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** Game #2 - 10.5.08 | 12:00 PM | MSG, VS.(HD) - TB Lightning @ NY Rangers **

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Old
10-06-2008, 02:40 PM
  #451
Vitto79
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Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
Yeah, I'd rather see him back at wing, but I'm not sure if Callahan playing center would be better or worse
Actually I think he is a great 3rd line C, just play the freaking kid all yr and he will produce............he is comfortable at C too........later on they can move him to the wing if Aminisev is ready next yr

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10-06-2008, 02:42 PM
  #452
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Yeah, I'd rather see him back at wing, but I'm not sure if Callahan playing center would be better or worse
My gut feeling is worse. Oh well, might as well try. At least it's the third line we're wondering about rather than the first two like last season

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10-06-2008, 02:46 PM
  #453
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Levitate...

If Cally is at center, I think that Korps plays better and the line plays better. I think Cally's more experienced and it's an easier transition for him than Korps. Hopefully he'll adjust, but I don't think he is the one who should've been adjusting to a new position. Further, I'd rather send Korps in on the wing to retrieve the puck than Cally, who does tend to get knocked around and seemed, at times, to be a weak link on the cycle down low. I thought I remembered seeing Cally do pretty well at center - can't remember if it was in the NHL or AHL though.

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10-06-2008, 03:25 PM
  #454
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Dunno, I think Callahan does well on the wing too. He might be a bit weaker, but he's basically a relentless wrecking ball out there and going in hard on the forecheck tends to generate turnovers.

But if we're set on keeping that line together, I'd give him a shot at center.

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10-06-2008, 03:36 PM
  #455
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2 reasons why i think korpedo is a better center. hes defensively responsible and always has been even in finland and, as we have seen already, he creates on his own. he can make something happen with his speed and his smarts.

another thing that has impressed me so far is his strength on his skates and with the puck. he really can control the puck and makes sharp quick turns with possession. hes very good at keeping the puck.

to me, hes better suited for the middle.

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10-06-2008, 04:14 PM
  #456
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Watched a rerun of the game.

Some thoughts:
Positives
-I am very -- I don't know but like -- "happy"/"glad" to see Nikolai Zherdev play. He is dooing everything he possibly can to help this team win games. To be a team first player. Then he is a bit of a showboat at times, makes bad decisions and compared to how a Dane Byers would play he isn't exactly finnishing "every" check. But he is certainly trying to accomodate this team. Blocking shots, finnishing checks, taking short shifts, showing emotions and fireing up the team et c. And dooing so he will be valueble for us every night, even when he isn't scoring.

I actually never expected that. That tells you something about the surronding he got on this team, and allot about himself too of course. He just needed a fresh start.

-Dawes/Prucha vs Voros and bigger guys -- after watching the first game I thought Dawes time on this team had come almost. He just looked like a awful fit with Dubi and Z. We gave up more clean 3 on 2's in that game alone then basically what we did the last 40 games last season (we really never gave up any clean 3 on 2's, one of our forwards where always atleast able to catch one of the forwards on the other team).

But yesterday things looked much better. And you know, Prucha and Dawes certainly where contributing to their lines. We outshot Tampa like 18-3 in the 2nd period, Prucha and Dawes certainly contributed to that. But I don't think anything is final yet.

I like what I am seeing from Voros too. But Dawes and prucha certainly aren't complete wastes...

-There was a tad Luc Robitalle warning when it came to Markus Näslund. When can scratch that warning for sure. He looks great, don't get me wrong -- he won't "carry" this team. He will dissapear allot more often against the best teams for sure. There is a reason we got him for 4m per instead of 10m per which it would have cost to get someone who can step up and dominate against the best in the east.

However, another "cloud" is how he will stand the test of the eastern conference. Shanny started pretty strong too here in NY... But Näslund is a 73' born, Shanny was a 69'. I don't think its out of the question that he holds it together for the entire season. But thats not a give either.

Negatives
-I want Marc Staal out there more often, in a bigger role. Many are arguing for us to get a physical D; but I've always wondered what good that would do if he only could play 3 minute in the 3rd period in a PO game? Thats how much a 3rd pairing D often plays when the game is on the line. Sure it wouldn't hurt us to carry a 6th D with a meanstreak. But its Marc Staal who got to become that tough, defensive D for us. He needs to lay some big hits. He needs to shut down a AO. Its early in the year and I am still expecting Staal to step up, but so far he have started a tad slow.

We hype this kid allot and everyone is praising him all the time, me too. But he needs to grow too, he needs to start matching the play of a Mike Komisarek.

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10-06-2008, 04:17 PM
  #457
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Originally Posted by Ola View Post
However, another "cloud" is how he will stand the test of the eastern conference. Shanny started pretty strong too here in NY... But Näslund is a 73' born, Shanny was a 69'. I don't think its out of the question that he holds it together for the entire season. But thats not a give either.
Bad comparison Ola. Shanny was on pace for 60 goals and then got hurt in the collision with Knuble, the injury affected him badly IMO. and made him much more injury prone.

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10-06-2008, 04:27 PM
  #458
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Bad comparison Ola. Shanny was on pace for 60 goals and then got hurt in the collision with Knuble, the injury affected him badly IMO. and made him much more injury prone.
Näslund could collide with Knuble too.

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10-06-2008, 04:38 PM
  #459
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I dont' think Staal is ever going to be as physical as Komisarek, but he doesn't need to be in order to be as good or better than Mike

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10-06-2008, 05:41 PM
  #460
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
Watched a rerun of the game.

Some thoughts:
Positives
-I am very -- I don't know but like -- "happy"/"glad" to see Nikolai Zherdev play. He is dooing everything he possibly can to help this team win games. To be a team first player. Then he is a bit of a showboat at times, makes bad decisions and compared to how a Dane Byers would play he isn't exactly finnishing "every" check. But he is certainly trying to accomodate this team. Blocking shots, finnishing checks, taking short shifts, showing emotions and fireing up the team et c. And dooing so he will be valueble for us every night, even when he isn't scoring.

I actually never expected that. That tells you something about the surronding he got on this team, and allot about himself too of course. He just needed a fresh start.

-Dawes/Prucha vs Voros and bigger guys -- after watching the first game I thought Dawes time on this team had come almost. He just looked like a awful fit with Dubi and Z. We gave up more clean 3 on 2's in that game alone then basically what we did the last 40 games last season (we really never gave up any clean 3 on 2's, one of our forwards where always atleast able to catch one of the forwards on the other team).

But yesterday things looked much better. And you know, Prucha and Dawes certainly where contributing to their lines. We outshot Tampa like 18-3 in the 2nd period, Prucha and Dawes certainly contributed to that. But I don't think anything is final yet.

I like what I am seeing from Voros too. But Dawes and prucha certainly aren't complete wastes...

-There was a tad Luc Robitalle warning when it came to Markus Näslund. When can scratch that warning for sure. He looks great, don't get me wrong -- he won't "carry" this team. He will dissapear allot more often against the best teams for sure. There is a reason we got him for 4m per instead of 10m per which it would have cost to get someone who can step up and dominate against the best in the east.

However, another "cloud" is how he will stand the test of the eastern conference. Shanny started pretty strong too here in NY... But Näslund is a 73' born, Shanny was a 69'. I don't think its out of the question that he holds it together for the entire season. But thats not a give either.

Negatives
-I want Marc Staal out there more often, in a bigger role. Many are arguing for us to get a physical D; but I've always wondered what good that would do if he only could play 3 minute in the 3rd period in a PO game? Thats how much a 3rd pairing D often plays when the game is on the line. Sure it wouldn't hurt us to carry a 6th D with a meanstreak. But its Marc Staal who got to become that tough, defensive D for us. He needs to lay some big hits. He needs to shut down a AO. Its early in the year and I am still expecting Staal to step up, but so far he have started a tad slow.

We hype this kid allot and everyone is praising him all the time, me too. But he needs to grow too, he needs to start matching the play of a Mike Komisarek.
Thats unfair. Komisarek just over the past 2 years came into his own and really became a force that could play good defense to match his physical play..he's starting his 6th NHL season while Staal is starting his 2nd.

If you compared Komisarek's rookie season to Staals season last year Staal would have killed him in terms of play.

Staal will also be putting up more points then Komisarek has he further develops.

Both players are just not the same but both players will still be star defenseman in their zone.

Staal will hit more as he gains more experience, but you can't expect him to drilling guys into next week like Komisarek does on a regular basis.

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10-07-2008, 11:00 AM
  #461
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Just got a chance to watch all of Sunday's game...

For one, I can't quite see why people are bashing Dawes. He played quite well. Got several real good chances, skated hard, looked good out there. That line looks like it's still finding itself a bit, but if it does, it should be good. Dawes was involved and played well.

Second, the Korpikoski line looks good and seems like they're just inches away from a goal. They may be a bit more of an energy line, but they all know how to get into good position to be a scoring threat. I think Prucha still looks good out there, despite not scoring. He's getting into position, he's getting some chances, he just needs to keep it up. Korpikoski continues to use his skating to make things happen, but I'd like to see him shooting some more. That may be because he's playing center, I'm not sure.

In general, if the Rangers can continue to play like this against most teams in the league, they'll have a chance to do real well this year. It's mainly the puck control, quick skating, and relentless attitude. Keep that up and things will go well. The Rangers being a very well conditioned team will help too

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10-07-2008, 12:49 PM
  #462
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Levitate...

I think Dawes is doing a lot of nothing without the puck and aside from getting a couple shots off, isn't doing much to keep the play going in the offensive zone.

Agree on Prucha and somewhat on the line. They're getting good cycles, or at least going through the motions of a good cycle. I think not playing with each other extensively, ever, is one reason why the cycle gets broken up on occasion, and before a quality chance. Perhaps a few more practices and a couple more games and they'll be a good line that can possess the puck and score a goal here and there. Of course, with 9-10 minutes of ice time per game, the goal expectation is quite low. Hopefully the first one for the line creates confidence for the entire line and gets them going. It's been a pretty consistent line thus far.

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10-07-2008, 02:09 PM
  #463
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
If Cally is at center, I think that Korps plays better and the line plays better. I think Cally's more experienced and it's an easier transition for him than Korps. Hopefully he'll adjust, but I don't think he is the one who should've been adjusting to a new position. Further, I'd rather send Korps in on the wing to retrieve the puck than Cally, who does tend to get knocked around and seemed, at times, to be a weak link on the cycle down low. I thought I remembered seeing Cally do pretty well at center - can't remember if it was in the NHL or AHL though.
Fletch, KKK is a better skater (and therefore player) then Callahan already. That difference will grow. At some point, I predict, you will be embarrassed remembering that comparison. The rule of thumb is simple: play the best guy at C.

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10-07-2008, 02:24 PM
  #464
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Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
Just got a chance to watch all of Sunday's game...

For one, I can't quite see why people are bashing Dawes. He played quite well. Got several real good chances, skated hard, looked good out there. That line looks like it's still finding itself a bit, but if it does, it should be good. Dawes was involved and played well.
I agree. The problem there is he really played his best and still didn't match Dubi-Z pair. I think when he arrives in wherever place he will be traded to, he will be viewed as the guy who once played with Zherdev and/or Dubinski and/or Shanahan and/or Gomez. I hope it will help him to start well.

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10-07-2008, 04:05 PM
  #465
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94...

it's very silly to deduce that a player who is a better skater is a better player. That's simple nonsense, at least to me it is as I believe there's more to the game of hockey than just skating. Korps may very well be better than Cally one day, in fact I hope so because I don't see Cally as much more than a third liner who can have his inconsistencies. I think right now, Korps isn't better and I believe it's a matter of gaining experience and confidence.

And I'm not sure what comparison would make me embarassed at some point. That I said that I think Korps would make a better winger now and down the road? That I thought a guy with more NHL experience, and more pro experience, may be able to make the transition to a new position easier than a kid with one NHL game under his belt?

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10-08-2008, 12:56 PM
  #466
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
it's very silly to deduce that a player who is a better skater is a better player. That's simple nonsense, at least to me it is as I believe there's more to the game of hockey than just skating.
Not really... I mean, sure, there's stick part of it, but there's usually much greater parity among players there.

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And I'm not sure what comparison would make me embarassed at some point.

For Callahan playing C would be a promotion he didn't earn.
Callahan was very promicing, but the fact that he didn't gain much weight makes him what he is - a speedy winger. You cannot be effective on defence in NHL if you're under 200 lbs or so. Centre, whatever line he leads is always your 3rd D.

KKK is top 6 material. He already replaced Drury. If you disagree with Drury part, how about he beat Neved for the spot? He will replace Gomez, if healthy and not traded in 5 years. Very few would remember who Callahan was then. You won't beleave that you compared the two. I will remind you.

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10-08-2008, 03:35 PM
  #467
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uhhh, I still think that great skaters aren't necessarily the best players. Still need to be in the right place. Still need to position yourself properly. Still need to know where to skate and how to skate with your teammates. And you think there's parity among NHLers regarding stickhandling? I guess everyone has the same shot, same velocity, degree of accuracy, and ability to get it off in tight spots, in traffic, etc.

As for Cally - his move there, in my opinion, is more for Korps than anyone because I think Korps would be a better winger than centerma, and would be the kind of wingers this team needs - a guy who can go into the corner and hopefully come away with the puck.

As for your last point - I have to be honest, I don't know what you mean. Is KKK Korpikoski? How did he replace Drury? Drury's playing on a top line and Korps is on a third line getting less than 1/2 the ice time of Drury. Drury's there because management didn't think Korps is currently not six material. He beat Nedved? Nedved didn't have a chance. As long as Korps played OK, the team was going with youth. And honestly, is that a big accomplishment? The last game Nedved played in North America was for an AHL team.

And who compared Cally to Korps? I think you need to re-read my posts. I said I thought Korps would be better on the wing - I didn't say that Cally's a better player, nor did I say he will be a better player in 5 years.

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10-08-2008, 11:06 PM
  #468
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uhhh, I still think that great skaters aren't necessarily the best players. Still need to be in the right place. Still need to position yourself properly. Still need to know where to skate and how to skate with your teammates.
Among three major aspects skating by far more important compared to stick control and so called "hockey sense" (as you described it).
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And you think there's parity among NHLers regarding stickhandling? I guess everyone has the same shot, same velocity, degree of accuracy, and ability to get it off in tight spots, in traffic, etc.
Parity is not equality... I never intended to discount player's hands. However, it is skating ability that determine the player position.
The best skaters usually become defensemen or centres. (the latter actually could play any position, except goalie, perhaps) The rest play wing and usually only one side.
Now, the stickhandling. It does matter very much. That usually determines what line the player plays. Those with best stick skills become offensive forwards. The rest play bottom six. Obviously in reality it is not as simple as I has described, but it is close enough.
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How did he replace Drury? Drury's playing on a top line and Korps is on a third line getting less than 1/2 the ice time of Drury.
It is important to point out that although not every centre looks down at the wingers, the move from centre to a wing considered by most as a huge demotion. Its like, say move from starting pitcher to bullpen. Although Drury is on 1st line, he is no longer C. You've got to have Drury's heart to take it easy, because even on 3rd line, where he was last season, he was in charge of the unit whatever minutes he was afforded. Now KKK ( sorry, it is easier for me then remember weird spelling of his last name) has replaced Drury as 3rd line C. I think he is there to stay. And that is huge.
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He beat Nedved? Nedved didn't have a chance. As long as Korps played OK, the team was going with youth. And honestly, is that a big accomplishment? The last game Nedved played in North America was for an AHL team.
Last Nedved's game for this year Rangers pre-season. Nedved played great. And he aimed and the only spot available. That job went to KKK.

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I didn't say that Cally's a better player, nor did I say he will be a better player in 5 years.
Correct. I said that KKK is better already. This guy is the biggest discovery so far and may be the reason for us not being doomed. His wingers might be changed to whoever ( I think Renney will do that) with probably same outcome. He's got body, strength and skills to become PF, something Callahan will never be.

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10-09-2008, 02:43 AM
  #469
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Thats unfair. Komisarek just over the past 2 years came into his own and really became a force that could play good defense to match his physical play..he's starting his 6th NHL season while Staal is starting his 2nd.

If you compared Komisarek's rookie season to Staals season last year Staal would have killed him in terms of play.

Staal will also be putting up more points then Komisarek has he further develops.

Both players are just not the same but both players will still be star defenseman in their zone.

Staal will hit more as he gains more experience, but you can't expect him to drilling guys into next week like Komisarek does on a regular basis.
Unfair or not, I want to see that from Staal -- and I actually expects to see it atleast late this season.

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