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Old
09-21-2008, 10:58 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by jas View Post
If Renney intends on spreading the scoring out over all three lines, (as he did last year, when Dubi was centering Avery and Jagr), then I agree. It looks like Dubinsky will get both PP and PK, so he'll get quality minutes.
Yeah, I think that's pretty important really. It's probably a better idea to not stack the top two lines and leave the third line comprised of inexperienced players who haven't proven to be good scorers yet. That's the problem that might occur of you move Drury to wing and play him with Dubinsky on the top two lines. Then the third line becomes an "energy" line, but might not provide enough offense.

The more you can spread things out and still generate scoring, the better in my opinion

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09-21-2008, 11:05 AM
  #52
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I believe in Dubinsky but lets not get excited over a pre-season game.

Lets see how he does minus Jagr and then we should really see what type of player he will become.

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09-21-2008, 11:31 AM
  #53
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He was minus Jagr last night, and although it was preseason, he seemed to do pretty well. Don't forget DDP (Dawes Dubi Prucha) was playing very well prior to Dubi-Jagry 2.0.

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09-21-2008, 11:32 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by I Eat Crow View Post
Naslund-Gomez-Prucha
Drury-Dubinsky-Zherdev
Dawes-Fritsche-Sjostrom
Voros-Betts-Callahan
Orr



Done.
A agreee, Dan Fritsche is a natural center with a great fw% throughout his hockey career. Unfortunately for some reason Columbus never put him at center where he belongs and plays the best. I still would like Callahan to play on his line at wing.

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09-21-2008, 11:35 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by nyranger49 View Post
A agreee, Dan Fritsche is a natural center with a great fw% throughout his hockey career. Unfortunately for some reason Columbus never put him at center where he belongs and plays the best. I still would like Callahan to play on his line at wing.
there must have been a good reason why columbus moved him to the wing, given their lack of centers. i doubt they'd pass up the chance to have a big tough center if there weren't a good reason...

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09-21-2008, 11:39 AM
  #56
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there must have been a good reason why columbus moved him to the wing, given their lack of centers. i doubt they'd pass up the chance to have a big tough center if there weren't a good reason...
CBJ is a team that hasn't made many good decisions since their existance. I know one thing for sure is the one time they put Fritsche at the center position he made plays happen and was a point a game player and also in the +. If given the chance at the center position with NYR I can see him having a breakout year.

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09-21-2008, 11:49 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by nyranger49 View Post
A agreee, Dan Fritsche is a natural center with a great fw% throughout his hockey career. Unfortunately for some reason Columbus never put him at center where he belongs and plays the best. I still would like Callahan to play on his line at wing.
Fritsche was 48.8% on face offs last year, 49.3% 2 years ago, and 48.9% 3 years ago.

so roughly 49% between the 3 years, thats behind all 4 of our current centers, and would rank him roughly 200th int he NHL in terms of faceoff %, with about 20-30 of those being people with super small sample size, so you can say about 175th in the NHL amongst people with a nominal sample size.

if you do the math, 175/30 that tells us that on every team in the nhl there are roughly 6 guys who are better at faceoffs than him.

That is why he was moved to wing.

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Old
09-21-2008, 12:00 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Fritsche was 48.8% on face offs last year, 49.3% 2 years ago, and 48.9% 3 years ago.

so roughly 49% between the 3 years, thats behind all 4 of our current centers, and would rank him roughly 200th int he NHL in terms of faceoff %, with about 20-30 of those being people with super small sample size, so you can say about 175th in the NHL amongst people with a nominal sample size.

if you do the math, 175/30 that tells us that on every team in the nhl there are roughly 6 guys who are better at faceoffs than him.

That is why he was moved to wing.
Simple logic tells you that the average faceoff percentage is exactly 50 %. The median percentage should also be extremely extremely close to 50 %, maybe off by a couple hundredths or thousandths of a percent. So if Fritsche is only 1 percent off from the mean and the median, DOES IT REALLY MATTER??? Faceoffs does not define the center role. Just dont put him out for a faceoff in the defensive zone with the game on the line.

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09-21-2008, 12:31 PM
  #59
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Been sayin it since last season but you guys got yourself a real fine player in him. Looks a lot like a mini-Lecavalier more and more every game.

Anyone think he could have a Richards type year this season?

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09-21-2008, 12:51 PM
  #60
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I'm down for having Fritsche being the third line center. Like people have said, its his natural position and he has played there most of his life.

When I moved to Center my Senior year of HS, I did ok but it wasnt the same as wing. I played wing in playoffs and felt so much more comfortable.

My lines:

Naslund-Gomez-Drury/Zherdev
Dawes-Dubinsky-Zherdev/Drury
Sjostrom-Fritsche-Callahan
Voros-Betts-Prucha

Not sure where to put Drury or Zherdev so I just split em. Prucha doesnt deserve to be in the top 6 yet, and I think Dawes does. Cally should be a third liner with his energy, so I popped him on the right and put Sjostrom on the left (as he is a lefty). I think Dawes and Dubi would work good, as Dawes can shoot and pass equally well. Dawes creates offense all the time, and does well in the corners. Those are the best forwards, imo.

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09-21-2008, 12:57 PM
  #61
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No, no, no. Don't move Drury to wing. You're eliminating your BEST face off man from the face off circle. A center who can score 25 goals and play more than respectable defense in his own end. In fact better defense in his own end than any other of the top 3 centers. Move Dubinsky to wing and have him play with Drury. Top line should be Naslund - Gomez - Zheredev, and the second line can be ohhh... I don't know.. hmmm.... Dubinsky - Drury - Prucha / Dawes. Dubinsky definitely deserves the top 6 minutes but lets keep Dru where he is best.

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09-21-2008, 01:05 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fataldogg View Post
No, no, no. Don't move Drury to wing. You're eliminating your BEST face off man from the face off circle. A center who can score 25 goals and play more than respectable defense in his own end. In fact better defense in his own end than any other of the top 3 centers. Move Dubinsky to wing and have him play with Drury. Top line should be Naslund - Gomez - Zheredev, and the second line can be ohhh... I don't know.. hmmm.... Dubinsky - Drury - Prucha / Dawes. Dubinsky definitely deserves the top 6 minutes but lets keep Dru where he is best.
Touche, I just dont see Dubi moving to the wing.

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09-21-2008, 01:12 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by DruMez View Post
Drury is too good for a bottom 6 role as well, and despite what he might say in the press, might not be thrilled about playing wing either.

A very good pre-season game by Dubinsky isn't an indication that he's going to be an 80-point player that demands he rise above Drury on the depth chart.
I think 10 NHL years of never scoring 80 is a better indicator. Dubi is more of an impact player than Drury, and it showed towards the end of last year and in the playoffs.

Get Drury on the third line and let him collect his power play goals on pp1.

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09-21-2008, 01:15 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
Simple logic tells you that the average faceoff percentage is exactly 50 %. The median percentage should also be extremely extremely close to 50 %, maybe off by a couple hundredths or thousandths of a percent. So if Fritsche is only 1 percent off from the mean and the median, DOES IT REALLY MATTER??? Faceoffs does not define the center role. Just dont put him out for a faceoff in the defensive zone with the game on the line.
uhh, yes. it does matter. in the NHL having a 53% faceoff percentage is considered near elite. having a 48-49% faceoff percentage is considered medicore to below average. 1 percentage point in terms of faceoffs in either direction is like the equivalent of 10 goals in terms of goal scoring in either direction.

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09-21-2008, 02:01 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polako View Post
I think 10 NHL years of never scoring 80 is a better indicator. Dubi is more of an impact player than Drury, and it showed towards the end of last year and in the playoffs.

Get Drury on the third line and let him collect his power play goals on pp1.
What in ****S SAKE are you smoking? Are you kidding me?

Have you ever watched Hockey? Do you understand the concept of defense and/or clutchness? What the **** are you serious?

Oh and btw, Jagr isn't on the team anymore, sweet avatar.

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09-21-2008, 02:37 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
uhh, yes. it does matter. in the NHL having a 53% faceoff percentage is considered near elite. having a 48-49% faceoff percentage is considered medicore to below average. 1 percentage point in terms of faceoffs in either direction is like the equivalent of 10 goals in terms of goal scoring in either direction.
lets say he takes 1000 faceoffs on the season which is something like 12 per game. I think that is a fair amount. if he wins 50% that is 500/1000. If he wins 49% that is 490 out of 1000. So how could those 10 losses on faceoffs possibly result in 10 goals against more. That would mean that all faceoffs lost result in goals against.

More accurately, maybe 3 of those 10 losses occur in the defensive zone, and 1 of them results in a goal. Maybe, maybe, maybe that goal is attributable to losing the faceoff.

The bottom line is that a players comfort level at the position is worth 100000x more than a measly faceoff percentage. Like I said, when we are up a goal with 10seconds left go with Betts, Drury, or Gomez, nobody is going to argue.

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09-21-2008, 03:28 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polako View Post
I think 10 NHL years of never scoring 80 is a better indicator. Dubi is more of an impact player than Drury, and it showed towards the end of last year and in the playoffs.

Get Drury on the third line and let him collect his power play goals on pp1.


People laugh at Ranger fans because of posts like this.

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09-21-2008, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by polako View Post
I think 10 NHL years of never scoring 80 is a better indicator. Dubi is more of an impact player than Drury, and it showed towards the end of last year and in the playoffs.

Get Drury on the third line and let him collect his power play goals on pp1.
I am speechless

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09-21-2008, 06:49 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
lets say he takes 1000 faceoffs on the season which is something like 12 per game. I think that is a fair amount. if he wins 50% that is 500/1000. If he wins 49% that is 490 out of 1000. So how could those 10 losses on faceoffs possibly result in 10 goals against more. That would mean that all faceoffs lost result in goals against.

More accurately, maybe 3 of those 10 losses occur in the defensive zone, and 1 of them results in a goal. Maybe, maybe, maybe that goal is attributable to losing the faceoff.

The bottom line is that a players comfort level at the position is worth 100000x more than a measly faceoff percentage. Like I said, when we are up a goal with 10seconds left go with Betts, Drury, or Gomez, nobody is going to argue.
Thats just how its worked. A good faceoff guy is around 51-52% 483 wins versus 520 wins is a significant number. thats 37 separate plays where your team starts on the defensive because of a lost faceoff.

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09-21-2008, 08:51 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by TheSchwab View Post
I'm down for having Fritsche being the third line center. Like people have said, its his natural position and he has played there most of his life.
When I moved to Center my Senior year of HS, I did ok but it wasnt the same as wing. I played wing in playoffs and felt so much more comfortable.

My lines:

Naslund-Gomez-Drury/Zherdev
Dawes-Dubinsky-Zherdev/Drury
Sjostrom-Fritsche-Callahan
Voros-Betts-Prucha

Not sure where to put Drury or Zherdev so I just split em. Prucha doesnt deserve to be in the top 6 yet, and I think Dawes does. Cally should be a third liner with his energy, so I popped him on the right and put Sjostrom on the left (as he is a lefty). I think Dawes and Dubi would work good, as Dawes can shoot and pass equally well. Dawes creates offense all the time, and does well in the corners. Those are the best forwards, imo.



Schwabie has spoken and I couldn't agree more.

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09-21-2008, 09:42 PM
  #71
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I have Drury going to the left side with Gomez.

There are few viable top-six options on the wing after Zheverdev, Dawes and Nalsund.

On the other hand, there are options for third-line center in Anisimov, Moore and Fritsche.

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09-22-2008, 01:15 AM
  #72
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I have Drury going to the left side with Gomez.

There are few viable top-six options on the wing after Zheverdev, Dawes and Nalsund.

On the other hand, there are options for third-line center in Anisimov, Moore and Fritsche.
Yeah, I was gonna say: I thought Moore looked decent out there. Good bursts of speed, good shot, hustled. I definitely see him as a 4th liner already.

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09-22-2008, 02:18 AM
  #73
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Yeah, I was gonna say: I thought Moore looked decent out there. Good bursts of speed, good shot, hustled. I definitely see him as a 4th liner already.
i would trade betts and pencil moore into his spot. moore is as good defensively, but adds some offense as well. he should chip in 10 goals a season, something you know betts wont do with any degree of certainty.

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09-22-2008, 06:10 AM
  #74
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I do not disagree on any points about dubinsky , but putting callahan on the 4th line is just ludacris.

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09-22-2008, 08:54 AM
  #75
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we need to stop thinking about first, second and third lines. Drury centered a 'third' line last season and played 19 minutes per game. There is a way to get third liners quality minutes, as well as a way to get them to play with quality players. As AK pointed out, the line of Dawes-Dubi-Prucha actually was quite good last season (would've like to have seen a reprise of that line). With a 'third' line being centered by Dubi, the Rangers would have pretty darn good depth on their top three lines, while not diluting any one line materially.

There is one potential issue, however, and that's the PP. Someone's going to be left out. Personally, I think Drury's the best PP left winger this team has. So naturally, you'd see him with Gomez and perhaps Zherdev. Then on to the second line. On the left side there's Naslund. Then you have Dubi in the middle. So that's nice for Dubi. The right side is open, perhaps for Dawes, but is Dawes capable of being a quality right wing PP guy? Who's the guy who dishes out the puck on that PP?

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