And to me the toughness that we dressed in the preseason was a huge factor to our overall success.
Not 1 game in the preseason so far did i feel the canucks lacked toughness. We played against the Ducks/Sharks/Flames, and we beat all of them. Usually those teams like to start brawls at the end of the game after they lose, i wonder why not? maybe we had like 3-4 players that were tough.
If brown gets picked up, and rypien gets injured( extremely likely), we are looking at pettinger/wellwood on the 4th line. We are back to having 1 tough guy.
Bernier/mitchell/bieksa are gritty but they should not do the fighting. Davison might not even play that many games.
For once i thought the team would be tougher, but these cuts have been head scratchers. Why not cut hogdson if you will not play him on sunday. He's obviously not ready.
Brown hasn't impressed me with his pugilist skills.
Hordichuk can fight.
Rypien can fight.
Bieksa can fight (if needed.)
Pyatt can fight (again, if needed.)
Davison can fight.
Kesler can fight.
We also have Rahimi and FitzGerald on the Moose.
Brown hasn't impressed me with his pugilist skills.
Hordichuk can fight.
Rypien can fight.
Bieksa can fight (if needed.)
Pyatt can fight (again, if needed.)
Davison can fight.
Kesler can fight.
We also have Rahimi and FitzGerald on the Moose.
How many fighters does this team need?
Not only must they be able to fight, but they must be Canadian BC boys who were former Vancouver Giants.
The way I see it, if no one picks up Jeff Cowan, who has been an NHLer for eight years and has shown an ability to pot ~5-10 goals, I don't think anyone will pick up Brown either. Teams are only going to be picking up players who can help them on the big league team, and I think Cowan makes more sense in that case. It's not like they can just claim Brown and send him down to the AHL.
Cowan might have the experience, but he also has a 1 way contract. Teams will remember that LA had to expose him on re-entry waivers just to dump him. They'll also remember that he has a single point last season in 46 games, and that he didn't do much to protect his teammates.
Utility players are replaceable, unless you stupidly sign them to a one way contract. Then, if you're a budget conscious team like most NHL teams are, you're stuck with him.
Cowan might have the experience, but he also has a 1 way contract. Teams will remember that LA had to expose him on re-entry waivers just to dump him. They'll also remember that he has a single point last season in 46 games, and that he didn't do much to protect his teammates.
But if a team is in need of a player like Cowan or Brown on their roster for the upcoming season, I'm guessing it's to keep them on the NHL roster for at least a chunk of the season, so I don't think the one-way/two-way thing will be a big decision criteria. I don't think either Cowan or Brown will be picked up, either way.
I believe Cowan was just on regular waivers when the Canucks claimed him, though.
Quote:
Utility players are replaceable, unless you stupidly sign them to a one way contract. Then, if you're a budget conscious team like most NHL teams are, you're stuck with him.
Agreed on that. That's why I think there's little chance that Brown gets picked up. And if he does, there are plenty of similar players on waivers that the Canucks could pick up to replace him if they need to.
A guy like Zenon Konopka made it through waivers a few days ago, and he's every bit the heart and soul/fighter type as the Canucks' castoffs. Plus he's shown an ability to be an almost PPG player in the AHL.
I could definitely see someone grabbing Brown. I'm not sure if I agree with the selection of Rypien over Brown as a matter of fact; wouldn't mind having him on our 4th line alongside Hordichuk.
So can I - he's a better fighter than Cowan, probably a better player, younger and improving. Sigh - we're going to lose Brown and still have Cowan...
I'd be sad to see Brown go, too. Whether or not he has a place on the roster, he was a usable callup when we needed extra grit or toughness. His pugilistic skills might not be top notch, but they weren't terrible. I hope he makes it to Manitoba.
Brown hasn't impressed me with his pugilist skills.
Hordichuk can fight.
Rypien can fight.
Bieksa can fight (if needed.)
Pyatt can fight (again, if needed.)
Davison can fight.
Kesler can fight.
We also have Rahimi and FitzGerald on the Moose.
How many fighters does this team need?
Bieksa and Pyatt, and Kesler can fight to different skill levels, but shouldn't.
Hordichuk is a heavy weight who couldn't get anyone to fight him in the preseason. Davison is a defensemen, and if he's dressed, you don't really want to have him sitting in the box for 5 minutes or risk him getting injured.
So basically, Rypien is the only guy on the active roster who can drop them at any moment with few repercussions. Not a huge problem with that, unless he gets injured.
He did look pretty good for a few months in Vancouver, I'll give him that. But it was clearly a mistake signing him to a multiple year one way contract.
I'm pretty sure that .284M cap hit attributed to the Canucks was because he was claimed December 30th and that would be what the remainder of his cap hit would be for that season, not because he was claimed on re-call waivers. They also have Bryan Smolinksi's cap hit to the Canucks as .433M which makes sense since his overall season cap hit was 1.976M and he was acquired Feb 27th, resulting in the Canucks taking on the remainder of the total cap hit which would be the .433M.
I'm pretty sure that .284M cap hit attributed to the Canucks was because he was claimed December 30th and that would be what the remainder of his cap hit would be for that season, not because he was claimed on re-call waivers. They also have Bryan Smolinksi's cap hit to the Canucks as .433M which makes sense since his overall season cap hit was 1.976M and he was acquired Feb 27th, resulting in the Canucks taking on the remainder of the total cap hit which would be the .433M.
I'm pretty positive he was claimed on re-entry waivers. I could just be insane, though.
I think Peter Griffin's explaination makes sense. If Cowan had been claimed on re-entry waivers, since the season was half over the Canucks would have absorbed 1/4 of Cowan's cap hit and LA 3/4's (as they had half of his salary count before he was picked up, plus half of the remaining half after was picked up) but NHL Numbers has them splitting it fairly evenly (284k for Vancouver, 248k for LA).
He did look pretty good for a few months in Vancouver, I'll give him that. But it was clearly a mistake signing him to a multiple year one way contract.
Yup. He earned himself a one-year deal - but not a two year deal. One of Nonis' mistakes.
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Originally Posted by Ernie
Hordichuk is a heavy weight who couldn't get anyone to fight him in the preseason.
I could be wrong, but I swear I heard something that Hordichuk was playing with some kind of injury - no sense making it worse by fighting in a meaningless pre-season game.
Cowan might have the experience, but he also has a 1 way contract. Teams will remember that LA had to expose him on re-entry waivers just to dump him. They'll also remember that he has a single point last season in 46 games, and that he didn't do much to protect his teammates.
I agree with everything but the last point. What more should he have done?
I think Peter Griffin's explaination makes sense. If Cowan had been claimed on re-entry waivers, since the season was half over the Canucks would have absorbed 1/4 of Cowan's cap hit and LA 3/4's (as they had half of his salary count before he was picked up, plus half of the remaining half after was picked up) but NHL Numbers has them splitting it fairly evenly (284k for Vancouver, 248k for LA).
Yeah, I couldn't find anything about it either. I just really remember him being on re-entry, and me thinking that it was a great pickup because of that.
I could be wrong, but I swear I heard something that Hordichuk was playing with some kind of injury - no sense making it worse by fighting in a meaningless pre-season game.
He said something about jamming his hand or thumb and not fighting for a bit during the Canucks' first preseason game. He looked like he'd be willing to go with Shelley against the Sharks though, so I'm guessing he's probably ok now.
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Originally Posted by TheHomelessAteMyCat
I agree with everything but the last point. What more should he have done?
Yeah, you have to give the guy credit for at least having the balls to take on Boogaard, Fedoruk, Shelley, etc. Those guys are way out of his league but he went with them anyway. He wasn't very good against middleweights either though.
Brown hasn't impressed me with his pugilist skills.
Hordichuk can fight.
Rypien can fight.
Bieksa can fight (if needed.)
Pyatt can fight (again, if needed.)
Davison can fight.
Kesler can fight.
We also have Rahimi and FitzGerald on the Moose.
How many fighters does this team need?
at least brown will initiate, and not lose badly which is the key, and he doesn't much take dumb penalties.
rypien- how long before he gets injured?
hordichuk-1
bieksa- you don't want him to fight
pyatt- more like, if pushed to the limit, and hes part of 2nd line
davison- will barely play
kesler- hes the 3rd most important forward, he should not fight
rahimi was hanging on for his dear life against a 18 year old in the preseason, if hugging is fighting, stortini is the champ.
fitzgerald-how far along the depth chart is he..
The thing is we have some fighters, but the ones that dress shouldn't fight, and the others most likely would not dress.
Yeah, you have to give the guy credit for at least having the balls to take on Boogaard, Fedoruk, Shelley, etc. Those guys are way out of his league but he went with them anyway. He wasn't very good against middleweights either though.
Looking at Cowan's stats, it looks like he's a guy who picked up fighting very late as something he could add to his game to give him some extra appeal in the big leagues. His three years of major junior, he played 17, 51, and 66 games, and had 5, 14, and 29 PIM. In the ECHL in his first year as a pro, he had 42 PIM in 47 GP, with 8 PIM in 22 AHL games that year. The next year, in the AHL, he only had 23 PIM in 69 GP. Then, suddenly, he jumped to 117 PIM in 71 GP. It looks like he had a transition sometime after he started playing pro hockey, which probably explains why he can't really fight very well at all.
For a guy who had less than 30 PIM in every one of his seasons in the OHL to have fought 12 times in the NHL, some of them against some pretty serious guys, is pretty wild.
The thing is we have some fighters, but the ones that dress shouldn't fight, and the others most likely would not dress.
It's only really a problem if the Canucks lose Brown on waivers though. There's only one spot in the lineup for a fourth line forward with Hordichuk and Johnson entrenched there, and it's not like a guy like McIver was ever going to see regular minutes unless the team had at least 3 injuries on defense.
If Brown does get claimed for some reason, there will be plenty of opportunity for the Canucks to scoop up some other team's middleweight waiver fodder if it comes down to that.
at least brown will initiate, and not lose badly which is the key, and he doesn't much take dumb penalties.
rypien- how long before he gets injured?
hordichuk-1
bieksa- you don't want him to fight
pyatt- more like, if pushed to the limit, and hes part of 2nd line
davison- will barely play
kesler- hes the 3rd most important forward, he should not fight
rahimi was hanging on for his dear life against a 18 year old in the preseason, if hugging is fighting, stortini is the champ.
fitzgerald-how far along the depth chart is he..
The thing is we have some fighters, but the ones that dress shouldn't fight, and the others most likely would not dress.
Granted, I'm really in favour of fighting as a reaction to on-ice situations more than as a sideshow, but I think that having these guys who *shouldn't* be fighting, but are willing and able to fight, is more useful than dressing 2 or 3 guys to do the job. Yeah, you need to have your big enforcer to counter the other team's guy, but the middleweight fights are generally more of a reactionary thing than anything else.
Looking at Cowan's stats, it looks like he's a guy who picked up fighting very late as something he could add to his game to give him some extra appeal in the big leagues. His three years of major junior, he played 17, 51, and 66 games, and had 5, 14, and 29 PIM. In the ECHL in his first year as a pro, he had 42 PIM in 47 GP, with 8 PIM in 22 AHL games that year. The next year, in the AHL, he only had 23 PIM in 69 GP. Then, suddenly, he jumped to 117 PIM in 71 GP. It looks like he had a transition sometime after he started playing pro hockey, which probably explains why he can't really fight very well at all.
For a guy who had less than 30 PIM in every one of his seasons in the OHL to have fought 12 times in the NHL, some of them against some pretty serious guys, is pretty wild.
Hes not a bad middleweight, but i give him a lot of credit last year for taking on all the heavies when the canucks were just lacking in that department.
I never understand the hate towards him, he was injured a lot last year.
Hes not a bad middleweight, but i give him a lot of credit last year for taking on all the heavies when the canucks were just lacking in that department.
I never understand the hate towards him, he was injured a lot last year.
Yep. Getting beat up, even though sometimes hockey fights might seem like they're not a "real" fight, is not fun, and Cowan took a lot of beatings standing up for his teammates last season. I have a ton of respect for the guy.
