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08-26-2008, 08:35 AM
  #26
Fletch
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I do agree that the cap will not continue to increas $5MM as there comes a point where revenues will level off. And in past years, the Rangers had Jagr at less than a $5MM cap hit, which makes it tempting to add $7MM guys. As well, Henke was pretty cheap for the last three seasons. I'd be interested to know what the salary cap would be if the USD/CAD ratio was closer to where it was when the league came out of the lockout. I'm guessing that the increase is due in part to, what I believe to be, about a 20% increase in the CAD compared to the USD; hot sure, however, how that translates into cap dollars.

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08-26-2008, 11:06 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
I do agree that the cap will not continue to increas $5MM as there comes a point where revenues will level off. And in past years, the Rangers had Jagr at less than a $5MM cap hit, which makes it tempting to add $7MM guys. As well, Henke was pretty cheap for the last three seasons. I'd be interested to know what the salary cap would be if the USD/CAD ratio was closer to where it was when the league came out of the lockout. I'm guessing that the increase is due in part to, what I believe to be, about a 20% increase in the CAD compared to the USD; hot sure, however, how that translates into cap dollars.
Here you go...

http://finance.yahoo.com/currency/co...CAD&amt=1&t=5y

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08-26-2008, 11:59 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
REPORT ON RANGERS CAP (SERIOUS) ISSUES

New York Rangers high-priced players
Gomez - 7.357 for 6 more years
Drury - 7.050 for 4 more years
Redden - 6.5 for 6 more years
*Lundqvist - 6.875 for 6 more years (doesn't receive criticism for contract from me or anyone else for the most part)

Players in NHL who make equal to or more than above 3 guys
Anaheim : Neidermayer - 6.75 for 1 year
Boston : Chara - 7.5 for 3 more years
Buffalo : Vanek - 7.143 for 6 years
Calgary : Iginla - 7.0 for 5 more years / Phaneuf 6.5 for 6 more years
Chicago : Campbell - 7.1 for 8 more years / Khabibulin 6.75 for 1 more year
Dallas : Richards - 7.8 for 3 more years
Detroit : Lidstrom - 7.45 for 2 more years / Hossa - 7.45 for 1 year / Datsyuk - 6.7 for 6 more years
Ottawa : Heatley - 7.5 for 6 more years / Spezza - 7.0 for 7 more years
Philly : Briere - 6.5 for 7 more years (Richards, Carter, Gagne, Timmonen all have 5 MM+ and are long-term)
Pheonix : Jovanovski : 6.5 for 3 more years
Pittsburgh : Crosby - 8.7 for 5 more years / Malkin - 8.7 for 6 more years
San Jose : Thornton - 7.2 for 3 more years / Boyle - 6.67 for 6 more years
Tampa : Lecavalier - 6.875 this year, 7.73 for next 11 years
Vancouver : Luongo - 6.75 for 2 years

Facts
1. Only 20 players on the 29 other NHL teams make 6.5 million or more
2. Only 6 teams have 2 such players, 2 of which have players whose contracts expire after this year (CHI - Bulin , DET - Hossa)
3. Including Lecavalier whose extension doesnt kick in until next year, Gomez is the 9th highest paid player per season in the league

What I conclude from these numbers
1. The Rangers, with 4 of the top 25 paid players in the league, all with long term deals, are the most cash-strapped team in the league by far.
2. There are a few terrible contracts around the league, namely Richards, Boyle, Briere, Vanek, Campbell, but besides those the next 3 are Gomez, Drury, Redden in no particular order. Wow thats a lot of former Sabres! I'm not counting Bulin as that bad because its only 1 more year. I also am tempted to include Lecavalier with these other bad contracts because its so long but hes also an incredible player.
3. Lets say hypothetically Hossa signs back on with Detroit next year for his same cap number 7.45 and they resign Zetterberg to a 7MM per year deal, its funny to think about how much better their quartet is than the Rangers. Don't say Detroit wouldnt be able to pay all 4 of those guys because it would only be like 1.5 million more than the Rangers top 4.
Fixed

And for Lundqvist, I wouldn't say he's more valuable than Luongo yet, BUT I'd rather have Lundqvist under contract for the next 6 years than Luongo leaving in 2

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Old
08-26-2008, 12:35 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Your 100% right Inferno, as usual your good with the math and the math doesn't add up that we can keep our RFA's next year with how things are now.
Duh. Except we all know things will be different next year. No one whos who will stay and who will go over the course of a season.

To analyse "cap disaster" 1-2 years from now will do you no good when

a) you dont know what the cap will be
b) you dont know what the roster will be

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Old
08-26-2008, 01:40 PM
  #30
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Even if the cap doesn't go up a whopping $5m next season, we should remember that $1.5m in dead cap space from this season that's coming off the books. So for the 09-10 'cap disaster' that should be averted w/ a healthy rise in the cap and our bonuses coming off, and in 10-11 Naslund's contract runs out and adding some rookie's in the mix, I doubt this doom and gloom is gonna happen, though I doubt Sather is gonna realistically be people to sign many more big UFAs for awhile.

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Old
08-26-2008, 11:14 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Your 100% right Inferno, as usual your good with the math and the math doesn't add up that we can keep our RFA's next year with how things are now. This is another reason why I think signing Sundin actually helps our cap, it forces us to trade one of those big contracts. Sather went a bit crazy with his FA shoping. Did we really NEED both Redden and Rozy? Did we really need both Drury and Gomez? We shoulda done one in each case and went with cheaper options. But with all this news about waiting for the CBA to be renewed (It will be) i'm not sure how this works.
So frustrating when you put in work and people don't pay attention. *sigh*

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t...+unnecessarily

As you can see, I put together a very in-depth analysis of this issue about a month ago and... for the UMPTEENTH time, the Rangers are not screwed when it comes to keeping their RFAs!!!

Now, are they up against the cap? Yes. Do they have little or no ability to sign any meaningful free agents next year? Yes. Are they restricted in what trades they can make because they can only take on about as much salary as they give up? Yes.

But they are NOT screwed when it comes to signing their own RFAs.

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Old
08-26-2008, 11:31 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
So frustrating when you put in work and people don't pay attention. *sigh*

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t...+unnecessarily

As you can see, I put together a very in-depth analysis of this issue about a month ago and... for the UMPTEENTH time, the Rangers are not screwed when it comes to keeping their RFAs!!!

Now, are they up against the cap? Yes. Do they have little or no ability to sign any meaningful free agents next year? Yes. Are they restricted in what trades they can make because they can only take on about as much salary as they give up? Yes.

But they are NOT screwed when it comes to signing their own RFAs.
Thank you

Everyone should stop worrying about the future and focus on the upcoming season

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Old
08-27-2008, 09:51 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unk View Post
Even if the cap doesn't go up a whopping $5m next season, we should remember that $1.5m in dead cap space from this season that's coming off the books. So for the 09-10 'cap disaster' that should be averted w/ a healthy rise in the cap and our bonuses coming off, and in 10-11 Naslund's contract runs out and adding some rookie's in the mix, I doubt this doom and gloom is gonna happen, though I doubt Sather is gonna realistically be people to sign many more big UFAs for awhile.

Players that Must be resigned in the next 2 years: Zherdev, Staal, Dubinsky, Dawes, Cally, Korpi, Anisimov, Girardi. Zherdev and Staal will most likely get big raises. Girardi, Dawes and Dubi could also get decent size raises. Also don't forget about Korps, Cherry will get the max ELC which is $1mil. Cap room will be very very very tight if the cap doesn't raise alot.

If the Canadian $ declines at all we could be completely screwed. by the way I am still blaming Drury's contract on all of this. Just though you would like to know forechecker.

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Old
08-27-2008, 10:16 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
So frustrating when you put in work and people don't pay attention. *sigh*

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t...+unnecessarily

As you can see, I put together a very in-depth analysis of this issue about a month ago and... for the UMPTEENTH time, the Rangers are not screwed when it comes to keeping their RFAs!!!

Now, are they up against the cap? Yes. Do they have little or no ability to sign any meaningful free agents next year? Yes. Are they restricted in what trades they can make because they can only take on about as much salary as they give up? Yes.

But they are NOT screwed when it comes to signing their own RFAs.
What you don't acknoledge is that if ONE future RFA plays better then expected it throws your whole "theory" out of balance...

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Old
08-27-2008, 10:31 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
REPORT ON RANGERS CAP (SERIOUS) ISSUES

New York Rangers high-priced players
Gomez - 7.357 for 6 more years
Drury - 7.050 for 4 more years
Redden - 6.5 for 6 more years
*Lundqvist - 6.875 for 6 more years (doesn't receive criticism for contract from me or anyone else for the most part)

Players in NHL who make equal to or more than above 3 guys
Anaheim : Neidermayer - 6.75 for 1 year
Boston : Chara - 7.5 for 3 more years
Buffalo : Vanek - 7.143 for 6 years
Calgary : Iginla - 7.0 for 5 more years / Phaneuf 6.5 for 6 more years
Chicago : Campbell - 7.1 for 8 more years / Khabibulin 6.75 for 1 more year
Dallas : Richards - 7.8 for 3 more years
Detroit : Lidstrom - 7.45 for 2 more years / Hossa - 7.45 for 1 year / Datsyuk - 6.7 for 6 more years
Ottawa : Heatley - 7.5 for 6 more years / Spezza - 7.0 for 7 more years
Philly : Briere - 6.5 for 7 more years (Richards, Carter, Gagne, Timmonen all have 5 MM+ and are long-term)
Pheonix : Jovanovski : 6.5 for 3 more years
Pittsburgh : Crosby - 8.7 for 5 more years / Malkin - 8.7 for 6 more years
San Jose : Thornton - 7.2 for 3 more years / Boyle - 6.67 for 6 more years
Tampa : Lecavalier - 6.875 this year, 7.73 for next 11 years

Facts
1. Only 20 players on the 29 other NHL teams make 6.5 million or more
2. Only 6 teams have 2 such players, 2 of which have players whose contracts expire after this year (CHI - Bulin , DET - Hossa)
3. Including Lecavalier whose extension doesnt kick in until next year, Gomez is the 9th highest paid player per season in the league

What I conclude from these numbers
1. The Rangers, with 4 of the top 24 paid players in the league, all with long term deals, are the most cash-strapped team in the league by far.
2. There are a few terrible contracts around the league, namely Richards, Boyle, Briere, Vanek, Campbell, but besides those the next 3 are Gomez, Drury, Redden in no particular order. Wow thats a lot of former Sabres! I'm not counting Bulin as that bad because its only 1 more year. I also am tempted to include Lecavalier with these other bad contracts because its so long but hes also an incredible player.
3. Lets say hypothetically Hossa signs back on with Detroit next year for his same cap number 7.45 and they resign Zetterberg to a 7MM per year deal, its funny to think about how much better their quartet is than the Rangers. Don't say Detroit wouldnt be able to pay all 4 of those guys because it would only be like 1.5 million more than the Rangers top 4.
Great post.

But things aren't as bad as they seem. Because quite frankly, there are atleast 20 teams in this league who can only "dream" about beeing able to sign one of thoose 6.5m players. Like even if its "half-bad" contracts, there isn't enough players around to even give "half-bad" contracts too. We have seen it for 3 straight summer now; teams like Phoenix, the Islanders and co won't get anyone, and even great teams like Montreal will have a really hard time.

So while things are delicate here in NY -- if the cap keeps gooing up as it have, as always, horrible looking contracts become solid contracts in only a couple of years. Detroit have constantly been able to give guys like Robert Lang, Mathiue Schneider and Rafalski among others very expensive deals but still managed to get by.

And several several teams wouldn't be able to reach the upper levels of the cap even if they wanted to, or have self imposed caps long under the maximum like Buffalo.

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Old
08-27-2008, 02:25 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
What you don't acknoledge is that if ONE future RFA plays better then expected it throws your whole "theory" out of balance...
yea, but not all of them will be kept.....i mean looking at the player undercontract for next years team is all the RFA's are resigned

centers:
gomez
drury
dubinsky
anismov
moore
pyatt

wings:
dawes
fritsche
zherdev
naslund
sjostrom
byers
voros
callahan
cheraponov
orr(will be resigned as there are no other enforcers)

defenseman:
staal
redden
rozsival
girardi
potter
sauer
sanguinetti


i mean there are enough players to make a team there plus some....obviously some might not be ready or mught not make the nhl(pyatt, moore, etc) but all i am pointing out is that not all of them will be kept.....it seems like they are stockpiling assets


Last edited by NYR Viper: 08-27-2008 at 02:31 PM.
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Old
08-27-2008, 02:31 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
yea, but not all of them will be kept.....i mean looking at the player undercontract for next years team is all the RFA's are resigned

centers:
gomez
drury
dubinsky
anismov
moore
pyatt

wings:
dawes
zherdev
naslund
sjostrom
byers
voros
callahan
cheraponov
orr(will be resigned as there are no other enforcers)

defenseman:
staal
redden
rozsival
girardi
potter
sauer
sanguinetti


i mean there are enough players to make a team there plus some....obviously some might not be ready or mught not make the nhl(pyatt, moore, etc) but all i am pointing out is that not all of them will be kept.....it seems like they are stockpiling assets
You missed Korpedo in there. I agree about Orr though. He's a top enforcer and has shown willingness to learn Renney's system. Even though he doesn't bring much else besides a heavy hand to the table he will be back.

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Old
08-27-2008, 02:38 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by EthanLiddle View Post
Hey Rangers fans,

I've noticed that a lot of people have Dubinsky slotted in ahead of Drury on their depth charts. Now I don't think that makes much sense when hockey politics are considered.
My question is, if Dubinsky's totals are higher than Drury and he's, overall, more useful, what stops him from looking at Drury and saying "Why don't I get paid that much?"
Of course Drury can say a lot of things that Dubinsky can't, but in a lot of peoples minds Drury is way, way undeserving of the contract. So have the Rangers set themselves up to shoot them selves in the foot or will the seas be calm?

Discuss...

PS. Even though I'll be super peeved, I hope Nazzy plays well for you guys.
Its called FREE AGENCY.

Drury proved he was a player and became eligible to hit the open market and receive such a contract. Its pretty obivous the guy isnt worth 7.1 million a year. Hes a very good player and one of my favorites but lets be honest here, he cashed in when it was his turn to - And good for him.

Dubinsky is a rookie entering his second year, its tough to compare the two. When he proves hes a player long term hell be eligible to get a big contract through free agency whether that meterializes itself through a Restricted or Unrestricted fashion.

Besides, this post is quite confusing. Dubinsky is not a football, baseball or basketball player. Hes a hockey player and 90% of them know their role, maturation process and what they have to do to reach their goals. If money is one of them great, work hard and youll achieve it, especially being on a team like the Rangers that treat their players like royalty and arent shy about taking care of them monetarily. Im sure Dubinsky does just the opposite in fact. He probably looks up to Drury and wants to learn from him instead of just being jealous and envying him.

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Old
08-27-2008, 02:58 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
What you don't acknoledge is that if ONE future RFA plays better then expected it throws your whole "theory" out of balance...
How much better than expected?

Prucha scored 52 goals his first two years and got a 1.6MM per year deal. Antoine Vermette just got 2.6MM per (and he was only 1 year removed from UFA status). Hell, Mike Green was the best offensive defenseman in the league and got only 5.25MM per year.

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Old
08-28-2008, 05:56 PM
  #40
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D7

I don't want to know what the currency was, but what the cap would be in a static currency environment, as well as the sensitivity if the CAD decreases in value. Can't tell without knowing the percent or revenues the Canadian teams contribute to league revenues for each year.

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Old
08-28-2008, 07:20 PM
  #41
Jaromir Jagr
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
How much better than expected?

Prucha scored 52 goals his first two years and got a 1.6MM per year deal. Antoine Vermette just got 2.6MM per (and he was only 1 year removed from UFA status). Hell, Mike Green was the best offensive defenseman in the league and got only 5.25MM per year.
Those are all young players who had some kind of free agent process to go through in the little time they had to prove themselves. The reason the money is low is because they haven't shown it on a consistent basis. That is the reasoning for those contracts, and you know that too..

If we had given Prucha $4mill a season raise because he scored 30 goals, and we expected 30 every year..Sather would of been killed by now having payed 4mill for a 7 goal scorer. It's the reason Dubinsky and Staal are not going to cash in big time, and the reason all young players with the exception of generational talent (Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin) don't cash in that big until they prove themselves for a few straight seasons.

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