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Old
08-24-2008, 08:55 PM
  #1
Tripod
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Leafs-Flyers

To Flyers-Toskala, Kaberle, Antropov

To Leafs-Biron, Carter, Knuble, Parent

So for Toronto...Get their 1st line centre,
get another young shutdown D-Man
In Knuble and Biron they get 2 contracts that expire(freeing up
Money to go after free agents and having 2 tradable commodities
at the trade deadline

For the Flyers:...Get #2 D-man
Get Third line Center...replacing Carter in position...not talent
Get an upgrade in Goal who is signed

So Flyers would have: Toronto: Poni Carter Blake
Hagman Stajan Steen
Hartnell Briere Gagne Tlusty Grabovski Knuble
Lupul Richards Giroux Bell Moore Mayers
Downie Antropov Upshall
Cote Metropolit Asham

Timonen Coburn McCabe(for now) Kubina
Kaberle Jones Finger Stralman
Eminger Vaananen Parent Colaiacovo

Toskala Biron, Joseph
Nitty

We all know that there was a deal for Carter +1st for Kaberle. But this was before Carter started to break out. But by adding Parent (like a 1st) it makes up the difference in goal and the value today of Kabs and Carter. The Antro and Knuble is pretty much a wash (both UFA) but gives the Flyers a replacement for Carter and he can move up if injuries occur or if a player is not ready(Giroux or Downie) This deal also gives Philly an extra $1.855 in cap space to add a depth forward if they feel they need it.

Toronto get 2 players to build with and then can turn Biron and Knuble into 1-2 younger players and picks at the deadline...they helping rebuild quicker. Then they have 6 mill available with this deal to add a FA if they choose to.

So let the bashing begin...keep in mind...this is my first post.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:18 PM
  #2
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Since when Toskala is better then Biron?????????

A deal was in place for Kabs before Carter accelerated in his development and replaced Richards who was injured.

Too many players involved and I do not like it. Flyers should not help the Leafs to rebuild.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Since when Toskala is better then Biron?????????
umm. toskala is a damn good goalie. I like biron but id rather have toskala

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Since when Toskala is better then Biron?????????
Since he became a Leaf.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Since when Toskala is better then Biron?????????
Toskala > Biron in my books....not by much but he's a better tender

and Philly gets hosed in this one

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:23 PM
  #6
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Originally Posted by chromemaro View Post
umm. toskala is a damn good goalie. I like biron but id rather have toskala
Why is he better again? I need explanation here. Because he had a good run in SJ? Once?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZDH View Post
Toskala > Biron in my books....not by much but he's a better tender

and Philly gets hosed in this one
Fair enough.. Keep your books and we will keep ours.

Toskala is not better then Biron.

Antropov is just too damn injury prone had one good season in 8 something NHL years. Rather have Knuble for another year then Antropov for one year.

Trading Carter and Parent for Kabs who is one hell of a player is not something I would be interested in.


Last edited by Kaktus*: 08-24-2008 at 09:30 PM.
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Old
08-24-2008, 09:27 PM
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If I thought Toskala was better I would think it's a good deal. He's a good goalie and I think he's better than Biron, but not enough to justify that kind of move.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:30 PM
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Huh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZDH View Post
Toskala > Biron in my books....not by much but he's a better tender

and Philly gets hosed in this one
So You say Toskala>Biron
Kaberle has > trade value than Carter
Antropov>=Knuble
...so then Parent is there to even things out ...AND Philly frees up almost 2 mill to sign a player if they choose...like Shanny for example to play PP minutes and to score in a shoot-out once in awhile.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripod View Post
So You say Toskala>Biron
Kaberle has > trade value than Carter
Antropov>=Knuble
...so then Parent is there to even things out ...AND Philly frees up almost 2 mill to sign a player if they choose...like Shanny for example to play PP minutes and to score in a shoot-out once in awhile.
Flyers need PP help? Since when?

All those trades just to sign Shanny?

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELab2 View Post
If I thought Toskala was better I would think it's a good deal. He's a good goalie and I think he's better than Biron, but not enough to justify that kind of move.
If you take out the goaltenders, it makes more sense.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:32 PM
  #11
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Kaberle is not necessarily better than Carter at this point. Philly obviously says no anyways.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:36 PM
  #12
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Philly gets beat big time in that deal

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:41 PM
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ELab2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercury View Post
If you take out the goaltenders, it makes more sense.
I don't agree with that. Toskala for Biron straight up is a trade I would very likely make.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:41 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Since when Toskala is better then Biron?????????

A deal was in place for Kabs before Carter accelerated in his development and replaced Richards who was injured.

Too many players involved and I do not like it. Flyers should not help the Leafs to rebuild.
It's a pretty common opinion, I think.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:43 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Flyers need PP help? Since when?

All those trades just to sign Shanny?
Not at all. It makes the D MUCH better...goaltending upgraded a bit and signed for 1 extra year compared to Biron. The Shanny was just an example of 1 possibility of what could be done with 2 mill in extra cap space. I chose him because losing Knuble in front of the net might hurt...and he could off set that. But I would actually keep the 2 million for the trade deadline to make a bigger impact move.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:44 PM
  #16
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Originally Posted by ELab2 View Post
I don't agree with that. Toskala for Biron straight up is a trade I would very likely make.
Here you go again running your mouth like always. Based on what?? Why is he better? Just because he outplayed Raycroft (who sucked) does not mean he will outplay Biron.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripod View Post
Not at all. It makes the D MUCH better...goaltending upgraded a bit and signed for 1 extra year compared to Biron. The Shanny was just an example of 1 possibility of what could be done with 2 mill in extra cap space. I chose him because losing Knuble in front of the net might hurt...and he could off set that. But I would actually keep the 2 million for the trade deadline to make a bigger impact move.
In two years Flyers will have something like this

Gagne Briere Giroux
Hartnell Richards Lupul
JVR Carter Upshall (if not traded)
Asham Moto Downie
Cote


Coburn, Timonen, Parent, UFA (someone solid), Jones (might be out), Marshall and Sbisa will be 20 years old.

Most of our players will be under 28 years old playing together for a very long time developing that type of chemistry that might win a championship, so why make such a deal?

This type of trade will not guarantee the Flyers a championship. We will not be better then Pittsburgh or Detroit or Devils


Last edited by Kaktus*: 08-24-2008 at 09:53 PM.
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Old
08-24-2008, 09:45 PM
  #17
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Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Here you go again running your mouth like always. Based on what?? Why is he better? Just because he outplayed Raycroft (who sucked) does not mean he will outplay Biron.
Running my mouth like always?

I think he's got a TON more natural ability than Biron but he's more inconsistent. It's a trade off that I'd consider making because I think he'd be a lot more consistent with a better team in front of him.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Here you go again running your mouth like always. Based on what?? Why is he better? Just because he outplayed Raycroft (who sucked) does not mean he will outplay Biron.
and who did Biron outplay to win the starting job? Niittymaki? lol.

try actually watching both goalies, yeah? Toskala was great last season is equal if not better than Biron.

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Old
08-24-2008, 09:49 PM
  #19
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and who did Biron outplay to win the starting job? Niittymaki? lol.

try actually watching both goalies, yeah? Toskala was great last season is equal if not better than Biron.
I never said Biron is better then Toskala but I also do not think Toskala is better then Biron.

Raycroft is not a NHL player. He was a fluke. One year goalie.

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08-24-2008, 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
I never said Biron is better then Toskala but I also do not think Toskala is better then Biron.

Raycroft is not a NHL player. He was a fluke. One year goalie.
That has nothing to do with determining how good Toskala is. It doesn't make much sense to judge a guy by who he beat out.

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08-24-2008, 09:58 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Here you go again running your mouth like always. Based on what?? Why is he better? Just because he outplayed Raycroft (who sucked) does not mean he will outplay Biron.

In two years Flyers will have something like this

Gagne Briere Giroux
Hartnell Richards Lupul
JVR Carter Upshall (if not traded)
Asham Moto Downie
Cote


Coburn, Timonen, Parent, UFA (someone solid), Jones (might be out), Marshall and Sbisa will be 20 years old.

Most of our players will be under 28 years old playing together for a very long time developing that type of chemistry that might win a championship, so would we make such a deal.

This type of trade will not guarantee the Flyers a championship. We will not be better then Pittsburgh or Detroit or Devils
But the big ? is who would be in net. We should trade from out strength at forward for a great goalie...not just have a good one. We have had too many years of good teams being wasted with spotty goaltending. Now as a side note...I hope Biron shows this year that he is an elite goalie for our future. But if Homer believed that right now...wouldn't he be looking to sign him to a longer deal? There has been no chatter that that is taking place. Makes you wonder!!!

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Old
08-24-2008, 10:02 PM
  #22
ELab2
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Quote:
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But the big ? is who would be in net. We should trade from out strength at forward for a great goalie...not just have a good one. We have had too many years of good teams being wasted with spotty goaltending. Now as a side note...I hope Biron shows this year that he is an elite goalie for our future. But if Homer believed that right now...wouldn't he be looking to sign him to a longer deal? There has been no chatter that that is taking place. Makes you wonder!!!
Makes you wonder what? Biron is not and never will be an elite goalie. He's average to slightly above average and he's good enough to win you a championship if he's hot.

There's not much else out there but there's no rush to extend the guy.

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Old
08-24-2008, 10:04 PM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripod View Post
But the big ? is who would be in net. We should trade from out strength at forward for a great goalie...not just have a good one. We have had too many years of good teams being wasted with spotty goaltending. Now as a side note...I hope Biron shows this year that he is an elite goalie for our future. But if Homer believed that right now...wouldn't he be looking to sign him to a longer deal? There has been no chatter that that is taking place. Makes you wonder!!!
So now Toskala is a great goalie now.. Since ****ing when? Are you saying Toskala, Kabs, and Antropov would helps us win a championship next year? If we move Biron, Carter, Knuble and Parent?

We do not need such a trade. What we need is a system, a defensive system from our head coach. We definitely have the right players to become a steady hockey club that won’t be out shot on regular basis. If we get that type of system in place then will finish top 3 in the East in points next year guaranteed.

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08-24-2008, 10:08 PM
  #24
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Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
So now Toskala is a great goalie now.. Since ****ing when? Are you saying Toskala, Kabs, and Antropov would helps us win a championship next year? If we move Biron, Carter, Knuble and Parent?

We do not need such a trade. What we need is a system, a defensive system from our head coach. We definitely have the right players to become a steady hockey club that won’t be out shot on regular basis. If we get that type of system in place then will finish top 3 in the East in points next year guaranteed.
Toskala was the reason the leafs didn't finish last. He played great without any defensive system.

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Old
08-24-2008, 10:17 PM
  #25
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Too many moving parts, and it doesn't make sense for Toronto.

If they wanted to rebuild, they could get more by selling off each of those 3 players to different teams.

The only scenario that makes the least bit of sense is if Philly and Toronto revisited a possible Carter-Kaberle swap, but that's about it.

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