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Old
09-07-2008, 04:27 PM
  #26
Mtl6
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Wow I'm shocked. I did a top 20 myself before Menard's top 20 got out. Here it is.

1. Price G 9.0B
2. Kostitsyn RW 8.0B
3. Halak G 8.0B
4. Pacioretty LW 8.0C
5. McDonagh LD 8.0C
6. Maxwell C 7.0B
7. Chipchura C 6.0A
8. O'Byrne RD 7.0B
9. Valentenko LD 7.0B
10. White C 6.0B
11. Fischer RD 7.5C
12. Subban RD 7.0C
13. D'Agostini RW 7.0C
14. Carle RD 7.0C
15. Kristo RW 7.0C
16. Trunev RW 7.0C
17. Weber RD 7.0C
18. Pateryn RD 6.5C
19. Emelin LD 7.0D
20. Wyman RW 6.0C

As you can see, I am high on Valentenko and White so I'm a bit surprised to see them this far in the top 20. I liked it better when Dan did it. He was more constant in his rankings.

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09-07-2008, 04:38 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtl6 View Post
Wow I'm shocked. I did a top 20 myself before Menard's top 20 got out. Here it is.

1. Price G 9.0B
2. Kostitsyn RW 8.0B
3. Halak G 8.0B
4. Pacioretty LW 8.0C
5. McDonagh LD 8.0C
6. Maxwell C 7.0B
7. Chipchura C 6.0A
8. O'Byrne RD 7.0B
9. Valentenko LD 7.0B
10. White C 6.0B
11. Fischer RD 7.5C
12. Subban RD 7.0C
13. D'Agostini RW 7.0C
14. Carle RD 7.0C
15. Kristo RW 7.0C
16. Trunev RW 7.0C
17. Weber RD 7.0C
18. Pateryn RD 6.5C
19. Emelin LD 7.0D
20. Wyman RW 6.0C

As you can see, I am high on Valentenko and White so I'm a bit surprised to see them this far in the top 20. I liked it better when Dan did it. He was more constant in his rankings.
Finally, after 26 posts, a "clue" what you guys are talking about. Something called Menard.........

Boyz, where is this list everyone is referring to?

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09-07-2008, 04:39 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erika Kostitsyn View Post


Also, Ryan White is a too low.... the guy just had a very good season and it's still not enough ?! Ryan White will be a better version of Kyle Chipchura and yet, Chipchura sits at number 8 ?!
Chipchura is a 1st rounder and White is a 3rd. Chipchura captained Team Canada to a WJC Gold medal (and tied for goal scoring lead on that team) and White couldn't make the team. Chipchura played a key role on Hamilton's Calder Cup championship. White has never played a game in the AHL. Chipchura also has 11 points in 30-some NHL games. There is no certainty that White will ever make the NHL.

Nothing against White but what has he ever done to make you say with certainty that he'll be better than Chipchura? Chipchura has a much more impressive resume.

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09-07-2008, 04:57 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
Chipchura is a 1st rounder and White is a 3rd. Chipchura captained Team Canada to a WJC Gold medal (and tied for goal scoring lead on that team) and White couldn't make the team. Chipchura played a key role on Hamilton's Calder Cup championship. White has never played a game in the AHL. Chipchura also has 11 points in 30-some NHL games. There is no certainty that White will ever make the NHL.

Nothing against White but what has he ever done to make you say with certainty that he'll be better than Chipchura? Chipchura has a much more impressive resume.
You do know who you are attempting to argue with right?

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09-07-2008, 05:15 PM
  #30
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You do know who you are attempting to argue with right?


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Old
09-07-2008, 05:24 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
Finally, after 26 posts, a "clue" what you guys are talking about. Something called Menard.........

Boyz, where is this list everyone is referring to?
http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article...ects_fall2008/

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Old
09-07-2008, 05:33 PM
  #32
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My top 25 will soon get out, prolly in 3 parts monday tuesday and wednesday.

My computer crashing didnt help i have 14 players info to do today waaaaaa Half done now, lots of work still.

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Old
09-07-2008, 07:13 PM
  #33
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Yeah, he indeed not bulked up as much as expected, but a 6'5 D-man skating and controlling the puck like he does i havent seen many. He's got some tremendous upside and he'll surprise lots of people down the road.
I agree with you. I doubt he'll be a star one day but he's not getting the respect he deserves. There used to be a lot of cynicism towards Montréal's prospect (rightfully), I guess there's some leftover. Anyway, projects are always harder to love.

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09-07-2008, 07:54 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by MtlFan View Post
Do you like it? I Think it's pretty good, but for me Price and Kostitsyn jr are not prospects anymore. Maybe Valentenko is a bit low, but not bad at all
i see no list? is this a conspiracy? there is no link! everyone is talking about this list and i see no list.

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09-07-2008, 09:08 PM
  #35
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i see no list? is this a conspiracy? there is no link! everyone is talking about this list and i see no list.
3 posts up.

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Old
09-07-2008, 09:26 PM
  #36
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thx

is korneev not a habs prospect any longer?

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09-07-2008, 09:33 PM
  #37
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thx

is korneev not a habs prospect any longer?
Still habs property, but too old to be a prospect by HF standards.

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Old
09-07-2008, 11:13 PM
  #38
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My top 20!

HFers,
How can a player be a prospect and play on the Habs? It's one or the other.

1. Max Pacioretty - He's already signed a pro contract.
2. Ryan McDonagh - He's got to play the best in the world before he can be called our best prospect.
3. Kyle Chipchura - He's knocking on the door - make or break time.
4. Pavel Valentenko - He's played a solid 1st AHL campaign.
5. PK Subban - What a steal! Can move the puck, plays well in his own end.
6. Yannick Weber - Another steal, no pushover.
7. Ben Maxwell - He's got the tools, let's see him put it all together.
8. Mathieu Carle - A PP specialist with vision.
9. Matt D'Agostini - Has to work on his defence.
10. David Fischer - Great skater, good vision
11. Ryan White - A strong faceoff man, shutdown center with scoring touch and grit.- Brian Skrudland anyone?
12. Danny Kristo - At rookie camp, he showed that he's a blue chipper
13. Alexei Emelin - If he's so good why isn't he over here already?
14. Joe Steskal - Nobody takes this human wrecking ball seriously
15. Olivier Fortier - Not a great scorer, but solid on faceoffs. I'm a softie for guys with national team experience.
16. JT Wyman - His development was held back in Dartmouth. Don Lever should train him well.
17. Steve Quailer - A lot of promise, lanky winger who can score.
18. Andrew Conboy- Moving to the NCAA will increase his competitiveness.
19. Maxim Trunev - Check out his moves on YouTube. Will he pull an Emelin?
20. Cedric Desjardins - Undersized, hopefully he doesn't turn out to be another Olivier Michaud or Yann Danis.

Honorable Mentions

Scott Kishel - Young, inexperienced but the brass believes in him
Patrick Johnson - He's got a great shot for a little guy.

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Old
09-08-2008, 03:38 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BulldogFever View Post
HFers,
How can a player be a prospect and play on the Habs? It's one or the other.
You have Chipchura on your list.. and I think he's played more games a Hab than O'Byrne. He's already got a slot for this season as well.

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09-08-2008, 04:43 AM
  #40
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Here's my list, based on the same criterias that HF uses.

1- Carey Price
2- Sergei Kostitsyn
3- Jaroslav Halak
4- Max Pacioretty
5- Ryan McDonagh
6- Bob Yourkiss
6- Ryan O'Byrne
7- Kyle Chipchura
8- P.K. Subban
9- Pavel Valentenko
10- Ben Maxwell
11- Mathieu Carle
12- Yannick Weber
13- Alexei Yemelin
14- Danny Kristo
15- David Fischer
16- Matt D'Agostini
17- Ryan White
18- Maxim Trunev
19- Greg Stewart
20- Olivier Fortier
22- Shawn Belle
22- Brock Trotter
23- James Wyman
24- Greg Pateryn
25- Steve Quailer

I know you wonder who the f...k "Bob Yourkiss" is, but I really, really wanted to be able to say that's "because Yourkiss is on my list".


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Old
09-08-2008, 06:23 AM
  #41
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I have nothing against you..
Nate, me and you tussle but you know its all good One of my best friends, Adam Contant, is from Napanee, and I'm pretty sure he knows you. So yeah, I think you say some bat**** things, but we're no enemies.

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Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
but I'm pretty sure more than eight people have seen Pacioretty play. He played for Team USA for six games during the WJC.. A bunch of people have also seen him during rookie camps, etc.
Likely not as much as people tend to lead. I wasn't stating cold hard facts. I've watched him play for Michigan and he was great to see, but not to the point where I'm convinced the guy is going to jump straight to the NHL and play second line hockey, as if you go ahead and read peoples projected Canadiens lines, people think he will. That's where my issue lies with MaxiPad. People are convinced he'll just up and replace Latendresse because hes everything Lats was originally (incorrectly) projected to be.

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Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
I was one of the people who said Sergei Kostitsyn was going to be an amazing player and make the Canadiens last season (though I said from camp).. and he did make the club. I've seen him play tons of times while he was with London.. and the kid was amazing. He showed that last year.

If Pacioretty turns out like Sergei Kostitsyn.. then I don't see how anyone can complain.
Again, I never knocked Sergei or called him a bad player, but I think people were far too obsessed with the kid and just leading themselves into a door of disappointment for the future. I think Sergei will be a great player in the NHL, maybe even Koivu-esque, but I wouldn't go much farther, and people are ready to claim that in their crazy dreams.

Hab fans love to attach themselves to one player and run with it. They did it with Lats, they did it with Sergei, everyone did it with Carey (including the hockey world) and now we're doing it with MaxiPad. That doesn't mean, "Stupid fans, he sucks!" it means, "People need to take a step back and remember he is a 19 year old coming out of college".

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Old
09-08-2008, 07:39 AM
  #42
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Huh ?! I didn't know that Ben Maxwell will return to the WHL for his overage season... Is this a mistake ?! Anyone can confirm this ?
I didnt' read the article but Maxwell should be in Hamilton, I'd be shocked if he wasn't on the top 2 lines for the Dogs.

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Originally Posted by kostitsyn1489 View Post
Fischer at 10? Way too low. The guy got some crazy upside, dont be fooled by his average season point wise and the media.
I don't have a problem with that at all, to me Fischer should be ranked lower until he shows more imo. I do think he has some good upside but so do a lot of our other prospects and the difference is that they are showing it. I'm all for potential but when you have a very strong prospect pool, then imo you try and find a good balance between what guys are showing now along with potential and upside.

I like Fischer but I also see the holes in his game and have my concerns. I would bet that there's not many around here that have seen him more then I have as I get to see a handful of Minnesota USHS games and just about all of Minnesota's games so I've seen a lot of him and will continue to see a lot more of him.

Another thing that works against him is the fact that RD is likely our deepest postion in our prospect pool imo, so he's going to have to work really hard to stick in the organization imo.

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Originally Posted by Lone Rogue View Post
Minority?

This board is MaxiPad crazy. 2/3rds of the people freaking out for him haven't even seen him play. The other 1/3rd is mostly made up of people who watched a few YouTube clips. Maybe 8 people on this board (I'm one of them) have actually watched him in a full game. However, like Sergei Kostitsyn last season, hes the new flavour of the Habs.

By rating McDonaugh higher, they are saying that Ryan McDonaugh as a defenceman has better potential being a superstar than Max Pacoretty as a forward. Comprende?
I've seen Pac at the USHL and NCAA level, I've seen McDoangh at the USHS and NCAA level and I saw Kostitsyn at the wjc's and London and Hamilton and of course all his nhl games.

I don't expect either Pac or McDo to get great NHLers, but I do expect both be to very good NHLers with Pac having a bigger impact because we sorely lack a player like him whereas McDo looks to be more of a solid 2 way type that is strong in his own end, plays physical and can chip in on offense.

It's funny cause I really wanted us to draft McDonagh, but didn't really care for Pacioretty and the same for Kostitsyn as I was a huge fan of his brother but didn't think his numbers in Belarus were all that impressive. But as soon as I saw him with London and Pacioretty with Michigan, I could see how wrong I was, both quickly became my favorite draft picks, as I thought Kostitsyn was so much fun to watch and he played the game hard and Pacioretty just brings everything we lack. A big PF that is actually fast, physical and can produce offense.

At this time I think Kostitsyn has great upside, I expect very big things from him down the road. I also expect Pacioretty to be a force in the NHL, I do see him getting some games in the NHL this year as I can't see us being so healthy again but if not then I expect he will see games next year. McDonagh I want to see a lot more from, I saw a good bit of him but want to see him step up his game a few levels. That said it's tough when you look at Pac and McDonagh, as with Pac he's older and had played at a higher level then McDo for one year and he plays an easier position, whereas McDo was a true freshman playing a tougher position so with Pac he had a great year in the NCAA and with McDo he had his ups and downs for sure but both were named to the All Rookie Teams for their respective conferences.

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Old
09-08-2008, 01:26 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
Chipchura is a 1st rounder and White is a 3rd. Chipchura captained Team Canada to a WJC Gold medal (and tied for goal scoring lead on that team) and White couldn't make the team. Chipchura played a key role on Hamilton's Calder Cup championship. White has never played a game in the AHL. Chipchura also has 11 points in 30-some NHL games. There is no certainty that White will ever make the NHL.

Nothing against White but what has he ever done to make you say with certainty that he'll be better than Chipchura? Chipchura has a much more impressive resume.


Boyd Devereaux was also a first round pick in 1996(6th Overall) and captained Team Canada... Who cares ?!

Alex Tanguay never made team Canada... Who cares ?!?


There is no certainty that Kyle "Slowpoke" Chipchura will ever make the NHL either !!

Thoses two has pretty similar potential... Chipchura at #8 and White at #20 is just ridiculous IMO. Both should be around 8-12.

The big difference between them is that White was picked in the 3rd round, which is where thoses kind of players should be taken...

Not like some Turtle with almost zero offensive skills being picked in the 1st round...


With that said, Ryan White will be better than Kyle Chipchura by a fair margin, you guys can quote me on that !! He will put more offensive numbers than Chipchura in his 1st year in the AHL... and unlike Chipchura, White is already better at the face-off circle




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09-08-2008, 01:35 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erika Kostitsyn View Post
Boyd Devereaux was also a first round pick in 1996(6th Overall) and captained Team Canada... Who cares ?!

Alex Tanguay never made team Canada... Who cares ?!?


There is no certainty that Kyle "Slowpoke" Chipchura will ever make the NHL either !!

Thoses two has pretty similar potential... Chipchura at #8 and White at #20 is just ridiculous IMO. Both should be around 8-12.

The big difference between them is that White was picked in the 3rd round, which is where thoses kind of players should be taken...

Not like some Turtle with almost zero offensive skills being picked in the 1st round...


With that said, Ryan White will be better than Kyle Chipchura by a fair margin, you guys can quote me on that !! He will put more offensive numbers than Chipchura in his 1st year in the AHL... and unlike Chipchura, White is already better at the face-off circle



Yeah, Sam Pollock was a ****ing idiot. What was he thinking picking Bob Gainey where he did?

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Old
09-08-2008, 01:38 PM
  #45
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Even with all the graduations, that is a very, very deep prospect pool.

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09-08-2008, 01:45 PM
  #46
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Yeah, Sam Pollock was a ****ing idiot. What was he thinking picking Bob Gainey where he did?

ohh so now Kyle "Slowpoke" Chipchura will be the Next Gainey ?!?


Players like Gainey comes every 10 years and sorry, but I can't see Kyle Chipchura anywhere near what Gainey did in his career. Chipchura wildest dreams will not even come close to Gainey, so stop with this Gainey comparison, it is ridiculous at this point.



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09-08-2008, 01:54 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erika Kostitsyn View Post
ohh so now Kyle "Slowpoke" Chipchura will be the Next Gainey ?!?


Players like Gainey comes every 10 years and sorry, but I can't see Kyle Chipchura anywhere near what Gainey did in his career. Chipchura wildest dreams will not even come close to Gainey, so stop with this Gainey comparison, it is ridiculous at this point.


I know it's a waste of my time to argue with you, but since I just got home from university, I might as well.

No, I'm not comparing Chipchura to Gainey in a careers number or impact on the game sense. Just that Sam Pollock took a player with no exceptional scoring talent, a guy he knew would be a leader, a tremendous checker that would do anything to win. What part of those things does not describe Chipchura? Chipchura has the ability to put up 30-40 points as a third line center, whether you want to believe so or not. He's a great leader and is a tremendous checker. I'd actually be interested to see Chipchura and Sergei in a skating contest while Sergei would win at the point of when both get going, Chipchura wouldn't be that far behind, it's just his first step quickness. Which is due to the fact he severred his achilles tendon, which is not something easily recoverable from. His skating mechanics can change and he can get faster, not that speed has much to do with it since he has tremendous body positioning, hockey sense that can't be taught and he's unbeatable on the boards.

Your only argument is he's slow, which simply does not matter all that much when you have sufficient tools built to make up for that which he's slightly lacking in.

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Old
09-08-2008, 01:57 PM
  #48
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Agree Gainey should be left out of it, but let's face it Chipchura's a better skater than White in every aspect.

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09-08-2008, 02:04 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erika Kostitsyn View Post
ohh so now Kyle "Slowpoke" Chipchura will be the Next Gainey ?!?


Players like Gainey comes every 10 years and sorry, but I can't see Kyle Chipchura anywhere near what Gainey did in his career. Chipchura wildest dreams will not even come close to Gainey, so stop with this Gainey comparison, it is ridiculous at this point.



really, you got to stop this hate on Chipchura.... The guys has more offensive talent than you and most give hiim credit for. To me the only reason he was sent down was cause his faceoff abilities were sup par. Chip had decent points/game but was squeezed out by lapierre who was earning his spot in Hamilton. Yes Chipchura isn't the fastest but he has a high work ethic and will improve that along with his faceoff's especially with the coaching staff he has at his disposal. Both areas are very fixable.

White may end up having more offensive upside but lets see what he can do in the AHL first ok? Chipchura will start in Montreal unless Sundin or another Center is signed.


I still like the Habs board top 25 list. Its pretty accurate.


Last edited by Toro: 09-08-2008 at 02:19 PM.
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Old
09-08-2008, 02:15 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Erika Kostitsyn View Post
There is no certainty that Kyle "Slowpoke" Chipchura will ever make the NHL either !!
Do you really believe this? Cause Chipchura is a total lock to play in the NHL.

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