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We have to do something about Brandon Dubinsky

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Old
09-22-2008, 08:58 AM
  #76
Nich
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i say leaving him on the 3rd line, and roll the top 3 lines with 4th line spot duty.....

now i am just curious if we get to see frische with him and callahan one game....

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09-22-2008, 09:59 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
we need to stop thinking about first, second and third lines. Drury centered a 'third' line last season and played 19 minutes per game. There is a way to get third liners quality minutes, as well as a way to get them to play with quality players. As AK pointed out, the line of Dawes-Dubi-Prucha actually was quite good last season (would've like to have seen a reprise of that line). With a 'third' line being centered by Dubi, the Rangers would have pretty darn good depth on their top three lines, while not diluting any one line materially.
Exactly. I don't like the lines I'm seeing where everyone tries to cram all of the Rangers best players into the top 2 lines, and then say "oh man I love that 3rd line of Korpikoski, Fritsche, and Callahan! That'd be awesome!"

Yeah maybe they'd eventually be good, but that's a really inexperienced line without ANY proven offense, and looks like it'd basically turn into that kind of young "kid" energy line that zooms around but doesn't do a whole lot on the scoreboard because there's no real leadership or playmaker or whatever.

If you have 3, or even 4, lines that can be an offensive threat, you're making your team that much harder to play against. If Dubinsky plays as the third line center and allows the Rangers to have 3 legitimate scoring lines, I'll take that in a second. He'll get plenty of icetime if he's as good as people are pimping him up to be this season.

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The right side is open, perhaps for Dawes, but is Dawes capable of being a quality right wing PP guy? Who's the guy who dishes out the puck on that PP?
I'd go Prucha instead of Dawes, at least at first. Dubinsky is a decent passer, so there's that...but honestly that's the kind of configuration where I'd like to see a defenseman QBing the PP. Not sure the Rangers really have that guy, except for Redden, and I assume he'll be on the 1st PP unit. Maybe Kalinin? Not sure I want to put a ton of faith in him yet, however.

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09-22-2008, 10:02 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by nyranger49 View Post
Schwabie has spoken and I couldn't agree more.
Oh yay I have fans.

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Old
09-22-2008, 10:08 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I have Drury going to the left side with Gomez.
If you want to talk about faceoffs, lets get it on.

Even though i'd rather have Drury at center - if they do indeed put him on the wing, Gomez can really cheat in the circle. I mean really cheat. If he gets kicked out, he knows he has an even better faceoff man who can come right in and cover after him.

Don't discount that fact.

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09-22-2008, 10:16 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
Exactly. I don't like the lines I'm seeing where everyone tries to cram all of the Rangers best players into the top 2 lines, and then say "oh man I love that 3rd line of Korpikoski, Fritsche, and Callahan! That'd be awesome!"

Yeah maybe they'd eventually be good, but that's a really inexperienced line without ANY proven offense, and looks like it'd basically turn into that kind of young "kid" energy line that zooms around but doesn't do a whole lot on the scoreboard because there's no real leadership or playmaker or whatever.

If you have 3, or even 4, lines that can be an offensive threat, you're making your team that much harder to play against. If Dubinsky plays as the third line center and allows the Rangers to have 3 legitimate scoring lines, I'll take that in a second. He'll get plenty of icetime if he's as good as people are pimping him up to be this season.



I'd go Prucha instead of Dawes, at least at first. Dubinsky is a decent passer, so there's that...but honestly that's the kind of configuration where I'd like to see a defenseman QBing the PP. Not sure the Rangers really have that guy, except for Redden, and I assume he'll be on the 1st PP unit. Maybe Kalinin? Not sure I want to put a ton of faith in him yet, however.
Coudnt agree more on all counts.

With Jagr gone, some people are having trouble envisioning a team that is not #1 line specific. This team hasnt had a consistent threat from the lower lines in years, and the idea behind this offseason was to try and target that. Now that they could have a potential 3rd line of Fritsche - Dubinsky - Callahan, all guys who have experience, are young energy players and could put the puck in the net, everyone thinks Dubi should be "top 6", we should really think of it as "top 9".

Lets think about something else for a second here. Zherdev is your top line right winger. While Jagr provided little in the defensive department, Zherdev might provide even less. The giveaways and north-north mindset might hinder his playing time and effect on the team's defensive stature as a whole. I think that alone might spread out the time among the three top lines.

With no Jagr, Straka and Shanny (and Avery to an effect)- guys Renney relied heavily on in almost all circumstances - the time is going to be split a little more this year, not to mention Drury was on the "3rd line" last year getting 19 minutes.

Fritsche - Dubi -Cally 3rd line? Sign me up.

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Old
09-22-2008, 11:36 AM
  #81
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Levitate...

I don't think Prucha would do very well on the right side. As you know he excelled on the PP because of his shot from the left side. I think the right side would be a bit awkward for him and he won't be able to adjust. I do still wonder how that second unit will operate. I'm struggling to find another playmaker. I guess they'll just have to cycle and get the puck out to the point and look for point shots, which in case someone like Cally would be better on the right side since he's actually good at finding garbage around the net.

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09-22-2008, 11:41 AM
  #82
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Hbnyc....

you still want to have a strong top line. Having said that, it doesn't necessarily mean that Naslund-Gomez-Zherdev has to be the answer, but given the lack of scoring depth ont he right side, I think it has to be Zherdev on the right, but the left side can be changed as I believe there's a bit more scoring depth on the left side.

I do believe in spreading things out, but I also believe that there is an extent to which you can spread things out and it becomes dilutive. As an extreme example, Orr will score more playing with Gomez and Naslund compared to Betts and Voros, but that isn't something you'd actually want to see since it brings down the play in the other two. We still need to make sure that the players can keep up with everyone on the line.

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Old
09-22-2008, 12:01 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
I don't think Prucha would do very well on the right side. As you know he excelled on the PP because of his shot from the left side. I think the right side would be a bit awkward for him and he won't be able to adjust. I do still wonder how that second unit will operate. I'm struggling to find another playmaker. I guess they'll just have to cycle and get the puck out to the point and look for point shots, which in case someone like Cally would be better on the right side since he's actually good at finding garbage around the net.
Eh, maybe true. I still think that they have to find some use for Prucha on the PP if they keep him around, though.

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09-22-2008, 12:09 PM
  #84
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I agree with that, Levitate. I do hate playing people out of the position in which they're best-suited. The only time Prucha has played well on the right side was in limited action with Dubi and Dawes last season. Perhaps he can play the right side on the second PP.

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Old
09-22-2008, 12:31 PM
  #85
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dubinsky - zherdev?

Might be a good idea to have dubinsky center Zherdev. While Dubinsky plays a good north american game and would fit nicely with the callahans and the fritsches, it wouldnt be terrible to pair him with zherdev and continue his process of developing the more creative, finesse, flare skills set that is more common in the european game, that he was forced to experiment with after being paired with Jagr. If Dubinsky can slightly modify his game where he can be physical, go to the net BUT ALSO accommadate flashy, skillful wingers then we're talking about a #1/2 center with the versatility of few others in the league. Dubinsky has shown to be a quick learner...might as well teach him to play with a tricky winger now than attempt to add that in to his skill set in a couple years.

The best centers have always been the one that could play multiple styles of play... might as well put dubi to the test now.

Maybe he picks up zherdev's style of play quickly, zherdev starts to trust him and we have a dynamic pairing right off the bat. lets gomez concentrate on feeding naslund, hopefully get him streaky.



Drury Gomez Naslund
Dawes Dubinsky Zherdev - very balances, dawes is small but has shown that hes not afraid to get into the corners, allows dubinsky to create room for zherdev with his skating, and dawes to get some cleanup goals
Fritsche Anisimov Prucha -
Callahan Betts Voros/to the 4th - adds some scoring

the liuneup is flexible - prucha can take dawes' spot or vice versa. Or if Prucha doesnt find the net and fails to impact the power play, you open up a spot for korpikoski on that line. This way anisimov gets some skill player on his wing but a defensively responsible, grittier forward to do the grinding.


excited to see where everything turns

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Old
09-22-2008, 01:01 PM
  #86
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ive never seen Callahan as a 4th liner, not sure why so many people have him there. the kid is all over the puck, and has some offensive talent (enough to score 15 goals a season imho).

I really want to keep Callahan on the 3rd. No higher, no lower.

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09-22-2008, 01:15 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dccuse View Post
Might be a good idea to have dubinsky center Zherdev. While Dubinsky plays a good north american game and would fit nicely with the callahans and the fritsches, it wouldnt be terrible to pair him with zherdev and continue his process of developing the more creative, finesse, flare skills set that is more common in the european game, that he was forced to experiment with after being paired with Jagr. If Dubinsky can slightly modify his game where he can be physical, go to the net BUT ALSO accommadate flashy, skillful wingers then we're talking about a #1/2 center with the versatility of few others in the league. Dubinsky has shown to be a quick learner...might as well teach him to play with a tricky winger now than attempt to add that in to his skill set in a couple years.

The best centers have always been the one that could play multiple styles of play... might as well put dubi to the test now.

Maybe he picks up zherdev's style of play quickly, zherdev starts to trust him and we have a dynamic pairing right off the bat. lets gomez concentrate on feeding naslund, hopefully get him streaky.



Drury Gomez Naslund
Dawes Dubinsky Zherdev - very balances, dawes is small but has shown that hes not afraid to get into the corners, allows dubinsky to create room for zherdev with his skating, and dawes to get some cleanup goals
Fritsche Anisimov Prucha -
Callahan Betts Voros/to the 4th - adds some scoring

the liuneup is flexible - prucha can take dawes' spot or vice versa. Or if Prucha doesnt find the net and fails to impact the power play, you open up a spot for korpikoski on that line. This way anisimov gets some skill player on his wing but a defensively responsible, grittier forward to do the grinding.


excited to see where everything turns
Rather have Zherdev play with a veteran (preferably Drury).

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09-22-2008, 01:54 PM
  #88
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you guys are crazy...lol

Shift Gomer to 1st RWing.
Z goes to second Rwing.
PRucha plays the 3rd line and Dubi gets 1st line center.
This way you can play Fritche in center with Voros and Prucha.

So you have Nas - Dubi - Gomer
Dawes - Drury - Zherdev
Voros - Fritche - Prucha
Rismiller - Betts - Callahan/Orr or whomever you want on the 4th line right wing.

That's if you want dubi to play the first line.

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09-22-2008, 01:57 PM
  #89
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What the ****, that's a terrible idea.

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09-22-2008, 02:01 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
What the ****, that's a terrible idea.
yeah, i wasnt going to be the one to say it, but i pretty much agree.

you take one of the 3 or 4 best playmakers in the game, and move him to wing?

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09-22-2008, 02:04 PM
  #91
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Dubi is a top 6 guy on about every team in the league, including the Rangers. Get him 20 minutes a night.

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09-22-2008, 02:12 PM
  #92
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shift Gomez to right wing? Why would the Rangers do that? Has he every played wing? Is he more comfortable on the off wing? I don't understand where this comes from. I know I can be a bit extreme regarding my hesitancy to move guys to positions in which they haven't played much, but at the same time, everyone wants to move centermen to wing positions and this is one I really have trouble making sense on.

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09-22-2008, 02:16 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
shift Gomez to right wing? Why would the Rangers do that? Has he every played wing? Is he more comfortable on the off wing? I don't understand where this comes from. I know I can be a bit extreme regarding my hesitancy to move guys to positions in which they haven't played much, but at the same time, everyone wants to move centermen to wing positions and this is one I really have trouble making sense on.
Yeah, thats just plain ridiculous.

Might as well have Redden play goal and Lundqvist on defense.

Thats how much of a center Gomez is.

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09-22-2008, 02:21 PM
  #94
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Daniel Goneau scored a bunch of goals in a short span and a lot of people thought he was the next Adam Graves too. Although I believe Dubi will be good, just not as "great" as some people think he will be. A nice 2nd line player or a very very good 3rd line player. I just don't see that 1st line ability in him yet (maybe I will this season)

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09-22-2008, 02:23 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Wild GM View Post
Dubi is a top 6 guy on about every team in the league, including the Rangers. Get him 20 minutes a night.
If his play shows he deserves 20 minutes a night, he'll get it.

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09-22-2008, 02:24 PM
  #96
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Goneau had about 15 decent games, Dubi about a full good season. I do see your point, but wanted to make that point. I do see him as a good second liner/very good third liner, with consistent 50 point scoring, but at the same time, he's made so much progress in such a short period that I can't bet against him not being a top liner at this point.

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Old
09-22-2008, 02:25 PM
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I Eat Crow View Post
Naslund-Gomez-Prucha
Drury-Dubinsky-Zherdev
Dawes-Fritsche-Sjostrom
Voros-Betts-Callahan
Orr



Done.
Ding.
Prucha's speed will complement Gomez's playmaking, and Naslund's hands.
Drury can be the playmaker, with two quality scorers in Dubi and Zherdev, and Dubi can make some nice play's too.

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Old
09-22-2008, 02:33 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
Goneau had about 15 decent games, Dubi about a full good season. I do see your point, but wanted to make that point. I do see him as a good second liner/very good third liner, with consistent 50 point scoring, but at the same time, he's made so much progress in such a short period that I can't bet against him not being a top liner at this point.
The fact of the matter, for me anyway, is that I did not view Dubinsky as a difference maker last season until he played with Jagr. But, unlike Prucha, I get the feeling that Dubinsky learned from that experience and will continue to improve. I think you can pencil him in for 50 points this season, especially if Drury moves to the wing and Dubi plays 2nd line center.

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09-22-2008, 02:36 PM
  #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ih8theislanders View Post
Prucha's speed will complement Gomez's playmaking
No, it wont.

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Old
09-22-2008, 02:41 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Ih8theislanders View Post
Ding.
Prucha's speed will complement Gomez's playmaking, and Naslund's hands.
Drury can be the playmaker, with two quality scorers in Dubi and Zherdev, and Dubi can make some nice play's too.
Why does everyone forget that when Prucha clicked on the powerplay with Jagr 3 seasons ago, he was given the opportunity to play first line minutes. It didnt work...he is simply too undersized and took massive punishment. He cant play big minutes going against the top teams top pair...he just cant no matter how much some love the little guy.

Prucha should play on the 3rd line with PP time.

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