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Montreal - Edmonton - Chicago

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Old
08-22-2008, 07:18 PM
  #51
massivegoonery
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While Gilbert may be a better player than Byfuglien (debateable), he is far less valuable because he is much more replaceable. There's nobody even remotely comparable to him in the league.

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08-22-2008, 08:47 PM
  #52
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MTL offers Dandenault and asks for nothing in return. How about that for value!

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Old
08-22-2008, 09:03 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Cao View Post
Chicago gets bent over, violated, thrown into a pool of acid, then taken out and doused with vinegar and salt.
actually chicago gets the best deal out of this.

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Old
08-22-2008, 09:57 PM
  #54
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I think we can all agree that none of the fan bases are liking this trade save a good percentage of Montreal fans, but even that's not 100%.

Edmonton loses one of their key d-men to be replaced by an oft injured and yet another d-man prospect(as if the ones currently in the systme weren't enough)

Chicago gives up 2 pieces...granted one is more important than the other. While gaining a good solid d-man back it's not enough for their team to compensate for the loss of the big B.

Montreal loses a good prospect, but gains more than they lose in the eyes of most fans.

This trade really only helps one team. Therefore it's logical to say Neither Edmonton nor Chicago do it.

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Old
08-23-2008, 09:57 AM
  #55
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Only teams that have played against byfulien know the huge potential he has. Scores key goals, lays down big hits, screens goalie, and is as smooth with the puck as a forward 100 less pounds than him. Ive seen every just about every hawk game, and have never seen a player like him. Next time your team plays the hawks pay attention to this guy and you'l see the same.

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Old
08-23-2008, 12:06 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Piffle View Post
Hmm, Hawks give up the best 2 players in this deal IMO. Noooo thanks. Dustin Byfuglien is going to be an awesome top 6 forward in this league. He has awesome hands and is built like a linebacker. Once he adjusts completely to playing forward, he'll be a 30-30 guy. I'm expecting 30 goals this year actually.
Hows the weather in fantasy land? No way Byfuglien will be a top 6 forward. A great 3rd liner who is an effective checker that provides some secondary scoring? Yes.

Tom Gilbert is the best player in this proposal. He is signed long term. We can go after the oft injured Havlat like all the other 29 teams at season's end. Why would we trade one of the major parts of our d corps for years to come for him.

No thanks.

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08-23-2008, 01:18 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by jet228 View Post
Hows the weather in fantasy land? No way Byfuglien will be a top 6 forward. A great 3rd liner who is an effective checker that provides some secondary scoring? Yes.

Tom Gilbert is the best player in this proposal. He is signed long term. We can go after the oft injured Havlat like all the other 29 teams at season's end. Why would we trade one of the major parts of our d corps for years to come for him.

No thanks.
Byfuglien scored 19 goals in 67 games last season playing half the year as a defencemen and in his first real year in the NHL. It is not unlikely that in a few years he could be putting up 30 goal seasons.

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Old
08-23-2008, 01:35 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Zim View Post
Byfuglien scored 19 goals in 67 games last season playing half the year as a defencemen and in his first real year in the NHL. It is not unlikely that in a few years he could be putting up 30 goal seasons.
IMO this year will really expose whether Buff has true power forward star potential or not. If he can approach 20 goals again I would be more than prepared to reassess my opinion of his potential.

Either way, Gilbert is showing that he is a complete tool defenceman, and he is locked up. Its well known that top defencemen are more valueable than top forwards (other than elite) because they are harder to come by.

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Old
08-23-2008, 02:20 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by jet228 View Post
IMO this year will really expose whether Buff has true power forward star potential or not. If he can approach 20 goals again I would be more than prepared to reassess my opinion of his potential.

Either way, Gilbert is showing that he is a complete tool defenceman, and he is locked up. Its well known that top defencemen are more valueable than top forwards (other than elite) because they are harder to come by.
I would argue that top forwards with Byfuglien's package of size and skill are just as rare as top defencemen.

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Old
08-23-2008, 03:09 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Corgidequebec View Post
Montreal gets: Jean-Francois Jacques and Dustin Byfuglien
Edmonton gets: Martin Havlat and PK Subban
Chicago gets: Tom Gilbert and Mathieu Dandenault
why are there so many offers involving PK Subban Habs better not trade him he can be on their 2nd lin atleast within the next 4 seasons

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Old
08-23-2008, 04:04 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by duncanmac12 View Post
why are there so many offers involving PK Subban Habs better not trade him he can be on their 2nd lin atleast within the next 4 seasons
Just a guess here, but perhaps the OP included Subban so it didn't look like the Habs were giving up absolutely nothing to get everything? He is after all the ONLY thing of value coming out of Montreal in this deal.

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Old
08-23-2008, 08:52 PM
  #62
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Nice to see so many underestimate Byfuglien, if Gilbert is better than he, it's a MARGINAL better. Lest we forget this is also Gilbert's second full season coming up as well as Byfuglien's, so the whole point for we'll see how he is this coming season goes for Gilbert too.

Byfuglien is a super rare raw talent that Chicago would be absolutely stupid to give up in this deal, especially for Gilbert, who though is very good, is not needed whatsoever in Chicago right now, especially with Keith and Seabrook in town, not to mention obviously Campbell, but the first two because they're better all around.

Dandenault is a waste of skin for Havlat, even with Havlat's injury prone status, i'd rather take some 2nd rounders for Havlat.

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Old
08-23-2008, 09:34 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sponge Joni View Post
Oilers lose a top 4 Dman and gain another <injury prone> forward ..
CHI gains yet another Dman while losing 2 top6 forwards
MTL gets a top 6 forwards.. an AHLer + cap room for people they have no room for.
I said value wise. I know all the points you made are legit, that is why I said it will never happen.

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Old
08-24-2008, 10:16 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Cao View Post
Well, like I said before, Byfuglien has already shown a dominant power forward game that rivals that of Eric Lindros (in my opinion, I've seen Byfuglien be an absolute beast against the Canucks and I can only think of Eric Lindros as a comparison and maybe Todd Bertuzzi). He has immense potential, and what's better is that he can be a defenseman as well.

Gilbert just doesn't bring as big of a package. I mean, he's a good defenseman, but nothing that I've seen him do screams out "impact player".

There is no way he rivals one of the most dominate big men to ever play the game. I think Byfuglien has some great hands, but at best he's a small upgrade on Dustin Penner. 30/30 will likely be his ceiling.

I don't foresee any Hart nominations or Art Ross Trophy's in his future.

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Old
08-24-2008, 12:12 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davegagnerskid View Post
There is no way he rivals one of the most dominate big men to ever play the game. I think Byfuglien has some great hands, but at best he's a small upgrade on Dustin Penner. 30/30 will likely be his ceiling.

I don't foresee any Hart nominations or Art Ross Trophy's in his future.
Even if 30/30 is his ceiling (and that's debatable), that's still worth more to the Hawks than Gilbert would be. And Byfuglien's athleticism is much more dynamic than Penner IMO.

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Old
08-24-2008, 01:26 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by hawksfan79 View Post
Even if 30/30 is his ceiling (and that's debatable), that's still worth more to the Hawks than Gilbert would be. And Byfuglien's athleticism is much more dynamic than Penner IMO.
Atheletisism aside, both Penner and Buff play the same game. Big guys, dominate down low and have soft hands. Byfuglien just seems more interesting because of switch to forward from D. Penner upside is 30-35 goals 30-35 assists.

Both suffer from weight issues, but if I had to choose between the two I'd take your guy, but not at the expense of Gilbert that's for sure.

All in all. The trade proposal does nothing for the Hawks or the Oil so a pass from me as well.

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Old
08-24-2008, 03:00 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by davegagnerskid View Post
Atheletisism aside, both Penner and Buff play the same game. Big guys, dominate down low and have soft hands. Byfuglien just seems more interesting because of switch to forward from D. Penner upside is 30-35 goals 30-35 assists.

Both suffer from weight issues, but if I had to choose between the two I'd take your guy, but not at the expense of Gilbert that's for sure.

All in all. The trade proposal does nothing for the Hawks or the Oil so a pass from me as well.
I'm not sure I agree that they play the same style of game. Buff isn't as good in the corners as Penner and doesn't have as much experience in front of the net yet. But Buff carries the puck much better than Penner does IMO. He has a lot of the skills that some smaller, finesse type players have while adding a lot of power forward elements also to his game. You don't usually see 240 pound guys finessing the puck into the zone and carrying it a lot like Buff does.

This trade, like so many others here, will never happen because both teams have a gem of a player and want to see how they develop.

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Old
08-25-2008, 01:28 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Piffle View Post
I'm not sure I agree that they play the same style of game. Buff isn't as good in the corners as Penner and doesn't have as much experience in front of the net yet. But Buff carries the puck much better than Penner does IMO. He has a lot of the skills that some smaller, finesse type players have while adding a lot of power forward elements also to his game. You don't usually see 240 pound guys finessing the puck into the zone and carrying it a lot like Buff does.

This trade, like so many others here, will never happen because both teams have a gem of a player and want to see how they develop.
I was surprised with Penner's puck possesion this year and his ability to make small one touch passes that one wouldn't normally associate with a power forward either. I know it's not his strongest asset, but he does bring more to the table than a large net presence.

Penner is good in the corners when he has the puck, but his strong suit definately isn't puck retireval. I find he tip toes to the corner like a 2 yr old kid on glass when it's going to involve a 50/50 chance that he's going to get the puck. This is the one of the two sore spots that I would like to see DP improve upon. The second being a bit of a mean streak. For a big guy he plays soft. Sorta like the Stay Puff Marshmellow Man with soft hands, surprising speed and a heavy shot.

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Old
08-25-2008, 01:34 AM
  #69
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Habs gets J-F Jacques and Byfuglien for an O.K. D prospect (have A LOT) and a salary dump ?



count me in!

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Old
08-25-2008, 09:40 AM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corgidequebec View Post
Montreal gets: Jean-Francois Jacques and Dustin Byfuglien
Edmonton gets: Martin Havlat and PK Subban
Chicago gets: Tom Gilbert and Mathieu Dandenault
Montreal gives up just Subban and Dandenault and ends up with Byfuglien and JF-Jacques?

Sounds good on their end!

However, as much as a I like Tom Gilbert, I think Chicago losing Havlat and Byfuglien and gaining just GIlbert and Dandy isn't a very good deal on their end, despite their need to shed salary.

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Old
08-25-2008, 09:43 AM
  #71
FerrisRox
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Originally Posted by jet228 View Post
Hows the weather in fantasy land? No way Byfuglien will be a top 6 forward. A great 3rd liner who is an effective checker that provides some secondary scoring? Yes.
Do you even watch hockey?!?

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