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PROPOSAL: Koivu & Higgins for Gaborik ?

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Old
10-05-2008, 12:01 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
No thanks....
Big time no thanks. Thats alot to give even for a star UFA.

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10-05-2008, 01:51 PM
  #77
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Definitely disagree 100%. Having Koivu go down changed every single matchup. Koivu was put up against Brind'Amour and both pretty much nullified each others contribution leaving Kovalev and his line to play around with the Canes while Staal was being shut out by Plekanec. The moment Koivu went down, Carolina put Brind'Amour against the Kovalev line which was a complete game changer. It rendered Kovalev/Ribeiro inneffective while Brind'Amour didn't have anyone combative enough to stop him. It made him, Staal and the rest of the Carolina offense better.
I agree that when Koivu went down , it didn't help the Habs ( it would have been the same thing if any of Kovalev, Ribeiro , Ryder , Theodore would have went down ) . But Gerber was terrible in the net . Once they put Ward , it was another story . Who was named the MVP of the Playoffs that season ? Koivu or Ward ?

Anyway , i think that we are going off topic with Koivu's playoffs performances .

As someone said , if we trade Koivu and Higgins for Gaborik , Who will center the second line and the 3 th line ? Lang and Chip ?

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10-05-2008, 01:52 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by 100th View Post
I agree that when Koivu went down , it didn't help the Habs ( it would have been the same thing if any of Kovalev, Ribeiro , Ryder , Theodore would have went down ) . But Gerber was terrible in the net . Once they put Ward , it was another story . Who was named the MVP of the Playoffs that season ? Koivu or Ward ?
I'll chose the guy who played more than 2 games

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10-05-2008, 01:56 PM
  #79
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Just out of curiosity, why is it always about Koivu with this poster ? Just asking.

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10-05-2008, 01:57 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by CabbageLegs View Post
Just out of curiosity, why is it always about Koivu with this poster ? Just asking.
he's a mindless drone of the anti-koivu scheme, he thinks that without koivu in the last 13 years, the habs would have won 14 cups, ended the lockout and conquered the universe

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10-05-2008, 01:57 PM
  #81
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I'll chose the guy who played more than 2 games
it was ironic .

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10-05-2008, 01:58 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
he's a mindless drone of the anti-koivu scheme, he thinks that without koivu in the last 13 years, the habs would have won 14 cups, ended the lockout and conquered the universe
WRONG !:

I have always said that Koivu is the perfect second-line center. The best player on the Habs roster in the last decade because they had none better. The captain because they had none better too. Now, other players are surpassing him. He"s gonna be a UFA next July.

Don't try to see more than what I wrote at the top of this thread.

It was a trade PROPOSAL. Nothing else. No more frivoulous or intelligent than 99% of the proposals on this board.

Anyway, you can't touch the name of Saku Koivu on this board without being flamed to death, GROW UP FOLKS !

Who was the last Habs player to play his whole carreer in Montreal ? Even Gainey - when he was asked about Saku's contract - said that he would not sign him during the season.

And for those who don"t want to read my opinion, Just put me on your IGNORE LIST.

Thank you very much !


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Old
10-05-2008, 01:59 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
he's a mindless drone of the anti-koivu scheme, he thinks that without koivu in the last 13 years, the habs would have won 14 cups, ended the lockout and conquered the universe
nothing less

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10-05-2008, 02:08 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
he's a mindless drone of the anti-koivu scheme, he thinks that without koivu in the last 13 years, the habs would have won 14 cups, ended the lockout and conquered the universe
Don't forget helped Canada win Nagano, got Ben Johnson his Gold Medal back, gave Patrick Lalime his groove back, found Osama Bin Laden (Dying in a hospital), and in Koivu's place, for the next 13 years, we would have instead drafted Todd Bertuzzi, Jarome Iginla, Daniel Briere, Marian Hossa, Robyn Regehr, Anton Volchenkov, Brad Boyes, Alexander Ovechkin (trade the Caps Bertuzzi and Briere to get their pick), Sidney Crosby (we'd win the Draft) and Carey Price (We'd trade someone for their 1st to get him).

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10-05-2008, 02:14 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
WRONG !:

I have always said that Koivu is the perfect second-line center. The best player on the Habs roster in the last decade because they had none better. The captain because they had none better too. Now, other players are surpassing him. He"s gonna be a UFA next July.

Don't try to see more than what I wrote at the top of this thread.

It was a trade PROPOSAL. Nothing else. No more frivoulous or intelligent than 99% of the proposals on this board.

Anyway, you can't touch the name of Saku Koivu on this board without being flamed to death, GROW UP FOLKS !

Who was the last Habs player to play his whole carreer in Montreal ? Even Gainey - when he was asked about Saku's contract - said that he would not sign him during the season.

And for those who don"t want to read my opinion, Just put me on your IGNORE LIST.

Thank you very much !
bang on !

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Old
10-05-2008, 02:31 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
WRONG !:

I have always said that Koivu is the perfect second-line center. The best player on the Habs roster in the last decade because they had none better. The captain because they had none better too. Now, other players are surpassing him. He"s gonna be a UFA next July.

Don't try to see more than what I wrote at the top of this thread.

It was a trade PROPOSAL. Nothing else. No more frivoulous or intelligent than 99% of the proposals on this board.

Anyway, you can't touch the name of Saku Koivu on this board without being flamed to death, GROW UP FOLKS !

Who was the last Habs player to play his whole carreer in Montreal ? Even Gainey - when he was asked about Saku's contract - said that he would not sign him during the season.

And for those who don"t want to read my opinion, Just put me on your IGNORE LIST.

Thank you very much !
you don't have to defend yourself... i think they were talking about the poster formerly known as #Zamboni#, aka 100th.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
I agree that when Koivu went down , it didn't help the Habs ( it would have been the same thing if any of Kovalev, Ribeiro , Ryder , Theodore would have went down ) . But Gerber was terrible in the net . Once they put Ward , it was another story . Who was named the MVP of the Playoffs that season ? Koivu or Ward ?

Anyway , i think that we are going off topic with Koivu's playoffs performances .

As someone said , if we trade Koivu and Higgins for Gaborik , Who will center the second line and the 3 th line ? Lang and Chip ?
Theo was in colorado when we lost to carolina in 06. Huet was our goalie. Theo being injured wouldn't have had any effect on us.

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Old
10-05-2008, 05:08 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
WRONG !:

I have always said that Koivu is the perfect second-line center. The best player on the Habs roster in the last decade because they had none better. The captain because they had none better too. Now, other players are surpassing him. He"s gonna be a UFA next July.

Don't try to see more than what I wrote at the top of this thread.

It was a trade PROPOSAL. Nothing else. No more frivoulous or intelligent than 99% of the proposals on this board.

Anyway, you can't touch the name of Saku Koivu on this board without being flamed to death, GROW UP FOLKS !

Who was the last Habs player to play his whole carreer in Montreal ? Even Gainey - when he was asked about Saku's contract - said that he would not sign him during the season.

And for those who don"t want to read my opinion, Just put me on your IGNORE LIST.

Thank you very much !

Nothing but the thruth.

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10-05-2008, 05:10 PM
  #88
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It's not about Koivu. It's about the fact that you dont ditch your long serving captain as you try to make it to the cup. It sends such a wrong message. And obviously when people disagree you take the weak way out and say it's because it's Koivu... It's because it's a god damn captain.

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10-05-2008, 05:40 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by znk View Post
It's not about Koivu. It's about the fact that you dont ditch your long serving captain as you try to make it to the cup. It sends such a wrong message. And obviously when people disagree you take the weak way out and say it's because it's Koivu... It's because it's a god damn captain.
never mind the fact that it recreates the we only have 2 centres problem.

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Old
10-05-2008, 05:52 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
WRONG !:

I have always said that Koivu is the perfect second-line center. The best player on the Habs roster in the last decade because they had none better. The captain because they had none better too. Now, other players are surpassing him. He"s gonna be a UFA next July.

Don't try to see more than what I wrote at the top of this thread.

It was a trade PROPOSAL. Nothing else. No more frivoulous or intelligent than 99% of the proposals on this board.

Anyway, you can't touch the name of Saku Koivu on this board without being flamed to death, GROW UP FOLKS !

Who was the last Habs player to play his whole carreer in Montreal ? Even Gainey - when he was asked about Saku's contract - said that he would not sign him during the season.

And for those who don"t want to read my opinion, Just put me on your IGNORE LIST.

Thank you very much !
First off, Gainey never said that. He actually said, he's said that in the past he had a mentality of not negotiating contracts during the season, but also said it's not a rule.
He also mentioned there's a lot of renegotiating to be done next summer so he can't really starts handing out contracts to his veterans. He said it's all going to depend on their performance.
He was talking about Koivu/Kovalev/Tanguay..etc..

After what seems like 5000000000 years, we finally have some depth at center.
So why would we trade what many consider like the best 2nd line center in NHL, and go back to the same problem. That would be stupid.

Not to mention Koivu publicly came out to say he wanted to win here, and for the first time in his career, he's on a team favored to win its division and finish top of Conference.
So why would he wave his NTC to go back to a weaker team?

From a team's perspective, you don't trade your respected Captain the year you're going for it all. No matter if we have other leaders or not, you just don't do that.
Players like Koivu are also extremely important come PO time.

I know its a proposal, but I'd bet my life savings this is not even close to being a possibility.

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Old
10-05-2008, 05:55 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by znk View Post
It's not about Koivu. It's about the fact that you dont ditch your long serving captain as you try to make it to the cup. It sends such a wrong message. And obviously when people disagree you take the weak way out and say it's because it's Koivu... It's because it's a god damn captain.
It's always a tough moment for both the team and the long serving players , when they arrive near the end of their career ; i saw that with Béliveau , Henry Richard and Guy Lafleur . At one point , you have a love-hate feeling about them , because you know what they gave to your team , but also see that they aren't able to play their game anymore . They eat the minutes of players that are now better than them .

Koivu is in a very special position , because of his health history , and because he played all the last decade long with the worst editions of the Habs .

But if Gainey thinks his team could have more chances to win the Stanley Cup this 100 th Habs season , by trading his captain or any valuable player , do you really think that he won't do it just because emotive reasons ?

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10-05-2008, 06:21 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by 100th View Post
bang on !
It's not that the proposal is offensive for mentionning Koivu, I think it's poorly reasoned. I'm a fan of Koivu, you not as much, that's fine, everyone has their players that they're partial to.

Koivu's biggest fans have to see what he brings to a game is different now, it's evolving. He isn't playing a high speed game thru open ice, he shows the wear and tear that his history has taken on him. He has to find the spots in a game where he can make something happen. He isn't valuable to a team that doesn't have the players you need on the wing.

He also is going to be a ufa if not extended. I don't see veteran C being part of what Risebrough would look for. Do you ?

It's Catch 22, Koivu is worth a lot to Mtl, he really isn't worth that much to someone else.

As far as the chemistry issue, well, I believe that moving Higgins and Koivu would give the team a much different feel. Risky business.

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10-05-2008, 06:55 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by 100th View Post
But if Gainey thinks his team could have more chances to win the Stanley Cup this 100 th Habs season , by trading his captain or any valuable player , do you really think that he won't do it just because emotive reasons ?
Of course he would.
But if we take this proposal, im not so sure it makes our team better..
Gaborik is an elite player, no doubt about it, we'd have an unbelievable depth on the wings.
But Koivu brings a lot more than just numbers, and even if Higgins is basically the center of every rumor here, I don't think he'll ever be moved.
He and Komi are being looked at as the future leaders of this team.

So this team would suffer a lot more than imo.

Im not a Koivu lovah btw, I just don't think trading your captain, who always seems to be one of our best player during PO, would be a smart move.

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Old
10-05-2008, 08:04 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by 100th View Post
Wings and Pens were the cup finalists last season . 2 teams with both offensive stars à la Crosby , Malkin , Datsyuk , Zetterberg . Koivu with "the intangibles he brings ", was playing golf duringf that time . Seriously , don't name Koivu when you are talking about what kind of players bring you a cup .

I don't know what playoff series you were watching but malkin and Crosby did not win the Cup either. Does that mean the Pens should trade them too? Bourque never won the cup until they traded him to the Avs. Does that mean he was a terrible leader when in boston. Your logic holds up as a well as a drunk on a week long binge. I think you and that logic need to sit down and take a rest.

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10-06-2008, 09:10 AM
  #95
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Koivu is the Montreal Canadiens. Why would you trade him?

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10-06-2008, 09:11 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
he's a mindless drone of the anti-koivu scheme, he thinks that without koivu in the last 13 years, the habs would have won 14 cups, ended the lockout and conquered the universe
Quote:
Originally Posted by noobman View Post
Koivu is the Montreal Canadiens. Why would you trade him?
because of first quoted post

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10-06-2008, 09:18 AM
  #97
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Koivu is the Montreal Canadiens. Why would you trade him?
Because Stone Cold Said So.

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10-06-2008, 10:26 AM
  #98
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Heh, I can already see it in the Tuesday newspaper "Montreal trades Koivu and Higgins for Gaborik." Then on Friday "Gaborik injured against the Sabres. Out for season."

This trade makes no sense, lose leadership, lose two ways players who can actually play gritty in the playoffs for an often injured player. Doesn't work for me.

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10-06-2008, 10:46 AM
  #99
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Heh, I can already see it in the Tuesday newspaper "Montreal trades Koivu and Higgins for Gaborik." Then on Friday "Gaborik injured against the Sabres. Out for season."

This trade makes no sense, lose leadership, lose two ways players who can actually play gritty in the playoffs for an often injured player. Doesn't work for me.
I find that it's not a matter of blindly defending, or for that matter, attacking Koivu, it just doesn't make sense from the standpoint of either what Mtl would offer or What Minn. would want.

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10-06-2008, 10:47 AM
  #100
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Because Stone Cold Said So.
crap did you ever ruin that
Cause

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