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Old
11-02-2008, 12:37 PM
  #51
SuperUnknown
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I think everyone has to remember we're only 10 games into the season. O'Byrne hasn't played well so far, but he's still young and doesn't have a lot of NHL experience. He's our 6th/7th defenseman, we shouldn't expect him to play every night like a top 4. Montreal will give him at least another season before they ship him out. Otherwise, we're just wasting talent for nothing.

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11-02-2008, 12:38 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Gil128 View Post
I looked at previous posts regarding Mike Komisarek, there were lots of calls from ""supposed experts"" calling for his head, get rid of him, he will never amount to anything they said, I see alot of Komi in O'Bryne, he just has to play more agressive use his size, once he gets steady amount of ice time, he will get his confidence, I agree if his name was Leclaire or the like the media would not be so rough
You hit the nail on the head with that one.

Why do you think the media never bashes Lats, Begin or Bou????

It has everything to do with the name.

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11-02-2008, 12:38 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Lord Chezz View Post
Where the heck is Irish Blues when you need him?
You know, we have a sticky for this. Anyone can go check.

O'Byrne does not have to clear waivers !!!

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11-02-2008, 12:39 PM
  #54
Stanley Foobrick
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The guy needs to come back from an injury or not have played in a while. Otherwise it's not conditioning...

I'd love for you to show me where it says that in any NHL reference material...........

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Old
11-02-2008, 12:47 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Blue'sClues View Post
I'd love for you to show me where it says that (injury or layoff needed to be considered "conditioning stint") in any NHL reference material...........
How about someone show us why O'Byrne should have to clear waivers???

Some NHL reference material would be nice.

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11-02-2008, 12:47 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Gainey#1 View Post
You hit the nail on the head with that one.

Why do you think the media never bashes Lats, Begin or Bou????

It has everything to do with the name.
The media has bashed Latendresse. A lot. The media was calling for Begin's head after the double penalties. No-one goes for Boullion because he is a solid third string D-man and there's nothing wrong with this play (though we won't keep him at the end of the season).

What you've done, is taken the hype he got from the start of his career and passed it off as to what the French Canadian media has been saying the entire time.

The truth to French Canadian media is they beat you when you are down and they cheer you when you are up, acting like they never beat you down while still holding the club behind their back. It's a lot like sports media everywhere else, only it has a french canadian bias that means if a french canadian player is down, you should hate him for insulting the pride of the Habs, and when he is up, he is a hero to the community.

That's it. Now go honour what you said during the Isles game.

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Old
11-02-2008, 12:53 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
You know, we have a sticky for this. Anyone can go check.

O'Byrne does not have to clear waivers !!!

I took a look in the cap thread and the roster thread and it doesnt list who is waiver exempt and who isnt.

Mind you I skimmed through it and perhaps I missed it, but regardless, you answered my question.

I mentioned IB because he seems to jump in whenever someone has cap questions.

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Old
11-02-2008, 12:58 PM
  #58
C-Saku Koivu MTL
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I was never a big fan of O'Byrne and this year he has been worst then last year but we are only 10 games into the season. We can't send him down and our other option is Brisebois who has'nt played much better than Ryan.
We need his size and we sure could use his defensive play if it could come around. Poeple named Komi to compare but there is also Braydon Coburn (who was the 8th pick in 2003) in Philly who did'nt look all that good (if not awful) in Atlanta and they gave up on him too quickly.
We need a top 4 defenceman, I think everyone can agree to that, but we're not in a position to make a trade right now for a good one. First, they aren't available right now and second, we don't have the cap space. Our only option is to play him and let him get himself out of that slump.

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Old
11-02-2008, 12:58 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
While I agree that Obyrne needs time to grow as a player, I don't think this issue should be overlooked simply because the team is winning. Everything is not fine. You have a gaping hole in your top 4 and when you often play a shortened defensive corps in the third to win games, that will take a toll eventually.

Just like last year. We lived and died with the PP and it came to bite us in the playoffs. If one of our top 3 gets injured, we're not going deep. I still feel that BG will address this issue.
That's a a bunch of garbage. Last year, we were 9th in the NHL in 5-on-5 goals with 148. That's 4 goals better than Pittsburgh's 144 with all that offensive talent.

This year, our PP is currently ranked 19th in the NHL and we only have one regulation loss after 10 games. Also, despite our 19th ranked PP, we're in third place in the entire NHL in goals for per game with 3.50. Only Philly (3.90) and Detroit (3.54) are ahead of us.

What killed us in the playoff series versus Philly was that numerous aspects of our game (PP, goaltending, defense) all went south at the same time and we were low on forwards who were willing to pay the price inside the perimeter, along the walls, and in front of the net.

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Old
11-02-2008, 01:40 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
O'B is two years younger than Komi.... Komi two years ago >>>>>> O'b now.

O'b will never be as good as Komi... and thats fine... we aren't expecting that... he needs to be a solid Dman for us... someone we can put in a 4-6 spot and be confident in. He'll get there.

Komi was a top 10 draft pick.. O'b was a fourth rounder... there is a reason for that.
While that may be true Beaker, Komi two years ago had about 100 more games of experience than O'Byrne.

Although I agree, Ryan will never have the potential Komi has, I still feel he can a solid D.
But I guess that 8Games is enough for some people here to evaluate one's skills.

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Old
11-02-2008, 02:21 PM
  #61
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The situation with O'byrne really depends on his waiver status, so I tried to look around CBA a bit in order to find the answer.

Ryan O'byrne was born 19 July 1984. IUsing the definition of age in the CBA, he was 22 years old when he signed his SPC (season 2006-07).

Quote:
Originally Posted by "CBA, article 13
13.4 Exempt Players. Players who meet the criteria set forth below are exempt from Regular and Re-Entry-Waivers:
Code:
          SKATERS
Age     Years from
          Signing        NHL Games
          -NHL               Played              
18          5                 160
19          4                 160
20          3                 160
21          3                  80
22          3                  70
23          3                  60
24          2                  60
25+        1                    1
As used above, NHL Games include NHL Regular Season and NHL
Playoff Games.

...

The first season in which a Player who is age 20 or older plays in one (1) or more Professional Games shall constitute the first year for calculating the number of years he is exempt from Regular Waivers and Re-Entry Waivers
Per definition of CBA, Professional Games includes the following: any NHL Games played, all minor league regular season and playoff games and any other professional games played, including but not limited to, games played in any European league or any other league outside North America, by a Player pursuant to his SPC.

Since O'byrne was 22 when he signed his SPC, he would be extempt for 3 seasons (or 70 NHL games, whichever comes first). This season (08-09) is O'byrne's third professional season (06-07 in AHL, 07-08 split in AHL/NHL and not 08-09 in NHL) and he has played in total 45 NHL games, so my interpretation of CBA would be...

O'byrne is waiver extempt untill he plays his 33rd NHL game this season (bringing his total (regular season+playoffs) to 70), after that point he is no longer waiver extempt.

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Old
11-02-2008, 02:28 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Noldo View Post
The situation with O'byrne really depends on his waiver status, so I tried to look around CBA a bit in order to find the answer.

Ryan O'byrne was born 19 July 1984. IUsing the definition of age in the CBA, he was 22 years old when he signed his SPC (season 2006-07).



Per definition of CBA, Professional Games includes the following: any NHL Games played, all minor league regular season and playoff games and any other professional games played, including but not limited to, games played in any European league or any other league outside North America, by a Player pursuant to his SPC.

Since O'byrne was 22 when he signed his SPC, he would be extempt for 3 seasons (or 70 NHL games, whichever comes first). This season (08-09) is O'byrne's third professional season (06-07 in AHL, 07-08 split in AHL/NHL and not 08-09 in NHL) and he has played in total 45 NHL games, so my interpretation of CBA would be...

O'byrne is waiver extempt untill he plays his 33rd NHL game this season (bringing his total (regular season+playoffs) to 70), after that point he is no longer waiver extempt.
You might be right, but I would think the status changes after the season, not in the middle, so he'd be waiver exempt according to your explanations, but for the whole year according to my logic.

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Old
11-02-2008, 02:29 PM
  #63
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Like François Beauchemin and Mike Ribeiro?
No I believe he's referring to Claude Lemiuex, Patrick Roy, Pierre Turgeon and Vincent Damphousse.

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Old
11-02-2008, 02:30 PM
  #64
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no.3

I love how everyone compares Ryan to komi. Who in my opinion has been the biggest disappointment on defense this year. Talk about a guy who can't make a first pass. Komi has been terrible. Ryan has better offensive skill than Komi, Ryan just lacking some confidents right now. But I thought the NY game was his best. To top it off Ryan has played 7games in a month. Hard to find a rythem. Montreal definitly needs more puck moving dmen though

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Old
11-02-2008, 02:35 PM
  #65
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O'B can be sent to Hamilton but I'll bet that doesn't happen. I love how the team is 8-1-1 and yet the fans want to send down our 7th D. O'Byrne has gotten the least amount of ice time among the D per average, a hair less then Brezzy in the same # of games and Bouillon has a little more then the other two. So O'B is getting just over 15 minutes per game, he's Even on the year and while he's had some shaky play I don't think he's been that bad.

Last night when watching the game on CI through NYI's broadcast, they kept talking about him saying what a reach he has and that he had made a couple good plays in his own end.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, give O'B 2 more years to improve and develop his game. He's a work in progress, he needs to be a lot better and if Gainey feels he needs to move him at some point to sure up the D then so be it. But calling for him to be send down is crazy to me, but the complaints will shift from O'B to Brezzy cause despite being 8-1-1, people have to complain about something right?

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11-02-2008, 02:41 PM
  #66
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O'Byrne should be switched with Georges and be on 3rd pair with Bouillon.

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11-02-2008, 02:44 PM
  #67
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O'Byrne is terrible. I haven't seen him improve a bit since last season. He even got worse. "Mr. Icing" must learn to "pivot" and stop falling on his ass for no reason.

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11-02-2008, 02:46 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by ReVeuF View Post
O'Byrne should be switched with Georges and be on 3rd pair with Bouillon.
What does it matter who he plays with? He gets the least amount of ice time so he's the bottom pairing D. Hammer is our #2 D man in ice time, so I think it's good to put our most experienced D with our most inexperienced D, it's not like he's out there every time Hammer is, since Hammer gets 22 minutes a game, that 7 more minutes then O'B per game.

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11-02-2008, 02:47 PM
  #69
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O'byrne was not that bad last season, he is really cold right now.

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11-02-2008, 02:47 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by ReVeuF View Post
O'Byrne should be switched with Georges and be on 3rd pair with Bouillon.
He already plays less minutes than Gorges... why would you do this..... we have a very strong first pairing...; and 2 balanced 2nd-3rd pairings right now.

O'B gets switched with Gorges for PK and late in the game... but when we need to roll all three... they go for balance on the 2nd-3rd.

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11-02-2008, 02:54 PM
  #71
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You might be right, but I would think the status changes after the season, not in the middle, so he'd be waiver exempt according to your explanations, but for the whole year according to my logic.
No, as soon as he plays his 70th NHL game, he is eligible for waivers.

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11-02-2008, 03:44 PM
  #72
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Or maybe because of a pretentious, "know it all" attitude from a 22 post newbie.
Props for your 900 posts.

You must know a lot more than me about hockey.

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11-02-2008, 03:50 PM
  #73
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I think we should continue to give O'B time to develop in the NHL, there are a number of things that will take him time to improve and I think he will become a very useful player for us in time.

One thing I really want to see him address ASAP though is his strength on his skates, especially along the boards. Sometimes he is fine, but sometimes it's almost as though he doesn't know how much of his strength he is allowed to use and he gets pushed around and knocked over. He reminds me of Tree from the film Mystery, Alaska. For those who've seen it, watching O'B get pushed around reminds me of that scene where Crowe asks him if he thinks his character is a big guy, then sets about showing him that he is able to use his size more effectively. The passing, puck carrying, etc will take time, but I'd love to see him be stronger out there. Not necessarily going for the big hit more often, just using his size to the max all the time.

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Old
11-02-2008, 03:52 PM
  #74
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No, as soon as he plays his 70th NHL game, he is eligible for waivers.
But he is exempt from RE-ENTRY waivers for the whole year.

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Old
11-02-2008, 03:58 PM
  #75
Kriss E
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O'B can be sent to Hamilton but I'll bet that doesn't happen. I love how the team is 8-1-1 and yet the fans want to send down our 7th D. O'Byrne has gotten the least amount of ice time among the D per average, a hair less then Brezzy in the same # of games and Bouillon has a little more then the other two. So O'B is getting just over 15 minutes per game, he's Even on the year and while he's had some shaky play I don't think he's been that bad.


I've said it before and I'll say it again, give O'B 2 more years to improve and develop his game. He's a work in progress, he needs to be a lot better and if Gainey feels he needs to move him at some point to sure up the D then so be it. But calling for him to be send down is crazy to me, but the complaints will shift from O'B to Brezzy cause despite being 8-1-1, people have to complain about something right?
Not only that, but before yesterday, we were tied for the least Goals for. We now only have 1 more GA than Minny.

Some people don't seem to understand how long it takes to develop. After a mere 8Games Played, they feel he's a waste.

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