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Why is it always Guillaume that copes?

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Old
11-07-2008, 09:22 AM
  #1
Iwishihadacup
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Why is it always Guillaume that copes?

2 days ago in l'antichambre, they talked about the line changes, and the brought up the point that Guillaume was always getting owned when people came back from injuries. When Higgins came back, Lats ice time got almost split in two while his presence on the powerplay became inexistent. They also say... And I agree on this, that if Sergei was french and quebecer, he would already be in the pressbox and in the fans' doghouse


This lead to my main question:

Is Gui mishandling Gui?

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11-07-2008, 09:34 AM
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Chomsky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
2 days ago in l'antichambre, they talked about the line changes, and the brought up the point that Guillaume was always getting owned when people came back from injuries. When Higgins came back, Lats ice time got almost split in two while his presence on the powerplay became inexistent. They also say... And I agree on this, that if Sergei was french and quebecer, he would already be in the pressbox and in the fans' doghouse


This lead to my main question:

Is Gui mishandling Gui?
Since when playing with Lang and Sergei is a huge demotion?

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11-07-2008, 09:34 AM
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I don't think so. Its not like our third line is as crappy as last year. As for Higgins getting his spot back, well the moment Higgins was back in the line-up Latendresse started looking over his shoulder and playing less than stellar (when compared to how he came out of the gate).

Therefore Carbo is merely removing the pressure that Latendresse put on his own shoulders. So in truth its giving Gui a better chance to get his game back underway (i.e. managing him rather well).

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11-07-2008, 09:35 AM
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Iwishihadacup
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chomsky View Post
Since when playing with Lang and Sergei is a huge demotion?
well, a slumping Serge and Lang is worst than an on fire koivu, an excellent Tanguay and pp time

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11-07-2008, 09:37 AM
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Chomsky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
well, a slumping Serge and Lang is worst than an on fire koivu, an excellent Tanguay and pp time
He didn't have any PP time even when he was on this line with the exception of one game, where he replaced kostitsyn.

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11-07-2008, 09:39 AM
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Higgins is a better hockey player then Latendresse. Why is this such a difficult concept for people to understand? That is why he is playing with Koivu and Tanguay.

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11-07-2008, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
well, a slumping Serge and Lang is worst than an on fire koivu, an excellent Tanguay and pp time
Interestingly enough, Latendresse has only 1 pt in the last 5 or 6 games even though Koivu and Tanguay are on fire as you put it.

Its a case of what have you done for me lately...keep the ethnicity crap out of it, it only proves insecurity.

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11-07-2008, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Chomsky View Post
He didn't have any PP time even when he was on this line with the exception of one game, where he replaced kostitsyn.

I beg to differ, the stats says it another way he had one point recently on the pp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuggy View Post
Higgins is a better hockey player then Latendresse. Why is this such a difficult concept for people to understand? That is why he is playing with Koivu and Tanguay.
Then, if he is the better player, he should be the one to be put on the third to launch back serge, not gui

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arctic_Hab_Fan View Post
Interestingly enough, Latendresse has only 1 pt in the last 5 or 6 games even though Koivu and Tanguay are on fire as you put it.

Its a case of what have you done for me lately...keep the language crap out of it, it only proves insecurity.
its not me that reported it but, truth is, we have a great tendencie of bashing our french young players more than the others, and that you cant deny: I.E: Ribeiro, Latendresse


Last edited by Iwishihadacup: 11-07-2008 at 09:53 AM.
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Old
11-07-2008, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Tuggy View Post
Higgins is a better hockey player then Latendresse. Why is this such a difficult concept for people to understand? That is why he is playing with Koivu and Tanguay.
Pretty much sums it up.

Another factor is that Lats stopped putting up points while Koivu and Tanguay were still getting the job done. Lats with 1 point in 5 games or something like that? he became dead weight and Higgins was just coming back at that time, so to keep the momentum of the line going, Guy tried Higgins in Lats' spot.

No, Sergei would not be in the pressbox, being in there would mean that your not French
If you can make that case for Sergei, can you make the same case for Lats as well? Makes sense doesn't it? Why do they feel that if Sergei was French and not producing points like expected, he'd be in the 'doghouse' when there's already a French Sergei in Lats (you know what I mean)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
its not me that reported it but, truth is, we have a great tendencie of bashing our french young players more than the others, and that you cant deny: I.E: Ribeiro, Latendresse
Ribeiro - Prima dona diver who was an integral part of the cancerous three amigoes, the bashing was justified.
Lats - Does not use his body as well as he should, slow (faster this year), he has been nothing but hyped since joining the Habs. Most fans are being patient with him these days waiting for him to develop him powerforward style.

If anything, the fans are worse on European players:
Koivu - Hey, he's hurt, lets snag pics. Hey, no speakity Frenchity?
Kovalev - Too many thing to list


Last edited by Judge Sauer*: 11-07-2008 at 09:56 AM.
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Old
11-07-2008, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
well, a slumping Serge and Lang is worst than an on fire koivu, an excellent Tanguay and pp time
Gui demoted himself by not playing great with linemates that were playing great last few games (1 point in 5 games if I'm not wrong). However:

- It's not like he was demoted ... most likely he was "promoted" in Higgy's absence an then he got back to his intended place.
- Higgins deserves his chance to shine too - I'm pretty sure that, should he fail to click in the next 4-5 games, he might get demoted too.
- During his presence on the "first line", Lats scored points (virtual ones I mean) by showing that he can play physical, put pressure, etc. His weaknesses were also pretty obvious. So it is not an "all negative" experience for him.
- He's still young and develloping - not like he was sent to Hamilton. Lang and Serioja are a lot better linemates then the ones he had last year. If you come to think - he was actually promoted compared to last year.

And lastly - Carbonneau wants to win and he will do whatever changes he thinks will help him win, in the short and long term. Carbonneau, unlike the Antichambre people, cannot afford to be biased towards or against players, since it would cost him points. I trust him to be a better evaluator and to be better informed on details then us or the Antichambre people. So I trust him on this.

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11-07-2008, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
2 days ago in l'antichambre, they talked about the line changes, and the brought up the point that Guillaume was always getting owned when people came back from injuries. When Higgins came back, Lats ice time got almost split in two while his presence on the powerplay became inexistent. They also say... And I agree on this, that if Sergei was french and quebecer, he would already be in the pressbox and in the fans' doghouse


This lead to my main question:

Is Gui mishandling Gui?
Maybe Gui was demoted because Higgins is better than him? As for your French thing, do you think that Gui would have made the team out of Junior if he wasn't French? Your slant on the language issue is just a red herring. It's not like Gui was sent to the bleachers and riding the pine.

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11-07-2008, 09:54 AM
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Mats NAslund
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And I agree on this, that if Sergei was french and quebecer, he would already be in the pressbox and in the fans' doghouse


This lead to my main question:

Is Gui mishandling Gui?
It's quite simple Higgins is a far better player then Latendresse in both ends of the ice. Really there is no comparison. As per your comment above....LOL! You must be kidding me, you ever hear of a guy named Saku Koivu who despite being the heart and soul of this team as been scrutinized by French media his whole tenure in Montreal. Guillaume gets off easy!

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11-07-2008, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
2 days ago in l'antichambre, they talked about the line changes, and the brought up the point that Guillaume was always getting owned when people came back from injuries. When Higgins came back, Lats ice time got almost split in two while his presence on the powerplay became inexistent. They also say... And I agree on this, that if Sergei was french and quebecer, he would already be in the pressbox and in the fans' doghouse


This lead to my main question:

Is Gui mishandling Gui?
I don't think it's fair to claim Sergi is getting better treatment than Lats. Lats just got "demoted" to the same line Sergi is on. Therefore, if you feel that line is a "demotion", then both have been "demoted" to the equal degree.

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11-07-2008, 09:55 AM
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Gui Carbonneau doesn't make a thing about french guys. He'll play the best option he has to win hockey games, no matter if the player speak chinease, french or spanish.

It is fans and media that makes stories about langage issues.

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11-07-2008, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
its not me that reported it but, truth is, we have a great tendencie of bashing our french young players more than the others, and that you cant deny: I.E: Ribeiro, Latendresse
Or maybe the Frenchness of the player has nothing to do with it. Maybe it's because the local media built up Gui so much that they can't see the player from the hype: case in point...at training camp the media claimed Lats was the 5th fastest skater on the team.

Lats worked himself off the Koivu line. Maybe in a week or two he'll work himself back on...or as I believe, he won't.

But it has nothing to do with the fact he's French Canadian. It has to do with the fact he doesn't belong there now.

Is Tanguay an Anglo? Or A Swede. He's still on the first line. Why doesn't the press talk about him?

I could accuse you of ethnic stereotyping. Maybe just because Lats is French Canadian you want special treament for him. You see that ethnic game can be played both ways and thank God Carbo doesn't play it at all.

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11-07-2008, 10:05 AM
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Last time I checked we had 3 balanced Offensive lines, and if a stronger Offensive presence presents itself you cannot penalize that person because he has been injured. If Higgins under preforms, and Lats is more consistent changes might be made.

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11-07-2008, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chomsky View Post
Since when playing with Lang and Sergei is a huge demotion?
It's a demotion but it actually could help him and the whole third line.
It was the planned 3rd line anyway.

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11-07-2008, 10:06 AM
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I see that the clowns are back with their old stupid antics about french canadians.

I knew it as soon as I saw who would be on that show: ie Gagnon and Bergeron and all...

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11-07-2008, 10:09 AM
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HKT is deadlier than LKT.

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11-07-2008, 10:13 AM
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Lats is clearly mixed up as far as what's his role in this team and knowing Carbo's past as far as communication, though he seems to have improved, I wouldn't be surprise to hear that they haven't talked for a long time.

The guy was mostly in Juniors a scorer who despite being big, did not use his body too much. Here we want him to play in his off-wing and be that punishing physical guy he never was.

Honestly, if I was Gui, despite what everybody tells me how I should be playing including the coaches, I would start playing my own game, the one that made it possible for me to be drafted. If he would start scoring, if he would put his body in front of the net and start scoring those garbage goals, who cares if he destroys a guy or 2, 3 seconds after the said guy had passed the puck....

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11-07-2008, 10:17 AM
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As stated before Higgins is a better player than Lats.

Lets slant this the other way imagine your Higgins, you've worked hard for years, are a clear bona fide NHL player, and work hard EVERY shift. You come back from injury only to find your slot (that you've played in for two years) filled by some young player who has trouble with questionable work ethics and has yet to really prove he's anything but a great prospect who's FRENCH. Flip this to two years from now when Gui is the bona fide player and say.... MaxPac take his spot... image the uproar in LaPresse.

Sergei's had a rough start, but unlike Lats he at least looks interested in playing the role that's expected of him.

I'll get flamed for Lats bashing. I'll state openly, I think the guys got great potential, but I also think he thinks he's already there. He stopped working when Higgins came back and figured the job was his, or at least that's what appeared to happen.

The ONLY reason Lats made the team 2 years ago was because he was french. He had a good camp the previous year, and the french media was up in arms that he was sent back, they couldn't send him to the minors so ... voila we have this situation. MaxPac had a way better camp this year but where is he.... where he belongs. Lats had a chance to make an impression, and was given every opportunity, but in the end couldn't make a compelling argument to stay.

I think they gave him extra chances hoping he could fill the role so that Higgins might have been more tradable. He's a valuable commodity to us and other teams so if Lats had proven he could play that spot WITH CONSISTENCY it could have been his.

Don't play the poor quebecois card... it doesn't fly .

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11-07-2008, 10:19 AM
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onice
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Honestly, if I was Gui, despite what everybody tells me how I should be playing including the coaches, I would start playing my own game, the one that made it possible for me to be drafted. If he would start scoring, if he would put his body in front of the net and start scoring those garbage goals, who cares if he destroys a guy or 2, 3 seconds after the said guy had passed the puck....

Finally!!!!! Someone says it as it is. I couldn't agree more with this statement.

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11-07-2008, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Iwishihadacup View Post
And I agree on this, that if Sergei was french and quebecer, he would already be in the pressbox and in the fans' doghouse
Who comes up with this ****?

And aside from the Toronto game, neither of these guys has looked amazing this year. And Higgins is clearly better for the Koivu line. He can skate, win battles along the boards, and score close to 30 goals. Oh and you can put him out in any situation.

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11-07-2008, 10:23 AM
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I don't see an issue here. Higgins was injured, Lats filled in on the 2nd line. Higgins returns from injury and reclaims his position. Now is the time for the Latendresse/Lang/Kostitsyn line to build some chemistry. It's all good.

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Old
11-07-2008, 10:23 AM
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Lats has 1 point in 7 games.

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