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OT - Lucian Bute (22-0-0) vs. Librado Andrade (27-1-0) - IBF Super Middleweight Bout

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Old
10-28-2008, 02:31 PM
  #201
mcphee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
There was no way for the ref to know how much time is left in the timer after Bute went down. That's all estimation on his part and he can't take that risk. So what does he do? He makes sure 10 seconds passes and Bute gets a clear enough head to "respond" (which he still didn't by the way) by getting on Andrades case about not being in the corner.

Also, notice how the bell sounds after the ref checks to see if Bute was able to continue.

Anyweyz, I've seen enough fights to know favoritism when I see one.
I've seen a lot of fights and a lot of weird endings including 'no mas', but what makes this one weird is that while everyone seems very quick to take sides and explain, everyone seems to avoid the actual facts. An obvious questiuon then is what the ref knew in terms of time. If you're assuming that he wouldn't know that, well fine, but I have to believe that he knows that, whether it's a glance to the timekeeper or the clock. I believe it's relevant.

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Old
10-28-2008, 02:44 PM
  #202
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It was said, repeatedly that the timekeeper signals the 10 secs left and everyone, including the ref and the coaches heard this signal before Bute fell down. The demonstrations I saw on TV were placing that moment between 2:55 and 2:58. The bell sound only came after the referee decision - but the round was finished long before.

Also - according to all experts, all Bute had to do is stand up on his feet at 8 to exclude KO. The part about proving he is capable of continuing is not relevant since the game was over.

And I agree that those who are so vehement about "robbery" and "favouritism" are very quick in ignoring the actual facts and relying on subjective perceptions.

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10-28-2008, 05:20 PM
  #203
m00ks
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If all Bute had to do was stand up on his feet at 8 and the he fell with 3-5 seconds left as the TV timer indicated, then the bell should have sounded as soon as he got up. But Bute was able to get up, the ref was able to waste 5-6 counts telling Andrade to get back in his corner and check to see if Bute was able to continue BEFORE the bell sounded. What's the deal?

Any, no sense beating this drum over and over again. Ref had authority and he exercised it, wheter some of us liked how he did it or not.

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10-28-2008, 05:35 PM
  #204
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http://www.tsn.ca/blogs/russ_anber/?id=254008

Since you do not consider me a reliable source (I can understand that, I'm biased as hell towards Bute) - check Russ Anber's point of view. Note that during his live comments he was also on the "Andrade was robbed" side. Then he watched the tape many times.

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10-28-2008, 05:40 PM
  #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
If all Bute had to do was stand up on his feet at 8 and the he fell with 3-5 seconds left as the TV timer indicated, then the bell should have sounded as soon as he got up. But Bute was able to get up, the ref was able to waste 5-6 counts telling Andrade to get back in his corner and check to see if Bute was able to continue BEFORE the bell sounded. What's the deal?

Any, no sense beating this drum over and over again. Ref had authority and he exercised it, wheter some of us liked how he did it or not.
Isnt it more like it's Andrade himself that wasted thoses seconds by not being where he should be ?

I mean, when the ref look at him and tell him to go in the corner he's almost at the center of the ring... and it's not like Andrade didnt know the rule...



to continue what ?

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Old
10-28-2008, 05:49 PM
  #206
m00ks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newhabfan View Post
http://www.tsn.ca/blogs/russ_anber/?id=254008

Since you do not consider me a reliable source (I can understand that, I'm biased as hell towards Bute) - check Russ Anber's point of view. Note that during his live comments he was also on the "Andrade was robbed" side. Then he watched the tape many times.
I love Russ Amber but even he is biased towards canadian based fighters.

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Old
10-28-2008, 08:30 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
I love Russ Amber but even he is biased towards canadian based fighters.
Two sentences.Two facts.

a) Bute falls down 5 seconds before the end of the game.

b) Bute is back on his feet 8 seconds after he was down.

Please tell me which of these two sentences do you consider false. Cause if they are both right, then I have it hard to understand your position.

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Old
10-28-2008, 08:37 PM
  #208
m00ks
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Originally Posted by Newhabfan View Post
Two sentences.Two facts.

a) Bute falls down 5 seconds before the end of the game.

b) Bute is back on his feet 8 seconds after he was down.

Please tell me which of these two sentences do you consider false. Cause if they are both right, then I have it hard to understand your position.
One sentence and one fact.

Why wasn't the bell rung as soon as he was up?

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Old
10-28-2008, 09:34 PM
  #209
Newhabfan
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
One sentence and one fact.

Why wasn't the bell rung as soon as he was up?
Discussion here:

http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=17659&more=1

Next you will want me to prove that eastsideboxing is a reliable source, then you'll say it's biased.


P.S. - In all honesty, I did some research and this article was written by a "biased towards Bute" source. However it was accepted by the site and at least some of the content should be considered.


Last edited by Habs10Habs: 10-28-2008 at 10:19 PM. Reason: Don't quote the whole article.
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Old
10-28-2008, 10:17 PM
  #210
m00ks
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You don't go by the website, you go by the writers. Please me who A.R. is to the boxing world.

This is my last post since I don't want to argue anymore. Once Bute gets KTFO by Kessler, Calzaghe, Taylor, Pavlik or any other elite fighters, this "controversy" will be forgotten.

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Old
10-28-2008, 10:51 PM
  #211
CareyPrice x 31
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IBF president says no complain has been placed yet (Andrade and his crew have 10 days to do so).

Also says the ref did his job the way it should have been done. Their was nothing wrong with the 12th round

...dont shoot the messanger

www.rds.ca

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Old
10-29-2008, 08:33 AM
  #212
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The more I read about this, the more I feel clan Andrade looks like the Boston Bruins...

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Old
10-29-2008, 10:00 AM
  #213
Whitesnake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
One sentence and one fact.

Why wasn't the bell rung as soon as he was up?
'Cause I believe you have to let the referee finish his own count. And then it was rung.

Really the only "controversy" was about the fact that Bute wasn't really defending himself when there was 30 seconds left in the bout. But as a champion, and as the guy who won almost all the rounds, the referee decided to let the champ fall on his knees instead of calling a TKO on a guy still standing. The only thing the referee may, and I stress may, have done wrong is that he could have put Bute in danger by not stopping the fight earlier when he wasn't defending himself too much. But I do believe that while it's not in the rules, the champion will always have the benefit of the doubt, at least way more than a guy would have been destroyed all night long and then being punched while standing up was really not helping him in any way.


Last edited by Whitesnake: 10-29-2008 at 10:15 AM.
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