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Retire Koivu's #

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Old
07-28-2008, 06:54 AM
  #51
Kikizaz
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i hope so.

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07-28-2008, 07:21 AM
  #52
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Nothing in his career to date would warrant that highest of honour.

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07-28-2008, 08:51 AM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Koivu84 View Post
Will Montreal retire Koivu's #

I hope they do, not only has he been a great player but he's shown so much adversity and inspired an entire league. god bless koivu.
Very few players have faced such adversity in such a small package as Saku. He is the ultimate warrior. He is what being a Hab is all about.

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07-28-2008, 09:22 AM
  #54
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Very few players have faced such adversity in such a small package as Saku. He is the ultimate warrior. He is what being a Hab is all about.
Man, I'm just gonna have to get me that avatar photoshopped somehow...


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07-28-2008, 10:56 AM
  #55
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I've said this before and i'll say it again ...

Retiring a jersey in Montreal is a GREATER honor than making it it to the Hall of Fame. Some teams retire players like Tie Domi and the like... we're not one of those teams.

There is simply no way in the world that Koivu will ever get into the hall of fame. He won't even get nominated. He will not even be considered. So how anyone can suggest he deserves to have his number retired with the likes of the rocket and the flower is totally beyond me.

Koivu was a good player, not great, a good player who led a very weak team through several injury riddled seasons.

His teams missed the playoffs more times than they made it, they never advanced passed the 2nd round other than one time, if memory serves me. He never led the league in any catagory, nor was he ever anywhere near the top ten (20? 50?) in scoring. Note that he played as a SCORING first line center. Also note that MOST of his carrear, he was OUTSCORED by his own teammates. Do we retire all of their numbers too??

Yes he does tons of charity work, and yes he beat cancer and yes he was the captain for a long time. But if we started retiring the numbers of players with such a mediocre history you'd quickly run out of numbers.

This just isn't going to happen folks.

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07-28-2008, 11:20 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by V-2 Schneider View Post
When he retires, the CH should rename the Beauchamp trophy and also a practice facility after him.If not that, then some community relations event or known program deserves his name on it.
I totally agree with you

he should have a trophy for dedication and leadership, something like that

not good enough to have his jersey retired

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07-28-2008, 11:56 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by V-2 Schneider View Post
When he retires, the CH should rename the Beauchamp trophy
Makes tons of sense....Rename a trophy invented for the memory of the sport journalist that is the father of all the journalists, a trophy given by journalists (see the trend here...) and one of the first journalists admitted in the hockey hall of fame. Like it or not, sports journalists covering the Habs are part of that heritage of ours....

Would also love to see and hear the buzz if they decide to rename the Jean Beliveau trophy for Saku for the community engagement.....'Cause Béliveau too was absolutely involved in the community. It's not because we weren't around that he didn't do anything....

Saku Koivu changed the life of the the General Hospital in Montreal with that foundation of his and the scanner that he helped buying. He should most definately have something named under his name over there. But the trophies we have here needs to stay. We're celebrating 100 years of hockey, how about we keep some of the names from the past....

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07-28-2008, 02:19 PM
  #58
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I feel bad for Bwoar, he so wanted to promote peace and harmony.

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07-28-2008, 02:38 PM
  #59
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Is there a trophy in the organization for leadership on and off the ice, implication to the commuynity and dedication to hockey?

A trophy like that could be named for saku

I'm not saying the Bell center should be renamed the saku koivu center lol

But I think he worth a honor, although not the supreme one of getting his number retired.

Maybe a section in the bell center; The Saku Koivu section...

btw I'm not a huge fan of him I just recognize what he did and is doing for this team....

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07-28-2008, 02:55 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CH4THECUP View Post
Is there a trophy in the organization for leadership on and off the ice, implication to the commuynity and dedication to hockey?

A trophy like that could be named for saku

I'm not saying the Bell center should be renamed the saku koivu center lol

But I think he worth a honor, although not the supreme one of getting his number retired.

Maybe a section in the bell center; The Saku Koivu section...

btw I'm not a huge fan of him I just recognize what he did and is doing for this team....
When Bouillon was given the Jean Béliveau trophy, here's the article about it.....

"Defenceman Francis Bouillon was honoured tonight before the Canadiens-Pittsburgh Penguins game with the Jean Béliveau Trophy, an award recognizing his community involvement.

The trophy's Hall of Fame, legendary namesake made the presentation.

From the team's news release:

The selection committee consisting of members of the Montreal Canadiens Children’s Foundation board of directors evaluated the candidates according to the effort, enthusiasm, implication and time invested in both collective and personal initiatives.

They were also evaluated on their commitment, leadership and financial assistance to the causes close to their heart.

That's about what you're looking for.

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07-28-2008, 02:57 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
When Bouillon was given the Jean Béliveau trophy, here's the article about it.....

"Defenceman Francis Bouillon was honoured tonight before the Canadiens-Pittsburgh Penguins game with the Jean Béliveau Trophy, an award recognizing his community involvement.

The trophy's Hall of Fame, legendary namesake made the presentation.

From the team's news release:

The selection committee consisting of members of the Montreal Canadiens Children’s Foundation board of directors evaluated the candidates according to the effort, enthusiasm, implication and time invested in both collective and personal initiatives.

They were also evaluated on their commitment, leadership and financial assistance to the causes close to their heart.

That's about what you're looking for.

Yes indeed thanks.

I barely had heard about this trophy...

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Old
07-28-2008, 03:22 PM
  #62
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does the NHL allow 3 numbers on the jersey ?? lets just start from 100 for the centennial and find every tom dick and harry who did anything of signifigance from numbers 1 to 99 and retire them this year. we can retire lemieux and gretzky just because nobody else should wear those numbers lets do turgeon for carrying the torch from the old forum we'll retire berezin for scoring the teams 10,000th goal (or whatever it was) we can retire sundin's 13 after this year (hehehe) surely we can find a legitimate excuse for the other 80 or so numbers ......

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07-28-2008, 03:27 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by CH4THECUP View Post
Yes indeed thanks.

I barely had heard about this trophy...
No prob. I really think that this is the trophy that fits Saku perfectly. I just don't think you can really take it away from a guy like Béliveau....But if there would not have been a trophy named, nobody could have be against a nomination like that.

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07-28-2008, 04:27 PM
  #64
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I don't understand the devotion some people feel for koivu really. Are we so starved for superstars in this city that we're ready to treat an ORDINARY hockey player as if he was a hockey god? It's starting to look that way.

He clearly means a lot to some people (for reasons I don't really understand), so have a Koivu day or something. You don't need to name an award after him (heck the guy never won any awards anyway), nor do you need to rename parts of the Bell center in his honor, he never brought any cups here. I really don't understand the seemingly inexplicable adoration he seems to inspire in some.

I suppose it has something to do with being starved for heros in this city over the past decade and a half, but really... I see us becoming another Toronto with this, they've been reduced to retiring the jersey of Tie domi for pete's sake. Is that really where we're headed? Let's get a grip people!

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07-28-2008, 05:19 PM
  #65
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I love Koivu and can't wait to see him hoist the Cup with the C on his chest, proving the doubters wrong, but...

#11 retired before #33? Never in a million years.

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Old
07-28-2008, 05:23 PM
  #66
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I do think Koivu needs to win a Cup.. but I have no problem retiring his jersey whatsoever if he finishes his career here.

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07-28-2008, 06:28 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by mabus View Post
I don't understand the devotion some people feel for koivu really. Are we so starved for superstars in this city that we're ready to treat an ORDINARY hockey player as if he was a hockey god? It's starting to look that way.

He clearly means a lot to some people (for reasons I don't really understand), so have a Koivu day or something. You don't need to name an award after him (heck the guy never won any awards anyway), nor do you need to rename parts of the Bell center in his honor, he never brought any cups here. I really don't understand the seemingly inexplicable adoration he seems to inspire in some.

I suppose it has something to do with being starved for heros in this city over the past decade and a half, but really... I see us becoming another Toronto with this, they've been reduced to retiring the jersey of Tie domi for pete's sake. Is that really where we're headed? Let's get a grip people!
mabus, is it that hard to figure out ? He has been a very good hockey player, respected on the world stage who never quite got to where he had hoped to. He played on some very average teams but managed to have a lot of 'moments' during the years that people remember.

What sets him apart is the courage he was able to show thru adversity. I doubt that you can find a poster on this board whose family has not been impacted by cancer. For a public figure to face what Koivu did and then not only return, but excel at a physically demanding profession, inspired a lot of people. It gives hope in some small way. One of our posters here has spoken about his own treatments and happily, his remission. I don't know him very well, but I'm pretty sure he thought often of Koivu over the last few years.

Then, Koivu figures, I was one of the lucky ones, the citry has been good to me and my family, I'll do what I can to pay it back.

So, no, Koivu won't equal Henri's record number of cups, he will never catch Jean Beliveau on the scoreboard, but he did inspire people and they feel the desire to recognize it.

Personally, I'm not for retiring his jersey, but it doesn't take me long to figure out why many others do.

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07-28-2008, 06:38 PM
  #68
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hellllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll lllllllllllll no.



Unless he brings the cup, which is the ultimate goal of that bloody game.

I like him, his heart and passion. I respect him a lot. But unless he brings the cup, I don't think they'll do it.

but he still has a couple more years to lift the cup, and I believe he will.

then, I don't care what he wants us to do with his jersey...

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07-28-2008, 10:30 PM
  #69
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he's a good player in all....but compare him the the guys who do have there jersey # retired...there no compareison

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07-29-2008, 07:33 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by newsylalonde100 View Post
he's a good player in all....but compare him the the guys who do have there jersey # retired...there no compareison
Doesn't it all become circumstantial ? Compare his game to Henri Richard's ? Koivu suffers from the era he played in, or the team he played on. I've always used Richard as a comparison as I believe the 2 have much in common in trems of style and temperment.

This 'bring the cup' stuff is just media fodder. Great players are part of great teams.

I think a time machine could've easily put him on some of the historic teams and he wouldn't have been out of place.

It can't happen though so he'll likely retire as an esteemed long serving dedicated player but a notch below the greats.

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07-29-2008, 08:32 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by mcphee View Post
mabus, is it that hard to figure out ? He has been a very good hockey player, respected on the world stage who never quite got to where he had hoped to. He played on some very average teams but managed to have a lot of 'moments' during the years that people remember.
So do lots of players, heck most players, but no one seriously suggests we should retire their numbers. I have lots of fond memories of Koivu to, It's not like I don't like the guy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcphee View Post
What sets him apart is the courage he was able to show thru adversity. I doubt that you can find a poster on this board whose family has not been impacted by cancer. For a public figure to face what Koivu did and then not only return, but excel at a physically demanding profession, inspired a lot of people. It gives hope in some small way. One of our posters here has spoken about his own treatments and happily, his remission. I don't know him very well, but I'm pretty sure he thought often of Koivu over the last few years.
And that's why we should retire his number???

Koivu has been an average hockey player on the ice, who beat cancer off the ice, and who has done charity work like most hockey players do. Admire him sure, respect him, have great memories of him. But definately do not retire his number.

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07-29-2008, 09:23 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by mabus View Post
So do lots of players, heck most players, but no one seriously suggests we should retire their numbers. I have lots of fond memories of Koivu to, It's not like I don't like the guy.



And that's why we should retire his number???

Koivu has been an average hockey player on the ice, who beat cancer off the ice, and who has done charity work like most hockey players do. Admire him sure, respect him, have great memories of him. But definately do not retire his number.
First off, I said I would lean against retiring his number. He has been much better than an average player, but he has never appraoched superstar level. I don't think that can be argued. He has been a highly regarded player in both the NHL and int'l stage. Sadly he'll retire with a 'what could have been' stigma, but he isn't the 1st or last in that situation.

You wondered why he was held in such high regard and I thought I explained why it was easy why many had an emotional connection to him. Still, I wouldn't retire his jersey as I've said before, but I think there should be a way of honoring his time in Mtl.

Since the universal draft, and players became simply winter residents, how many have a long term connection with the city ? In any sport ?

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07-29-2008, 12:30 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by mabus View Post
I don't understand the devotion some people feel for koivu really. Are we so starved for superstars in this city that we're ready to treat an ORDINARY hockey player as if he was a hockey god? It's starting to look that way.

He clearly means a lot to some people (for reasons I don't really understand), so have a Koivu day or something. You don't need to name an award after him (heck the guy never won any awards anyway), nor do you need to rename parts of the Bell center in his honor, he never brought any cups here. I really don't understand the seemingly inexplicable adoration he seems to inspire in some.

I suppose it has something to do with being starved for heros in this city over the past decade and a half, but really... I see us becoming another Toronto with this, they've been reduced to retiring the jersey of Tie domi for pete's sake. Is that really where we're headed? Let's get a grip people!
I really hope we would stop thinking that bringing a cup is the difference between a great hockey to a not-so great one....Ed Ronan won a cup.....I do not believe in retiring his jersey but again, don't fell in the trap that it's always black and white around here. If you don't want his jersey to be retire, you obviously hate the guy. Or since his jersey shouldn't be retire, we should just forget he existed....There has to be a middle ground here and if the Beliveau trophy was not named Beliveau, please tell me how he doesn't exemplify what the trophy is all about. Community involvement, effort, enthusiasm, implication and time investment, commitment, leadership and financial contribution. The guy just started a foundation for a really important scanner at the General Hospital in Montreal. Not only are we going to remember what he had to go through in his career in Montreal but he was also honored at the NHL Level.

But then do you really rename a trophy that was named after an all-great like Jean??? Maybe. Not sure though, 'cause Béliveau did things of his own during the time he played and even after.

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Old
07-29-2008, 12:39 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
I really hope we would stop thinking that bringing a cup is the difference between a great hockey to a not-so great one....Ed Ronan won a cup.....I do not believe in retiring his jersey but again, don't fell in the trap that it's always black and white around here. If you don't want his jersey to be retire, you obviously hate the guy. Or since his jersey shouldn't be retire, we should just forget he existed....There has to be a middle ground here and if the Beliveau trophy was not named Beliveau, please tell me how he doesn't exemplify what the trophy is all about. Community involvement, effort, enthusiasm, implication and time investment, commitment, leadership and financial contribution. The guy just started a foundation for a really important scanner at the General Hospital in Montreal. Not only are we going to remember what he had to go through in his career in Montreal but he was also honored at the NHL Level.

But then do you really rename a trophy that was named after an all-great like Jean??? Maybe. Not sure though, 'cause Béliveau did things of his own during the time he played and even after.
You can't take away the name of Jean Béliveau off this trophy...

A béliveau/Koivu trophy?

Can we all agree that he is a HOF?

why not do as the leafs have done with gilmour?

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07-29-2008, 12:43 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by CH4THECUP View Post
You can't take away the name of Jean Béliveau off this trophy...
I know. That's my point. Still people cannot say that Koivu doesn't have those qualities.

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