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Old
10-27-2008, 02:35 AM
  #101
Soundwave
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Minny would very likely do Staal for Gaborik straight across.

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Old
10-27-2008, 12:48 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Minny would very likely do Staal for Gaborik straight across.
Don't know about that. And also, the Pens already have 2 guys making 8.7 million a year. We cannot add another one making in the ballpark of that amount.

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10-27-2008, 12:58 PM
  #103
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I like Staal. He is a solid center, 2nd line quality. The Pens however have 2 1st line centers and 3 other solid centers. Staal is a fantastic PK and I think that is where we would miss him the most, but I would be for trading him. We need a winger for Sid or Malkin. If we could trade Staal for a 1st or 2nd line winger, we would be much better off in the long fun.

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Old
10-27-2008, 01:06 PM
  #104
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Minny just put Gabby on IR so I have no desire to trade Staal for a guy who might not even play more then 20 games this year.

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Old
10-27-2008, 03:07 PM
  #105
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I love Staal and think its too early to move him unless he won't resign for a reasonable amount. That said I was bored and was thinking about this:

As has been said around here by a few people we have a guy playing wing that can keep up with Sid right now. It may not be ideal to everyone but if Malkin was okay with a permanent change to wing on the first line maybe we could move Staal to improve the 2nd line. Canucks fans have been talking about moving the Sedin twins since they are UFA's at the end of the year. How about something like this?

To Van: Staal + Sydor/Eaton + Kennedy

To Pit: D. Sedin and H. Sedin

Vancouver gets a possible future first line center, a solid wing, and bolster a weak defense with a veteran defenseman and Staal's defensive talent.

Pittsburgh gets 2/3 of a good line that excels at cycling the puck and made Anson Carter into a 30 goal scorer.

Possible lines come playoff time:

Malkin - Crosby - Sykora
Sedin - Sedin - Satan
Dupuis - Talbot - Pesonen
Fedetenko - Zigomanis - Cooke

Not too shabby in my opinion...

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Old
10-27-2008, 03:35 PM
  #106
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I love Staal and think its too early to move him unless he won't resign for a reasonable amount. That said I was bored and was thinking about this:

As has been said around here by a few people we have a guy playing wing that can keep up with Sid right now. It may not be ideal to everyone but if Malkin was okay with a permanent change to wing on the first line maybe we could move Staal to improve the 2nd line. Canucks fans have been talking about moving the Sedin twins since they are UFA's at the end of the year. How about something like this?

To Van: Staal + Sydor/Eaton + Kennedy

To Pit: D. Sedin and H. Sedin

Vancouver gets a possible future first line center, a solid wing, and bolster a weak defense with a veteran defenseman and Staal's defensive talent.

Pittsburgh gets 2/3 of a good line that excels at cycling the puck and made Anson Carter into a 30 goal scorer.

Possible lines come playoff time:

Malkin - Crosby - Sykora
Sedin - Sedin - Satan
Dupuis - Talbot - Pesonen
Fedetenko - Zigomanis - Cooke

Not too shabby in my opinion...
A trade like that might be reasonable, but who knows what those two are going to want in salary. I'd rather not give up a bunch of players if we aren't going to be able to resign them

Malkin-Crosby-Sykora 8.7 8.7 3*
Sedin-Sedin-XXX 6-6-2*
Cooke-Talbot-Dupuis 1.2-1.2*-1.2
Godard-Zigomanis-XXX .750-.750*-.750*

That's 40 million dollars in forwards. That won't work. We'll have around 5.7 tied up in goalies and 17 or so tied up in defenseman, if Eaton is traded in that package. That goes over the cap even if it goes to 60m, which it won't. Even if you replace Sykora with a guy that costs 1m, and a winger for the Sedin line that costs 1m, that's still over.

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Old
10-27-2008, 03:54 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AgentM View Post
I love Staal and think its too early to move him unless he won't resign for a reasonable amount. That said I was bored and was thinking about this:

As has been said around here by a few people we have a guy playing wing that can keep up with Sid right now. It may not be ideal to everyone but if Malkin was okay with a permanent change to wing on the first line maybe we could move Staal to improve the 2nd line. Canucks fans have been talking about moving the Sedin twins since they are UFA's at the end of the year. How about something like this?

To Van: Staal + Sydor/Eaton + Kennedy

To Pit: D. Sedin and H. Sedin

Vancouver gets a possible future first line center, a solid wing, and bolster a weak defense with a veteran defenseman and Staal's defensive talent.

Pittsburgh gets 2/3 of a good line that excels at cycling the puck and made Anson Carter into a 30 goal scorer.

Possible lines come playoff time:

Malkin - Crosby - Sykora
Sedin - Sedin - Satan
Dupuis - Talbot - Pesonen
Fedetenko - Zigomanis - Cooke

Not too shabby in my opinion...
First of all, that trade would never happen from a van pov, as it would leave even more holes in our top 6.

Second of all, Van does not have a weak defense that needs bolstering as you put it. From 1-6, van has one of the best d cores in the league, no debate.

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Old
10-27-2008, 04:06 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by BATJAM View Post
First of all, that trade would never happen from a van pov, as it would leave even more holes in our top 6.

Second of all, Van does not have a weak defense that needs bolstering as you put it. From 1-6, van has one of the best d cores in the league, no debate.
Sorry, from the talk on your board it sounded like the D and Luongo weren't playing up to expectations.

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Old
10-27-2008, 05:02 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AgentM View Post
I love Staal and think its too early to move him unless he won't resign for a reasonable amount. That said I was bored and was thinking about this:

As has been said around here by a few people we have a guy playing wing that can keep up with Sid right now. It may not be ideal to everyone but if Malkin was okay with a permanent change to wing on the first line maybe we could move Staal to improve the 2nd line. Canucks fans have been talking about moving the Sedin twins since they are UFA's at the end of the year. How about something like this?

To Van: Staal + Sydor/Eaton + Kennedy

To Pit: D. Sedin and H. Sedin

Vancouver gets a possible future first line center, a solid wing, and bolster a weak defense with a veteran defenseman and Staal's defensive talent.

Pittsburgh gets 2/3 of a good line that excels at cycling the puck and made Anson Carter into a 30 goal scorer.

Possible lines come playoff time:

Malkin - Crosby - Sykora
Sedin - Sedin - Satan
Dupuis - Talbot - Pesonen
Fedetenko - Zigomanis - Cooke

Not too shabby in my opinion...
Don't let Vancouver fans see this post. Good God. A young player at a low point in his value, a choice of two aging defensemen and an average 3rd liner for two first line players? What have you been smoking?

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Old
10-27-2008, 06:39 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Brandinho View Post
Don't let Vancouver fans see this post. Good God. A young player at a low point in his value, a choice of two aging defensemen and an average 3rd liner for two first line players? What have you been smoking?
Well a lot of people think Staal for Gaborik is fair. And some Canucks fans want to move the twins for Gabby.

I was originally going to say Staal and Whitney for the Sedins but figured I'd get yelled at for that not being fair to the Pens haha.

Maybe a three way trade between these teams where the Pens get the Sedins, Vancouver gets Gaborik, and Minnesota gets Staal + would work?

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Old
10-27-2008, 06:48 PM
  #111
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Would the Pens consider

Erik Cole + Ladislav Smid

for

Jordan Staal + 2nd rounder

Or something?

Note though Cole is a UFA at year end, though I get the feeling he will want to sign in the States and Pittsburgh could be a good fit for him. Sid with Cole I think would be an awesome combo though and Cole is more skilled and every bit as tough.

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Old
10-27-2008, 06:50 PM
  #112
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I'd keep Staal and try to package Whitney, Keven Veilleux, Janne Pesonen and their choice of Satan, Fedotenko or Sykora for Gaborik. If that doesn't work, add an asset to the equation. It's hard to figure out what the Wild would want because they are so different in player evaluation than other teams.

But if they insist on Staal, I would stop negotiating. This isn't the right time to move Jordan. And it's not a fait accomplis yet that he won't re-sign with us.

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Old
10-27-2008, 06:51 PM
  #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Would the Pens consider

Erik Cole + Ladislav Smid

for

Jordan Staal + 2nd rounder

Or something?

Note though Cole is a UFA at year end, though I get the feeling he will want to sign in the States and Pittsburgh could be a good fit for him. Sid with Cole I think would be an awesome combo though and Cole is more skilled and every bit as tough.
Cole has big appeal but his UFA status and Staal's inclusion in such a deal would be a non-starter for me. Hopefully for Shero too.

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Old
10-27-2008, 06:56 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
Cole has big appeal but his UFA status and Staal's inclusion in such a deal would be a non-starter for me. Hopefully for Shero too.
It's a fair point, though Smid I think is going to be a really steady player for a long time and has a big projectable frame to work with. Also I think it'll be easier to resign a Cole than it was say Hossa or a Gaborik.

Is Staal currently playing on Malkin's line or what's the deal? I'm somewhat concerned by his numbers.

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10-27-2008, 06:58 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Would the Pens consider

Erik Cole + Ladislav Smid

for

Jordan Staal + 2nd rounder

Or something?

Note though Cole is a UFA at year end, though I get the feeling he will want to sign in the States and Pittsburgh could be a good fit for him. Sid with Cole I think would be an awesome combo though and Cole is more skilled and every bit as tough.
I'm not usually one for shooting down proposals based on personal rivalries between players (most guys are consummate professionals and can overcome past frictions), but Cole and Orpik are kind of a special case, what with Brooksy having broken his neck and all. Cole comes across as still being pretty bitter about it, and Free Candy's locked up for a good long time.

Plus I think Staal's too much to give up for any UFA anyway.

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Old
10-27-2008, 07:03 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
It's a fair point, though Smid I think is going to be a really steady player for a long time and has a big projectable frame to work with. Also I think it'll be easier to resign a Cole than it was say Hossa or a Gaborik.
But Cole just got traded to Edmonton, is he not fitting in well there? I could see him getting traded at the deadline though if the Oilers are out of it since he will be a UFA like you guys were saying.

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Old
10-27-2008, 07:04 PM
  #117
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But Cole just got traded to Edmonton, is he not fitting in well there? I could see him getting traded at the deadline though if the Oilers are out of it since he will be a UFA like you guys were saying.
The problem is Cole really likes to play RW, and we have Hemsky as basically our franchise guy who plays RW too ... and we basically have 7 top-six forwards, so it's creating this weird log jam. I like his game a lot though, I'm just worried Mac T will mismanage his minutes/linemates like he did with Lupul (who is doing much better now in Philly).

The other thing is Cole is a US born guy, my gut just tells me he will want to resign somewhere in the States, I figure Pittsburgh is as good of a place as any.

EDIT: I forgot Orpik is the one who broke Cole's neck. Ouch, lol. Yeah that might be tough for Cole to get over.

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Old
10-27-2008, 07:15 PM
  #118
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Given the fact that Staal seems to be best suited for the C position, and that barring injury, he won't supplant either Crosby or Malkin, how would everyone feel about letting him hit the RFA market?

If someone steps in and signs Staal to a rediculous contract, the Pens could take the 4 picks, or work a trade. They would have some leverage, as most teams would be against giving up 4 straight years of #1 picks. On the flip side, teams would most likely avoid signing him to a reasonable deal given that the Pens could match.

This scenario would allow the Pens to go after a higher tier veteran winger or two in UFA, while allowing them to re-stock their farm with 4 additional #1 picks......The vet wingers would have a larger impact on the team than Staal would.

Just a thought....

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Old
10-27-2008, 07:18 PM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
The problem is Cole really likes to play RW, and we have Hemsky as basically our franchise guy who plays RW too ... and we basically have 7 top-six forwards, so it's creating this weird log jam. I like his game a lot though, I'm just worried Mac T will mismanage his minutes/linemates like he did with Lupul (who is doing much better now in Philly).

The other thing is Cole is a US born guy, my gut just tells me he will want to resign somewhere in the States, I figure Pittsburgh is as good of a place as any.

EDIT: I forgot Orpik is the one who broke Cole's neck. Ouch, lol. Yeah that might be tough for Cole to get over.
Okay, that makes sense and with coach Therrien we know all about guys getting moved around and not put in the best spot to succeed.

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10-27-2008, 07:38 PM
  #120
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If our hand were forced to deal Staal after this season, I'd like to see something like Beach, Bolland, and the option to switch 1sts at the draft.

We'd get our future big nasty scoring winger, another bottom 6 center to help replace Staal, and likely a better draft spot to replenish the system. Chicago would get a big young two-way scoring center with Finals experience to complement Toews, and Staal's current less-than-stellar playmaking abilities could be compensated for with Kane's wizardry.

Sharp-Toews-?????
?????-Staal-Kane

Doesn't look too bad to me.


Last edited by Rowdy Roddy Peeper: 10-27-2008 at 07:44 PM.
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Old
10-27-2008, 07:40 PM
  #121
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I think you guys have to get a good winger for Sid that can be resigned for under $5 mill or so in a deal for Staal. That's just my gut feeling. I think you could actually target Sundin then if he's serious about coming back later on in the year with all the cap relief you have w/Gonchar + Whitney being on IR and make another run for the Cup come spring.

You guys should've snapped up Lupul from us (Oilers) rather than Philly, he'd be alright with Sid I think.

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Old
10-27-2008, 07:48 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
I'd keep Staal and try to package Whitney, Keven Veilleux, Janne Pesonen and their choice of Satan, Fedotenko or Sykora for Gaborik. If that doesn't work, add an asset to the equation. It's hard to figure out what the Wild would want because they are so different in player evaluation than other teams.

But if they insist on Staal, I would stop negotiating. This isn't the right time to move Jordan. And it's not a fait accomplis yet that he won't re-sign with us.
Ray Shero would be sitting funny for a while, because in that deal, he's getting ****ed in the ass. Gaborik would only be playing for the team for a few months at best until he had to be resigned, which is far from a sure thing. And yeah, cool, let's get Crosby his winger, while potentially giving away Malkin's. No thanks to that deal.

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10-27-2008, 08:04 PM
  #123
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If our hand were forced to deal Staal after this season, I'd like to see something like Beach, Bolland, and the option to switch 1sts at the draft.

We'd get our future big nasty scoring winger, another bottom 6 center to help replace Staal, and likely a better draft spot to replenish the system. Chicago would get a big young two-way scoring center with Finals experience to complement Toews, and Staal's current less-than-stellar playmaking abilities could be compensated for with Kane's wizardry.

Sharp-Toews-?????
?????-Staal-Kane

Doesn't look too bad to me.

I like that trade but what do you think of Brouwer?

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Old
10-27-2008, 08:27 PM
  #124
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I like that trade but what do you think of Brouwer?
He's fine, but I prefer Beach as a centerpiece scoring prospect, and I'd rather have Bolland as a well-rounded bottom 6er.

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10-27-2008, 08:45 PM
  #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AgentM View Post
Well a lot of people think Staal for Gaborik is fair. And some Canucks fans want to move the twins for Gabby.

I was originally going to say Staal and Whitney for the Sedins but figured I'd get yelled at for that not being fair to the Pens haha.

Maybe a three way trade between these teams where the Pens get the Sedins, Vancouver gets Gaborik, and Minnesota gets Staal + would work?
Just because the lunatic fringe of the Canucks fanbase wants to move the Sedins doesn't mean it's even remotely realistic. If the Canucks get Gaborik, the Sedins absolutely won't be a part of the deal. They're not going anywhere unless they leave in free agency.

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