student pass they will sell you a youth pass. The person selling the pass doesn't care what/who they are selling to. As far as they are concerned I could be buying for my son/daughter. Many University students thinking they are clever usually go this route and hope they don't get detected to try and save a couple of bucks. Bottom line it is your responsibility to purchase the correct pass and if you are challenged then you have to produce the proper ID that if you have a youth (student) pass then you actually are considered that. No fines here, just asked to pay the difference in cash or vacate the bus.

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Old
05-06-2008, 08:21 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Bruins77 View Post
As I said earlier, I understand the fine and its law. What I do not understand is the amount I have to pay for something like that. It just doesn't make much sense.
Do you not understand how much adminstration is involved? Some one has to write the ticket, someone has to process the ticket, someone has to take your money etc. No different than having cable already in your house when you move in and call the cable company to turn on the switch. That will be $200 thank you.

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Old
05-06-2008, 08:57 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by lou4gehrig View Post
Just pay the fine. **** happens. Fines are used to pay for services and infrastructure that everybody uses, you, me everybody. If nobody paid the fines, then the taxes would be even higher. It's pretty simple. So basically you are rewarded for following the strict letter of the law as written. If you get caught once in awhile, oh well, that's just bad luck.
Fines are also used to pay for enforcement which then becomes a vicious circle. Not that I'm a fine anarchist but $214 seems pretty steep for a first offense and when the difference between a student and adult pass is so small anyways.

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Old
05-06-2008, 09:08 PM
  #63
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I got fined last August for putting a seat on the side of a bench in a bus at 3am, when I was bothering no one. Apparently, that gets you a bigger fine than if you're riding a bike in a metro station, endangering your life, and the life of others. Pigs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by transitguy View Post
Do you not understand how much adminstration is involved? Some one has to write the ticket, someone has to process the ticket, someone has to take your money etc. No different than having cable already in your house when you move in and call the cable company to turn on the switch. That will be $200 thank you.

Yeah it's called administration fee, which is added to the price of the ticket. For me it was 25 bucks. That's not why it's expensive.

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Originally Posted by Larionov View Post
As others have stated, you have nothing to lose by fighting it. Bring all the evidence you have, but don't take a hostile or argumentative tone. You want to convince the judge that this was just an honest mistake on your part. If you look sympathetic enough, you'll either get off the hook or your fine will be reduced substantially. Heck, look at the guy who posted here previously - he was offered a "plea bargain" before the court time when the prosecution was clearly in the wrong!

If none of this works, and you end up getting nailed for the full amount anyway, guess what? You will have the comfort of knowing that, between the court's time and the time for the inspector and prosecutor to show up, you ended up costing the system WAY more to collect this fine than it was worth to them.
Court cost would be an extra 100 bucks if he loses.

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Old
05-07-2008, 08:24 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Bruins77 View Post
Then they wonder why cops are killed and oil stations are blown up.
Cuz most cops with all due respect to the respectable ones, are egomaniac power junkies who only became cops in the first place so they could abuse the power they're given. They need to make traffic quotas and you get unfair tickets. They need to feel big, they go hassle some kids on the street corner who aren't doing anything wrong. They need a bust, they go to their local park and arrest some drunk teens. Why not try to find the drunk drivers? Why not try investigating murders, etc instead of wasting the publics time and tax dollars by arresting them and their children for stupid things like being in park after 12, or smoking a joint on a street corner. These people aren't hurting anybody, they might be doing something illegal but it isn't hurting anybody except maybe themselves. They could be outside bars waiting for drunk drivers to leave rather then waiting outside parks trying to find teens underage drinking to bust. I'm just saying, cops really have nothing better to do it seems then to hassle youth and try to act all big cause they're cops.

They fined this guy who is CLEARLY a college student cause he had a student pass, the guy is 19 for christs sake I don't think he's trying to scam the STM.

There's another government worker I detest, other then your very non-typical nice STM workers, the lot of them are typically *******s who thrive on nothing less than to piss off the customers who buy their passes and pay for their 60k a year salaries. You drive a bus all day and make a killing doing it, what do you have to complain about? Then they go on strike to make more money and make our taxes go up cause we have to pay these tools to do a job anybody with an IQ of 90 could do just by learning how to DRIVE for crying out loud. What about those metro workers who give out the tickets for 2.75 a shot, their lives must be so bad watching TV in their little booth making 60-70k a year. Then you go to get on a bus at lionel-groulx sometimes and they have a guy standing there to check if you have a student ID and if you don't he'll fine you, as if STM workers couldn't be bigger *******s they prove time and time again they can be.

So happy I got my license and car now so I never have to use an STM bus ever again cause those guys are typically the biggest **********.

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Old
05-07-2008, 11:33 AM
  #65
Vlad The Impaler
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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
So happy I got my license and car now so I never have to use an STM bus ever again cause those guys are typically the biggest **********.
On the flipside, instead of giving a 3-figure amount yearly to **********, you're going to spend a 4 or 5 figure amount to other kinds of **********. SAAQ, insurance guys, oil companies, car salesmen and the like are not much better than the booth guys. You may also have to deal with obnoxious booth guys of your own (parking booth guys are usually crooks and morons).

Also, just so you know, driving a bus at the STM isn't the dream job you make it out to be. You'll have to work years and years to get a nice stable day shift, making family life difficult. You also have to deal with some twisted, ****ed up individuals too. Your customers include drug addicts, vagrants, thieves, drunks, retarded teenagers and losers who haven't figured out you should take a bath every day, not every month. You have to drive those people and deal with mad drivers on the road.

We have a very affordable public transportation system in Montreal.

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Old
05-07-2008, 12:26 PM
  #66
PaulPosition
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Originally Posted by Vlad The Impaler View Post
On the flipside, instead of giving a 3-figure amount yearly to **********, you're going to spend a 4 or 5 figure amount to other kinds of **********. SAAQ, insurance guys, oil companies, car salesmen and the like are not much better than the booth guys. You may also have to deal with obnoxious booth guys of your own (parking booth guys are usually crooks and morons).

Also, just so you know, driving a bus at the STM isn't the dream job you make it out to be. You'll have to work years and years to get a nice stable day shift, making family life difficult. You also have to deal with some twisted, ****ed up individuals too. Your customers include drug addicts, vagrants, thieves, drunks, retarded teenagers and losers who haven't figured out you should take a bath every day, not every month. You have to drive those people and deal with mad drivers on the road.
Word!
Quote:
We have a very affordable public transportation system in Montreal.
errr... Very good, maybe, but affordable? When three-cars-per-household-City of Laval's is cheaper? In Kelowna, BC (what, 100k residents?) they've got busses with air conditioning and bike racks for half the price... Why those farmers are willing to pay taxes for buses and ********** city-slickers Montrealers wouldn't is beyond me, but there...

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Old
05-07-2008, 02:10 PM
  #67
Vlad The Impaler
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Word!

errr... Very good, maybe, but affordable? When three-cars-per-household-City of Laval's is cheaper? In Kelowna, BC (what, 100k residents?) they've got busses with air conditioning and bike racks for half the price... Why those farmers are willing to pay taxes for buses and ********** city-slickers Montrealers wouldn't is beyond me, but there...
Laval... I think they are smart. Not generous at all

The 25 cents less on individual fares (compared to Montreal) is absolutely symbolic and makes for good appearances. But when you look closer, their transport system is not cheaper. Less buses. Plus, you need to pay an extra 2.75 to get to the subway. So an individual ride is often longer and if you need to get to the subway, costs more.

But there's more. A monthly bus pass in Laval is 74.00 $. It gives you access to buses only, unless I am mistaken. In Montreal, the pass is 66.25$ and good for buses and the entire subway system.

For students, the difference is even higher and Montreal is much more affordable than Laval. And offers a much better service.

I wouldn't know about Kelowna, sorry. All I know is that for financing a flexible system with plenty of buses and a fairly large subway system, the monthly fee in Montreal is pretty nice

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Old
05-07-2008, 02:13 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Bruins77 View Post
The one thing I have a problem with is that he wrote the ticket on the turn-style while everyone passed. It is quite embarrassing.
when i got a ticket a few years ago the wanna-be cop shoved my arm because while i was answering her questions (which she refused to ask me in english) i was also on my cell.

then a few months later, i was waiting for the commuter train outside with a friend and i was taking my phone out of my pocket to check the time and i accidently dropped it in the tracks and it sank in the snow. so i stepped across the yellow line in order to pick up my phone and the STM cop was standing like 10 feet from me and saw me getting my phone out of the snow and he still gave me a ticket. its kinda funny though because this happened like 2 years ago and i sent in the ticket to contest it but they never sent me a court date so to this day i still wonder wwhat happened with it...

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05-07-2008, 02:28 PM
  #69
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I think the ammount is excessive. I've seen a few cases over the last few years where the police,specifically in montreal do things for the same reasons a dog licks his nuts, because they can.

All that being said, when I read or hear someone using' pigs' or talking about how all polioce, all tansit workers, all gov't workers, are whatever, I don't get any opinion on the people being referred to.

I do think less of whoever uses the term though.

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05-07-2008, 02:35 PM
  #70
PaulPosition
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Originally Posted by Vlad The Impaler View Post
... But when you look closer, their transport system is not cheaper. Less buses.
Well, of course you're right. It's gotta cost more : there's no one on the bus, compared to filled-to-capacity buses in Montreal. Do the maths (think economics of scale or whatever you call that in correct english). Yet the price (if you're only going around Laval) is, let's say, similar.

Is it all STM management, though? Perhaps not. Evil selfish people flee to Laval to escape taxes, yet they support paying for mass transit. Montrealers ***** about not finding parking places, coughing out their smogged-out summer, traffic jams but won't shed a cent and will collectively sue the government if it ever tried to change things.

Go figure.

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05-07-2008, 02:54 PM
  #71
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Here is a piece of advice for everyone.

Any time you have to deal with the government over a fine or charge or anything like that, be well warned.
The Government stand will be this " it's always up to the you to know the law. If your uncle Bob advised you and it turns out to be wrong your dead, but now the real kicker, if any government agent or worker gave you bad advice then your still in the wrong. Digest this info please, because it's really important. Government workers are allowed to make mistakes and simply give you the wrong advice and get off scott free, you will have to pay. Every Judge or deciding dept head will have to go by the actual LAW as it is written to the letter. Sure the idiot who gave you the bad advice gets a slap on the wrist but the bottom line is YOU PAY and that means $200 or $2000 bucks too bad on you. Now, right now your angry over $200 bucks, but be well warned, this could have been a ton worse like maybe build you house and then a mistake is discovered, the government plans given to you were wrong and now you are ordered to destroy the house you just built and move it to the right position. This did not happen to me, it's just an example but this has happened on occasion and the law is the law and thats it and thats what the Judge will say.

Private parties can always sue for damages but you can't sue the government because written right into the law is "it's always up to you to know the law" and that is the catch 22, get out of jail free card for the government.

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Old
05-07-2008, 03:00 PM
  #72
Vlad The Impaler
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Originally Posted by PaulPosition View Post
Well, of course you're right. It's gotta cost more : there's no one on the bus, compared to filled-to-capacity buses in Montreal. Do the maths (think economics of scale or whatever you call that in correct english). Yet the price (if you're only going around Laval) is, let's say, similar.

Is it all STM management, though? Perhaps not. Evil selfish people flee to Laval to escape taxes, yet they support paying for mass transit. Montrealers ***** about not finding parking places, coughing out their smogged-out summer, traffic jams but won't shed a cent and will collectively sue the government if it ever tried to change things.
I'm the kind of jaded individual who sees a lot of mispendings in public systems and government programs. I'm sure the STM could optimize things a little more with some work.

That being said, the STM is currently heavily funded by governments. It is apparently running at a deficit. Technically, a person with a monthly pass of $66.25 is not paying as much as he should.

I don't want to make it sound like it's a charity, though. Governments and municipalities know that public transport is an important component of the economy.

I'm definitly for improvements, though. I like what you had to say about Kelowna. Bike racks would be nice. That being said, I don't even know if I want to ride a bike in this ****ing mess of a city anymore. Car drivers are just too insane

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05-07-2008, 03:03 PM
  #73
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Well, everything I learned about how to deal with the law I learned from GTA...

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05-07-2008, 03:07 PM
  #74
wade
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RC51 View Post
Here is a piece of advice for everyone.

Any time you have to deal with the government over a fine or charge or anything like that, be well warned.
The Government stand will be this " it's always up to the you to know the law. If your uncle Bob advised you and it turns out to be wrong your dead, but now the real kicker, if any government agent or worker gave you bad advice then your still in the wrong. Digest this info please, because it's really important. Government workers are allowed to make mistakes and simply give you the wrong advice and get off scott free, you will have to pay. Every Judge or deciding dept head will have to go by the actual LAW as it is written to the letter. Sure the idiot who gave you the bad advice gets a slap on the wrist but the bottom line is YOU PAY and that means $200 or $2000 bucks too bad on you. Now, right now your angry over $200 bucks, but be well warned, this could have been a ton worse like maybe build you house and then a mistake is discovered, the government plans given to you were wrong and now you are ordered to destroy the house you just built and move it to the right position. This did not happen to me, it's just an example but this has happened on occasion and the law is the law and thats it and thats what the Judge will say.

Private parties can always sue for damages but you can't sue the government because written right into the law is "it's always up to you to know the law" and that is the catch 22, get out of jail free card for the government.
in short ignorance is not an excuse

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Old
07-26-2008, 05:07 PM
  #75
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Sorry for bumping this thread but I had a question after reading through this entire thread. I just got fined at Guy-Concordia metro for not having an up to date reduced fare card. I'm not sure whether to contest it or not as I think it just might be a waste of time. A lot of effort for nothing. I am 17 if that info is necessary.

I just hate these reduced far cards because they don't make any sense. I have all of the info saying I'm attending school and am under 18.

Also, the guy giving me the fine told me that my pass couldn't be used because I bought it in Beaconsfield. Apparently West Island bus passes cannot be used on the metro because they are not in the right zone. What I find stupid is that these passes still work at the metro and the only people with the info are the officers who give fines.

Can't the depanneur be to blame for not asking for my ID when I wanted to buy a card?

Mitch

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