HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

Koivu would like to re-sign with Habs

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-07-2008, 06:12 PM
  #126
Westcoasthabsfan
Registered User
 
Westcoasthabsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: In Pandoras Box
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,242
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
Why will Koivu care what his cap hit is as long as he is getting paid... I'm pretty sure he never plays a game in that 5th year....
You think the Habs are going to get another four years outta him.....Come on.... be realistic....

Westcoasthabsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 08:11 PM
  #127
Beakermania*
 
Beakermania*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Kingston or Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,965
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Westcoasthabsfan View Post
You think the Habs are going to get another four years outta him.....Come on.... be realistic....
No i think its 2-3 tops...

The point of the last two years on the contract is to lower the CAP HIT of the first three years.... when he retires he has 0 cap hit for those years cause he was under 35 on July 1st 2009 when the contract came into effect.

Why do you guys keep seeing a 5 year contract and don't understand this point that we have made 20x in the thread.

So you sign him for
6-4-3-2-2 and the cap hit is 3.4million
you sign him for 6-4 and the cap hit is 5 million.

Beakermania* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 08:57 PM
  #128
goalchenyuk
Registered User
 
goalchenyuk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: montreal
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 8,360
vCash: 500
You are compared Koivu to Drury or Briere to say his value is 5 m$ , but those player are just themselves overpaid . Why Gainey would do the same with Koivu ?

Selanne ; 2,625 M$
BrinD'Amour ; 3,6 m$
Sedin(S) 3,75
Dumont 4 M$
Morrow 4,1 m$
Morrisson 2,75 m$
Modano 3,45 m$
Demitra 4 m$
Mikko Koivu 3,25 $m
Savard 5 m$
ALFREDSON 4,34 M$
Doan 4,55 M$
Naslund 4 m$

Koivu at 5 m$ is ridiculous . If he wants to end his career with the Habs , he needs to take a salary cut .

goalchenyuk is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 09:20 PM
  #129
Judge Sauer*
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nunavut
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,989
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
You are compared Koivu to Drury or Briere to say his value is 5 m$ , but those player are just themselves overpaid . Why Gainey would do the same with Koivu ?

Selanne ; 2,625 M$
BrinD'Amour ; 3,6 m$
Sedin(S) 3,75
Dumont 4 M$
Morrow 4,1 m$
Morrisson 2,75 m$
Modano 3,45 m$
Demitra 4 m$
Mikko Koivu 3,25 $m
Savard 5 m$
ALFREDSON 4,34 M$
Doan 4,55 M$
Naslund 4 m$

Koivu at 5 m$ is ridiculous . If he wants to end his career with the Habs , he needs to take a salary cut .
Selanne ; 2,625 M$ - 38 Years old
BrinD'Amour ; 3,6 m$ - 37 Years old
ALFREDSON 4,34 M$ - After this season when he's 35/36 his new 4 year/5.4 cap hit contract kicks in

Judge Sauer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 09:27 PM
  #130
Beakermania*
 
Beakermania*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Kingston or Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,965
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
You are compared Koivu to Drury or Briere to say his value is 5 m$ , but those player are just themselves overpaid . Why Gainey would do the same with Koivu ?

Selanne ; 2,625 M$
BrinD'Amour ; 3,6 m$
Sedin(S) 3,75
Dumont 4 M$
Morrow 4,1 m$
Morrisson 2,75 m$
Modano 3,45 m$
Demitra 4 m$
Mikko Koivu 3,25 $m
Savard 5 m$
ALFREDSON 4,34 M$
Doan 4,55 M$
Naslund 4 m$

Koivu at 5 m$ is ridiculous . If he wants to end his career with the Habs , he needs to take a salary cut .
Sedins - are not UFAs....
Morrisson - two straight years of complete and utter crap...
Mikko - not eligible for UFA
Naslund - two straight years of crap
Alfreddson - old contract; his new deal is a cap hit of over 5 million and that is low cause he is structured in a similar way to what we want to do with koivu.
Savard - his deal was signed three years ago... inflation; if he was UFA now he'd get way more
Demitra - seriously injury prone...

Beakermania* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 09:54 PM
  #131
goalchenyuk
Registered User
 
goalchenyuk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: montreal
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 8,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judge Sauer View Post
Selanne ; 2,625 M$ - 38 Years old
BrinD'Amour ; 3,6 m$ - 37 Years old
ALFREDSON 4,34 M$ - After this season when he's 35/36 his new 4 year/5.4 cap hit contract kicks in
Selanne ; 9 goals in 13 games . who care he's 38 ?
BrinD'Amour ; better than Koivu and still one of the best two way players of the NHL . Who care that he's 37 ?
Alfredson ; one of the best players of the NHL ...who care he's 36 ?

Also, don't forget that those players don't have the healt history of Koivu

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
Sedins - are not UFAs....
Morrisson - two straight years of complete and utter crap...
Mikko - not eligible for UFA
Naslund - two straight years of crap
Alfreddson - old contract; his new deal is a cap hit of over 5 million and that is low cause he is structured in a similar way to what we want to do with koivu.
Savard - his deal was signed three years ago... inflation; if he was UFA now he'd get way more
Demitra - seriously injury prone...
I don't care that those players are or aren't UFA 's . They are all equal or better than Koivu , so i don't see why Gainey would have to pay more to re-sign Koivu - for who " it would be an great honour to end his career with The Habs "

By the way ; Naslund 49 goals last 2 seasons " of crap "

goalchenyuk is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 09:59 PM
  #132
Beakermania*
 
Beakermania*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Kingston or Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,965
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
I don't care that those players are or aren't UFA 's . They are all equal or better than Koivu , so i don't see why Gainey would have to pay more to re-sign Koivu - for who " it would be an great honour to end his career with The Habs "

By the way ; Naslund 49 goals last 2 seasons " of crap "
RFAs almost always get less money than UFAs; unless you find a crazy GM to give them an offer sheet they are naturally gonna get less than an RFA. If you don't understand the various reasons why UFAs get more than young RFAs then i don't think we have anything to debate. Its a simple concept and if you are gonna compare apples to oranges then there is nothing i can say. Look at Andrei Kostitsyn's RFA contract; Look at Patrick O'Sullivan getting under 3million.... look at numerous other guys throughout the league.

If Naslund was so good for two years why did Vancouver desperate for offence and with a ton of cap room give him up without much fight??

Sundin got offered 10million by the Canucks... Don't tell me Koivu isn't worth half of what Sundin is. If we give him 6 million next year and 4 the year after... but get him at a cap hit of 3.5.... what is the problem. Its not your 6 million... the only thing you should be concerned with is the cap hit.

Beakermania* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 10:15 PM
  #133
Judge Sauer*
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nunavut
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,989
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
Selanne ; 9 goals in 13 games . who care he's 38 ?
BrinD'Amour ; better than Koivu and still one of the best two way players of the NHL . Who care that he's 37 ?
Alfredson ; one of the best players of the NHL ...who care he's 36 ?

Also, don't forget that those players don't have the healt history of Koivu

I don't care that those players are or aren't UFA 's . They are all equal or better than Koivu , so i don't see why Gainey would have to pay more to re-sign Koivu - for who " it would be an great honour to end his career with The Habs "

By the way ; Naslund 49 goals last 2 seasons " of crap "
Selanne pretty much stated he won't play anywhere but Anaheim and there was no chance of him playing there for a large salary.

Prior to winning the Cup with Carolina Rod had 278 Points in 409 Games. Even the signing was met with:
Quote:
When the Hurricanes signed captain Rod Brind'Amour to a five-year, $18-million contract extension last June, four days after winning their first Stanley Cup, it looked like a move made purely on emotion.
He proved to keep a good PPG pace going that no one saw coming so it's not like he signed cheap because he went under UFA value, he signed cheap because it didn't seem like he could produce like he used to at the time.

Alfy signed a larger contract is what I'm saying....and your agreeing I guess, you can't use his current contract to say that it's on par to his talents. Which is what you made it seem like because you brought it up in the first place.

Naslund went from being an over PPG player to less than a PPG, 115 points in 164 games is a far cry from the 163 points in 159 games.

RFA's don't get the kinds of contracts UFA's do....I'm sure you noticed that by now.

Judge Sauer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 10:27 PM
  #134
goalchenyuk
Registered User
 
goalchenyuk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: montreal
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 8,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
RFAs almost always get less money than UFAs; unless you find a crazy GM to give them an offer sheet they are naturally gonna get less than an RFA. If you don't understand the various reasons why UFAs get more than young RFAs then i don't think we have anything to debate. Its a simple concept and if you are gonna compare apples to oranges then there is nothing i can say. Look at Andrei Kostitsyn's RFA contract; Look at Patrick O'Sullivan getting under 3million.... look at numerous other guys throughout the league.

If Naslund was so good for two years why did Vancouver desperate for offence and with a ton of cap room give him up without much fight??

Sundin got offered 10million by the Canucks... Don't tell me Koivu isn't worth half of what Sundin is. If we give him 6 million next year and 4 the year after... but get him at a cap hit of 3.5.... what is the problem. Its not your 6 million... the only thing you should be concerned with is the cap hit.
oh yes i understand the difference betwen the 2 groups . But as i said , i don't care that Koivu is a UFA and i don't care that he could get more money as a free agent if another team wants to overpay him . If he wants more money than is real value , just let him go , like Gainey did with Souray , Streit and Ryder .

Koivu is on his decline so i don't see how he can't get more money than he won last seasons .

goalchenyuk is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 10:34 PM
  #135
Beakermania*
 
Beakermania*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Kingston or Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,965
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
Koivu is on his decline so i don't see how he can't get more money than he won last seasons .
If his decline is less than the inflation in the market he ends up being worth more money.

Beakermania* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 10:37 PM
  #136
goalchenyuk
Registered User
 
goalchenyuk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: montreal
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 8,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judge Sauer View Post
Selanne pretty much stated he won't play anywhere but Anaheim and there was no chance of him playing there for a large salary.

He proved to keep a good PPG pace going that no one saw coming so it's not like he signed cheap because he went under UFA value, he signed cheap because it didn't seem like he could produce like he used to at the time.

Alfy signed a larger contract is what I'm saying....and your agreeing I guess, you can't use his current contract to say that it's on par to his talents. Which is what you made it seem like because you brought it up in the first place.

Naslund went from being an over PPG player to less than a PPG, 115 points in 164 games is a far cry from the 163 points in 159 games.

RFA's don't get the kinds of contracts UFA's do....I'm sure you noticed that by now.
Koivu pretty said that he wants to play anywhere but for the Habs

What you say about Rod is what i am saying about Koivu ;he should sign cheap because it doesn't seem like he could produce like he used to at the time

Alfredson , i named him because a lot of fans put Koivu at 5 m$ . Alfredson who is by far better than Saku , just signed for the same number , because he wanted to END his career with the Sens - something Koivu said he wants to do here .

Naslund producion felt , but so was the production of Saku last season .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
If his decline is less than the inflation in the market he ends up being worth more money.
yes , but his decline is more than the inflation .

have a good end of evening ; i am going to bed


Last edited by Beakermania*: 11-08-2008 at 04:28 PM.
goalchenyuk is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2008, 10:45 PM
  #137
Judge Sauer*
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nunavut
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,989
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
Koivu pretty said that he wants to play anywhere but for the Habs

What you say about Rod is what i am saying about Koivu ;he should sign cheap because it doesn't seem like he could produce like he used to at the time

Alfredson , i named him because a lot of fans put Koivu at 5 m$ . Alfredson who is by far better than Saku , just signed for the same number , because he wanted to END his career with the Sens - something Koivu said he wants to do here .

Naslund producion felt , but so was the production of Saku last season .
Koivu produced last year and he's doing it again this year.

Koivu said he wants to play here and sign a new contract here, he never said he wants to sign somewhere else.

Judge Sauer* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 08:06 AM
  #138
BLONG7
Registered User
 
BLONG7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 12,246
vCash: 500
I think Saku gets another 3 year deal...the dollars will be around the dollars he makes right now...although, he may go back closer to 3.75-4M who knows???? But, I really think he signs for another 3 years...just a hunch...

BLONG7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 11:03 AM
  #139
goalchenyuk
Registered User
 
goalchenyuk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: montreal
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 8,360
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judge Sauer View Post
Koivu produced last year and he's doing it again this year.

Koivu said he wants to play here and sign a new contract here, he never said he wants to sign somewhere else.
That's what i wanted to say ( my english is bad ) ; Koivu wants to STAY with the Habs , like Selanne wanted to STAY with the Ducks . That's why Selanne took a pay cut and is playing for 2,6 m$ , even if he was a free agent .

The production of Saku last season wasn't good ; 27 points at ES is a very poor production .Lang got 37 points in the same situation , playing for the Hawks .

goalchenyuk is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 03:46 PM
  #140
Teufelsdreck
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 14,078
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
Selanne ; 9 goals in 13 games . who care he's 38 ?
BrinD'Amour ; better than Koivu and still one of the best two way players of the NHL . Who care that he's 37 ?
Alfredson ; one of the best players of the NHL ...who care he's 36 ?

Also, don't forget that those players don't have the healt history of Koivu



I don't care that those players are or aren't UFA 's . They are all equal or better than Koivu , so i don't see why Gainey would have to pay more to re-sign Koivu - for who " it would be an great honour to end his career with The Habs "

By the way ; Naslund 49 goals last 2 seasons " of crap "
I wouldn't take Naslund, Morrison, or Demitra over Koivu. The others, yes.

Teufelsdreck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 03:49 PM
  #141
Teufelsdreck
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 14,078
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
oh yes i understand the difference betwen the 2 groups . But as i said , i don't care that Koivu is a UFA and i don't care that he could get more money as a free agent if another team wants to overpay him . If he wants more money than is real value , just let him go , like Gainey did with Souray , Streit and Ryder .

Koivu is on his decline so i don't see how he can't get more money than he won last seasons .
Wouldn't it be throwing Latendresse to the wolves if Koivu didn't re-sign? He's yet to prove he can click with any other center.

Teufelsdreck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 03:57 PM
  #142
Blind Gardien
Global Moderator
nexus of the crisis
 
Blind Gardien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Four Winds Bar
Country: France
Posts: 19,334
vCash: 500
It's definitely an interesting question. I'd like to think Gainey/Koivu could get together and answer it pretty quickly and conclusively if they really felt any pressure at all to do so.

Koivu probably knows he could get $6-7M on the open market, I would love to see the Habs sign him for a front-loaded 5-years to keep his salary fair for now and ensure he retires as a Habs legend.

Blind Gardien is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 04:08 PM
  #143
Clumsyhab
Registered User
 
Clumsyhab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Montreal
Posts: 6,732
vCash: 500
100th, admit that you just hate Koivu and wants him out. No one is saying that Saku deserves a 5M cap hit for a long term deal. What most of us are saying is that he may worth 5M for next season, but it's better to give him a long term deal (4 years) to reduce his cap hit to around 3.5M. Do you see anything wrong with (5+4+3+2) or 3 years at (5+4+3)? Anyways, that's what I think he'll get.

Clumsyhab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 04:08 PM
  #144
Lone Rogue
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Windsor, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,506
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 100th View Post
Alfredson , i named him because a lot of fans put Koivu at 5 m$ . Alfredson who is by far better than Saku , just signed for the same number , because he wanted to END his career with the Sens - something Koivu said he wants to do here .
People often forget that Alfredsson is Top 5 in the NHL since 2003 for points per game average. Of course, they tend to ignore that list because Crosby is at the top of it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
Wouldn't it be throwing Latendresse to the wolves if Koivu didn't re-sign? He's yet to prove he can click with any other center.
Yes, and he will never click with any other center ever in his career ever.

Lone Rogue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 04:18 PM
  #145
mcphee
Registered User
 
mcphee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 19,105
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lone Rogue View Post
People often forget that Alfredsson is Top 5 in the NHL since 2003 for points per game average. Of course, they tend to ignore that list because Crosby is at the top of it



Yes, and he will never click with any other center ever in his career ever.
Still, they'll all move to Finland together and be very happy. He might click with Mikko however.

mcphee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 04:19 PM
  #146
CanadienErrant*
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Country: Cook Islands
Posts: 4,956
vCash: 500
Koivu said that he wanted to be with the Habs NEXT year. No problem with that. We don't have any centers ready to take his spot. If he wants to stay longer, that's fine. But he may still want to play with his brother in 2010-11- or just retire after 15 seasons in the NHL.

CanadienErrant* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 04:19 PM
  #147
guest1467
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 24,824
vCash: 500
I would love for Koivu to be re-signed and finish his career in Montreal. I'm hoping for something along the lines of a 2 year $6 million contract.

guest1467 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 05:25 PM
  #148
Teufelsdreck
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 14,078
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lone Rogue View Post
People often forget that Alfredsson is Top 5 in the NHL since 2003 for points per game average. Of course, they tend to ignore that list because Crosby is at the top of it



Yes, and he will never click with any other center ever in his career ever.

I didn't say that. Right now, there are 3 centers on the Habs who don't/can't bring out the best in Lats. Lats is 21 and by the law of averages the Habs will draft or trade for a center who will click with him (and vice versa) in the future. Many a thread had been started about the inability of the Habs to draft talented centers in the 21st century (including, I might add, the year 2000, which technically ended the 20th century). Other NHL teams have had better luck or better scouts or different draft priorities.

Teufelsdreck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2008, 06:02 PM
  #149
Blind Gardien
Global Moderator
nexus of the crisis
 
Blind Gardien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Four Winds Bar
Country: France
Posts: 19,334
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
I would love for Koivu to be re-signed and finish his career in Montreal. I'm hoping for something along the lines of a 2 year $6 million contract.
I think you'd need to more than double your term and significantly increase the annual salary in order to achieve your stated desire. It's fair to hope for him to take a ridiculous discount, but I don't know why anybody would hope he only plays 2 more years?

Blind Gardien is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:17 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.