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OT - Who are the best NHLers? (born in Quebec). YOUR top 10-20 list. And...

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Old
07-29-2008, 04:01 AM
  #51
yannick
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Top 10

1- Martin Brodeur 968 2.20 .913

2- Vincent Lecavalier 710 273 329 602

3- Roberto Luongo 490 2.60 .919

4- Alex Tanguay 609 177 362 539

5- Martin St. Louis 608 208 297 505

6- Daniel Briere 562 193 255 448

7- Simon Gagne 527 208 202 410

8- Mike Ribeiro 433 95 200 295

9- Paul Stastny 148 52 97 149

10- Philippe Boucher 707 91 200 291


Top 10 to 20


11- Patrice Bergeron 239 72 117 189

12- Pierre-Marc Bouchard 354 61 160 221

13- Francois Beauchemin 226 17 68 85

14- J.P. Dumont 596 171 223 394

15- Marc-Andre Bergeron 267 48 80 128

16- Antoine Vermette 297 71 68 139

17- Jason Pominville 222 79 99 178

18- Matthew Lombardi 297 56 81 137

19- Stephane Robidas 489 27 82 109

20- Kris Letang 70 8 11 19

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Old
07-29-2008, 08:15 AM
  #52
Joe Cole
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slick Nick View Post
You're pretty much the only one who thinks Bouillon's not a québecois.

I wonder why you think that way...
Don't wonder. Read his birth certificate. Nothing more.

Why does everyone want to deny that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by znk View Post
Well if I was him I'd be insulted that you decided I wasnt Québécois for me.
You are not him. You would be insulted because if you are Quebecois.

Like I said, it is ok to be another nationality.


Last edited by Beakermania*: 07-29-2008 at 01:06 PM.
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Old
07-29-2008, 01:45 PM
  #53
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Bouillion cannot play for Team Quebec if one was ever made, he cannot tranfer from Team USA.

Same with Stasny....

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Old
07-29-2008, 02:11 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
Bernier is way too high, I'd put PM Bouchard ahead of him and move him down...
Dupuis is also too high....

You are also missing a bunch of guys... Beauchemin, Briere, Pominville, Dumont, Robidas, these guys are all above Dupuis and Bernier IMO...
agree. Bernier is really overrated over here..

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Old
07-29-2008, 03:49 PM
  #55
Slick Nick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
Don't wonder. Read his birth certificate. Nothing more.

Why does everyone want to deny that?
Read mine: I was born in the USSR, a country that no longer exists.. what am I? an alien or something? Can I pretend to be either canadian or québecois or should I claim that I'm an ex-ussrian? What if someone's born on a ship in the middle of the ocean... what is he, an international waters citizen? or a fish maybe? A brazilian because the ship is from Brazil? Birth certificates do not equal nationality/ethnicity..

Stop embarrassing yourself Joe...

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Old
07-29-2008, 05:56 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
Don't wonder. Read his birth certificate. Nothing more.

Why does everyone want to deny that?


That's one of the dumbest things I've read. I guess Kolzig is South African then!

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Old
07-29-2008, 06:02 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
Don't wonder. Read his birth certificate. Nothing more.

Why does everyone want to deny that?



You are not him. You would be insulted because if you are Quebecois.

Like I said, it is ok to be another nationality.
It's ok to be an other nationality. And I'd be pissed off you don't consider me a Québécois either way.

"I'm sorry Fank but you arent Québécois enough for me."
That's what you're saying and I think that's an insult and a sad statement. The day people start thinking that way....I guess he's not pure laine enough for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
Bouillion cannot play for Team Quebec if one was ever made, he cannot tranfer from Team USA.

Same with Stasny....
I dont think this thread is about team Québec.
and following that logic anyone who played for team Canada could not transfert to team Quebec?


Last edited by Beakermania*: 07-29-2008 at 11:26 PM.
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Old
07-29-2008, 11:26 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by znk View Post
I dont think this thread is about team Québec.
and following that logic anyone who played for team Canada could not transfert to team Quebec?
That would be different... it would be like players who previously played for the soviet union... they were allowed to play for team russia or team lithunia or team ukraine or whatever team they chose because those teams came out of the USSR which broke up.

If Quebec broke up from Canada, then all the Team Canada players would be able to choose if they wanted to play for Team Canada or Team Quebec... however a player who previously played for Team USA (which had no role in the seperation of Quebec from Canada) could NOT turn around and suddenly choose to play for Quebec.

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Old
07-29-2008, 11:28 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slick Nick View Post
Dandy has a twin?????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????

Imagine a Dandenault-Dandenault paring.. damn, that would suck ... but.. how entertaining.
We could call it "Dandenault"

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Old
07-29-2008, 11:32 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
That would be different... it would be like players who previously played for the soviet union... they were allowed to play for team russia or team lithunia or team ukraine or whatever team they chose because those teams came out of the USSR which broke up.

If Quebec broke up from Canada, then all the Team Canada players would be able to choose if they wanted to play for Team Canada or Team Quebec... however a player who previously played for Team USA (which had no role in the seperation of Quebec from Canada) could NOT turn around and suddenly choose to play for Quebec.
You know this is not going to happen....
Oddly, I am currently re-re-reading the re Secession of Quebec for work.

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Old
07-29-2008, 11:41 PM
  #61
Slick Nick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
If Quebec broke up from Canada, then all the Team Canada players would be able to choose if they wanted to play for Team Canada or Team Quebec... however a player who previously played for Team USA (which had no role in the seperation of Quebec from Canada) could NOT turn around and suddenly choose to play for Quebec.
Unless he'd be granted Quebec's citizenship... which did not exist at the time the decison was made to play for team USA. We can't be sure about anything since there's no precedent yet. Also, if I'm not mistaken, a player that has played 4 years in another country can ask for a change of national team.. this was the big issue with Nabokov (played Kazakhstan in WJC) than asked to play for Russia... I might be worng on the number of years, but I'm pretty sure that if you've resided in a country long enough you can represent it even if you played for an other country before.

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Old
07-30-2008, 05:41 AM
  #62
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Wow! Getting a headache from all this!!

Now... let's all do a "best players from Ontario" list!!




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Old
07-30-2008, 09:12 AM
  #63
Joe Cole
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Sorry for long post but I need to explain myself better

Quote:
Originally Posted by znk View Post
It's ok to be an other nationality. And I'd be pissed off you don't consider me a Québécois either way.

"I'm sorry Fank but you arent Québécois enough for me."
That's what you're saying and I think that's an insult and a sad statement. The day people start thinking that way....I guess he's not pure laine enough for you.



I dont think this thread is about team Québec.
and following that logic anyone who played for team Canada could not transfert to team Quebec?
I think I totally messed this up, because no one got my point. I will put all my cards on the table.

I think that talking about a Team Quebec is divisive. We are still one country, from coast to coast, and until we are no longer a country, talking about a team within a team is only a way to exclude our fellow countrymen. My belief is that we are all still a team, until we are not.

Bring up the whole Scottish/Ireland/England example if you want, that is them. We have always played as Team Canada, nothing else.

As for Frank not being pur laine or not.... honestly... I think that concept is, by design, divisive as well. I am born here in Quebec from European parents, and I have often been told that I am not Quebecois Pur Laine.

Yet those same people who would say that I am not Quebecois are the first ones to INCLUDE folks who do not have French parents, or are born in other areas if it suits their needs, for example if they are a good hockey player.

An example, Roberto Luongo. I am certain that he was called a "cr1sse de w0p" or "maund1t anglais a mard3" in his everyday life (before he was a star), and on the ice. I know I did, more times then you could think, and I share the same background as he does. Yet, the same folks who called him that are the first ones to make "a Team Quebec" and include him as a good ol' Quebecois because now, it suits them. "He's a Quebecois!" But his brother, talking the bus in St. Leo.... he is a w0p. That is the hypocritical thing about all that "pur laine" stuff.

That is my baggage. I admit it. It pisses me off that I am often considered an uninvited guest in the place where I was born.

As for Slick Nick and me embarrassing myself... maybe so. But your post does reflect you getting my point. You said "Birth certificates do not equal nationality/ethnicity.. " I agree 100%, but it does equate to what team you can internationality play for. That's all. (p.s. If you are born on a Brazilian boat, dude, you are Brazilian, that's the rule. It does not dictate your ethnicity.)


You for example, born in USSR. You may be Russian, Ukrainian, etc. I do not know. When the USSR dissolved, I have no clue what they did with the existing birth certificates. To me, if you came to Canada and applied for citizenship, brother, you are a Canadian. I do not buy into that whole divisive pur laine/exclusionary idea.

The point was we can call Boillion Quebecois, but he was born in the US. I am not sure what his official nationality is... he may have dual, he may have American, or he may have applied for Canadian status. I assume he is a dual citizen, but when you play for one country internationally, the general rule is you remain a player for that country.

So in a nutshell, my posts where not to piss anyone off or embarrass myself, they were to share my opinion that the whole "pur laine" or Team Quebec idea divides us, it does not bring us together.

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Old
07-30-2008, 12:05 PM
  #64
Slick Nick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
I think I totally messed this up, because no one got my point. I will put all my cards on the table.

I think that talking about a Team Quebec is divisive. We are still one country, from coast to coast, and until we are no longer a country, talking about a team within a team is only a way to exclude our fellow countrymen. My belief is that we are all still a team, until we are not.

Bring up the whole Scottish/Ireland/England example if you want, that is them. We have always played as Team Canada, nothing else.

As for Frank not being pur laine or not.... honestly... I think that concept is, by design, divisive as well. I am born here in Quebec from European parents, and I have often been told that I am not Quebecois Pur Laine.

Yet those same people who would say that I am not Quebecois are the first ones to INCLUDE folks who do not have French parents, or are born in other areas if it suits their needs, for example if they are a good hockey player.

An example, Roberto Luongo. I am certain that he was called a "cr1sse de w0p" or "maund1t anglais a mard3" in his everyday life (before he was a star), and on the ice. I know I did, more times then you could think, and I share the same background as he does. Yet, the same folks who called him that are the first ones to make "a Team Quebec" and include him as a good ol' Quebecois because now, it suits them. "He's a Quebecois!" But his brother, talking the bus in St. Leo.... he is a w0p. That is the hypocritical thing about all that "pur laine" stuff.

That is my baggage. I admit it. It pisses me off that I am often considered an uninvited guest in the place where I was born.

As for Slick Nick and me embarrassing myself... maybe so. But your post does reflect you getting my point. You said "Birth certificates do not equal nationality/ethnicity.. " I agree 100%, but it does equate to what team you can internationality play for. That's all. (p.s. If you are born on a Brazilian boat, dude, you are Brazilian, that's the rule. It does not dictate your ethnicity.)


You for example, born in USSR. You may be Russian, Ukrainian, etc. I do not know. When the USSR dissolved, I have no clue what they did with the existing birth certificates. To me, if you came to Canada and applied for citizenship, brother, you are a Canadian. I do not buy into that whole divisive pur laine/exclusionary idea.

The point was we can call Boillion Quebecois, but he was born in the US. I am not sure what his official nationality is... he may have dual, he may have American, or he may have applied for Canadian status. I assume he is a dual citizen, but when you play for one country internationally, the general rule is you remain a player for that country.

So in a nutshell, my posts where not to piss anyone off or embarrass myself, they were to share my opinion that the whole "pur laine" or Team Quebec idea divides us, it does not bring us together.
First of all:

Quote:
Responding to Nabokov's case, the IIHF changed their rules in 2003. They said that any player who plays for 4 years in a given country where he is a citizen can change his nationality in international hockey play.
http://puckstopshere.blogspot.com/20...v-mistake.html

This means Bouillon could technically play for Canada. For your info, Bouillon was automatically eligible for the canadian citizenship since he was born from canadian parents. For exemple I was granted the canadian citizenship at the age of three (my mom is canadian), although we lived in the USSR till I was 9.

I don't think talking about players from Quebec is in any way devisive. I'm not sure you would've had the same reaction if a thread was started on the Leafs board about ontarian players. What makes this thread hostile and devisive are comments like yours which imply that the québecois are a bunch of ultranationalistic racists... we could use the reverse argumment aswell, how many french people have been told that they're stupid frogs but wasn't Mario Lemieux a great canadian player?

As for you not feeling at home in your native province... well, last time I went in your own Pierrefonds to attend the canadiens rookie camp, I ordered a "patates frites" at the arena's resto and was answered: sorry I don't understand french.. felt a little weird frankly... it's all a matter of perspectives I guess.

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Old
07-30-2008, 01:03 PM
  #65
Joe Cole
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slick Nick View Post
First of all:



http://puckstopshere.blogspot.com/20...v-mistake.html

This means Bouillon could technically play for Canada. For your info, Bouillon was automatically eligible for the canadian citizenship since he was born from canadian parents. For exemple I was granted the canadian citizenship at the age of three (my mom is canadian), although we lived in the USSR till I was 9.

I don't think talking about players from Quebec is in any way devisive. I'm not sure you would've had the same reaction if a thread was started on the Leafs board about ontarian players. What makes this thread hostile and devisive are comments like yours which imply that the québecois are a bunch of ultranationalistic racists... we could use the reverse argumment aswell, how many french people have been told that they're stupid frogs but wasn't Mario Lemieux a great canadian player?

As for you not feeling at home in your native province... well, last time I went in your own Pierrefonds to attend the canadiens rookie camp, I ordered a "patates frites" at the arena's resto and was answered: sorry I don't understand french.. felt a little weird frankly... it's all a matter of perspectives I guess.

1-Citizenship... ok, you win. The debate is not worth it.
2-Regarding "imply that the québecois are a bunch of ultranationalistic racists"- I never said that, and did not mean to imply it. P.S. I am married into a unilingual french family and live in french. Your comment about me was unwarranted.
3-Pierrefonds = saleswoman from Eaton's arguement. Give that one a rest. It is old. I can say the same for the girl who served me at a pastry shop at Place Versaille who did not know what a chocolate croissant was... until I said "croissant au chocolate." Everyone who works in the service industry should be able to serve clients in both french and english. At the very least, they should be civil.

Even after I apologized, you still pee'd on me twice (that I was being divisive, and the Pierrefonds).

Once again, I did not mean to cross a line. Accept my apology.

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