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Old
10-21-2008, 01:12 PM
  #201
claude boivin lives
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By the way, I'm basing these lines...

Gagne-Briere-Knuble
Hartnell-Richards-Lupul
Upshall-Carter-Nodl
Cote-Metropolit-Asham

...off the fact that it was mentioned yesterday when Stevens was talking to the press that Harts, Richie, and Lupul were playing together at practice. I'm guessing he'll leave Gags, Briere, and Knuble together just because they actually had some production last game. And I suppose that would leave one place for Nodl, on Carter's wing.

Who knows though...maybe things will change once Nodl gets a chance to practice with the team.

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Old
10-21-2008, 04:15 PM
  #202
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nodl, carter uspahll would be a FAST line

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Old
11-10-2008, 03:46 PM
  #203
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What were the d pairings in the Tampa game with Carle?

Also Lupul on the 4th line?
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Tim-P...motion/2/17792
http://csnphilly.com/pages/landing_h...568&feedID=717

Hopefully just for practice

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Old
11-10-2008, 04:41 PM
  #204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyers View Post
What were the d pairings in the Tampa game with Carle?

Also Lupul on the 4th line?
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Tim-P...motion/2/17792
http://csnphilly.com/pages/landing_h...568&feedID=717

Hopefully just for practice
Yeah, Steven's has had this thought that Lupul playing with nobodies and Asham playing with Richards is a good idea......

Great coach

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Old
11-10-2008, 04:42 PM
  #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyers View Post
What were the d pairings in the Tampa game with Carle?

Also Lupul on the 4th line?
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Tim-P...motion/2/17792
http://csnphilly.com/pages/landing_h...568&feedID=717

Hopefully just for practice
Yeah I was just reading that about Lupul. I don't understand the logic behind that. Is he in Stevens doghouse and Stevens is sending him a message? Is Stevens just experimenting with lines to see how they look? If he's on the fourth line, who moves up? Certainly not Gratton or Asham right? Does this mean they thinking a Shanahan signing is imminent and are basically saying Nodl deserves top 9 minutes more than Lupul does?

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11-10-2008, 04:45 PM
  #206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawkins121 View Post
Yeah I was just reading that about Lupul. I don't understand the logic behind that. Is he in Stevens doghouse and Stevens is sending him a message? Is Stevens just experimenting with lines to see how they look? If he's on the fourth line, who moves up? Certainly not Gratton or Asham right? Does this mean they thinking a Shanahan signing is imminent and are basically saying Nodl deserves top 9 minutes more than Lupul does?
Asham moved up

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Old
11-10-2008, 04:47 PM
  #207
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyers View Post
What were the d pairings in the Tampa game with Carle?

Also Lupul on the 4th line?
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Tim-P...motion/2/17792
http://csnphilly.com/pages/landing_h...568&feedID=717

Hopefully just for practice
Lupul's comments are further proof to me that Stevens has completely lost his players. They have just as little of a clue as to what he is doing as we do. Between his unfair treatment of Downie (benching him while not benching others), constant juggling of lines, and strange lineup decisions...I think the players think he is a joke. I truly believe, they think he is a complete joke and if a team doesn't respect their coach they've got no shot. I'm not blaming them for thinking he is a joke either, because I completely agree. I believe it explains the often lazy play of the team.

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Old
11-10-2008, 04:51 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by DUHockey9 View Post
Lupul's comments are further proof to me that Stevens has completely lost his players. They have just as little of a clue as to what he is doing as we do. Between his unfair treatment of Downie (benching him while not benching others), constant juggling of lines, and strange lineup decisions...I think the players think he is a joke. I truly believe, they think he is a complete joke and if a team doesn't respect their coach they've got no shot. I'm not blaming them for thinking he is a joke either, because I completely agree. I believe it explains the often lazy play of the team.
I guess now that Downie is gone, he needs a new whipping boy....

I want to hear the Steven's supporters explain this one

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Old
11-10-2008, 05:08 PM
  #209
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Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
I guess now that Downie is gone, he needs a new whipping boy....

I want to hear the Steven's supporters explain this one
I'm never really one to be rash, but last year I felt that Stevens should be fired but the team turned it around and I thought I was wrong. I thought maybe it was just taking some time for the team to come around.

Not any longer. He really is the worst coach I can remember (I'm 22 and admittedly have never paid as much attention to a coach as I do now). I see no semblance of any system, constant hail mary breakout passes, dump ins on a PP when NO ONE is moving with any speed to go get, awful personnel decisions, and hypocrisy in his treatment of players (Downie vs everyone else).

I recently got NHL center ice so I've had the pleasure of watching at least one other game every night. When you see other teams (mind you other BAD teams, such as Florida) move the puck out of their zone, and move as team, it becomes clear how far ahead of us everyone else is. When our D-men have the puck we don't have a forward in the screen (tv-screen of course). Watch any other game, and there are always forwards in sight. And I don't blame the forwards...it's definitely his "system" because if it weren't he'd do something about it (I hope).

I've personally played hockey for coaches that I (as well as my teammates) thought were a complete joke. When a team doesn't want to win for their coach, he's got to go. How do you get a team to want to win for their coach? Treat players fairly and put them in positions to succeed. John Stevens doesn't do either of those.

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11-11-2008, 01:26 AM
  #210
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My God. Stevens is the greatest idiot ever. Lupul has played very well when playing with Richards, but poorly otherwise. Rather than realizing that and putting the two together, Stevens puts him on the 4th line.

I'll post numbers later but I gotta get going.

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Old
11-11-2008, 06:02 AM
  #211
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Lupul has played like complete crap ALL season but maybe a 4-5 game stretch. If I were a coach I would not just put him on the 4th line, I would bench his lazy *** until he decides he feels like living up to his raise.

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Old
11-11-2008, 09:34 AM
  #212
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Originally Posted by DUHockey9 View Post
I'm never really one to be rash, but last year I felt that Stevens should be fired but the team turned it around and I thought I was wrong. I thought maybe it was just taking some time for the team to come around.

Not any longer. He really is the worst coach I can remember (I'm 22 and admittedly have never paid as much attention to a coach as I do now). I see no semblance of any system, constant hail mary breakout passes, dump ins on a PP when NO ONE is moving with any speed to go get, awful personnel decisions, and hypocrisy in his treatment of players (Downie vs everyone else).

I recently got NHL center ice so I've had the pleasure of watching at least one other game every night. When you see other teams (mind you other BAD teams, such as Florida) move the puck out of their zone, and move as team, it becomes clear how far ahead of us everyone else is. When our D-men have the puck we don't have a forward in the screen (tv-screen of course). Watch any other game, and there are always forwards in sight. And I don't blame the forwards...it's definitely his "system" because if it weren't he'd do something about it (I hope).

I've personally played hockey for coaches that I (as well as my teammates) thought were a complete joke. When a team doesn't want to win for their coach, he's got to go. How do you get a team to want to win for their coach? Treat players fairly and put them in positions to succeed. John Stevens doesn't do either of those.
Great post. Couldnt have said it better myself...

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Old
11-11-2008, 09:37 AM
  #213
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Originally Posted by chaosof99 View Post
My God. Stevens is the greatest idiot ever. Lupul has played very well when playing with Richards, but poorly otherwise. Rather than realizing that and putting the two together, Stevens puts him on the 4th line.

I'll post numbers later but I gotta get going.
Yeah, I mentioned this in another thread, but someone tell me how this makes sense:

Stevens: "I think Lupul is struggling with his confidence right now. So, in order to fix that, I am going to demote him from the top 6 and playing with Richards (who he plays the best with out of anyone on the team) and put him on the 4th line getting less than 8 minutes a night with a bunch of goons around him and hopefully that will help his confidence"

Quote:
Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
Lupul has played like complete crap ALL season but maybe a 4-5 game stretch. If I were a coach I would not just put him on the 4th line, I would bench his lazy *** until he decides he feels like living up to his raise.
Lupul is on pace for 32 goals for the season. So he isnt hitting as much, is anyone???? He is there to score goals and he is doing it. He has always been streaky, most goal scorers are. Please tell me how playing with a couple of goons is going to help a sniper play better?

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Old
11-11-2008, 09:53 AM
  #214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
Lupul is on pace for 32 goals for the season. So he isnt hitting as much, is anyone???? He is there to score goals and he is doing it. He has always been streaky, most goal scorers are. Please tell me how playing with a couple of goons is going to help a sniper play better?
I guess if your confident that Lupes will score 32 goals then thats fine if it makes you feel better. The fact remains that he has been absent from the scoresheet in all but 3 games this season and if you want to do projections for the season that means he will be have 63 games this season that he has 0 points. Hes also on pace for 38 points this season. I guess thats OK with you but for me its not. He scored 2 goals in a 7-0 win...congrats. He scored 2 goals in a 6-3 win...congrats. He scored 1 goal and an assist in a 7-6 loss, which he did play very well in. Maybe its ok if he pads his stats in games that the Flyers light up the scoreboard but for me if the guy is playing on the second line with the best player on the team he should have more than 6 points in a 4 game span. If hes such a sniper why cant he score a goal in a tight game? Why cant he score a goal when the team scores less than 6 goals?

I'm not saying putting him on the 4th line with goons is going to help him but theyre obviously sending him a message. Saying if your not going to play hard someone else will. We all know hes not going to be on the 4th line all year and if Asham comes up and has 0 points today then its the same that Lupul has done in almost every game this year. Like i said before, I'll be surprised if the game ends with Asham playing more minutes than Lupul.

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Old
11-11-2008, 10:06 AM
  #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
Yeah, I mentioned this in another thread, but someone tell me how this makes sense:

Stevens: "I think Lupul is struggling with his confidence right now. So, in order to fix that, I am going to demote him from the top 6 and playing with Richards (who he plays the best with out of anyone on the team) and put him on the 4th line getting less than 8 minutes a night with a bunch of goons around him and hopefully that will help his confidence"



Lupul is on pace for 32 goals for the season. So he isnt hitting as much, is anyone???? He is there to score goals and he is doing it. He has always been streaky, most goal scorers are. Please tell me how playing with a couple of goons is going to help a sniper play better?
I completely agree with you.

I think the best approach is to stick him back with Richards, and let him work through it. I don't think he's been a disaster...just struggling.

As I've said before...one thing we learned last year...

Carter + Upshall = Good

Richards + Lupul = Goood

How hard is it to keep that going?

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Old
11-11-2008, 10:15 AM
  #216
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Today I wanna see us snap back into it and mix Lupul into the scoring, like everyone else is talking about.

Gagne - Briere - Knuble

Hartnell - Richards - Lupul

Uppie - Carter - Asham (need the big guy)

Cote - Metro - Nodl (I like this guy from what I've seen but I think he should stay on the 4th to generate offense with these guys)

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11-11-2008, 10:17 AM
  #217
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Originally Posted by Flyers84 View Post
Today I wanna see us snap back into it and mix Lupul into the scoring, like everyone else is talking about.

Gagne - Briere - Knuble

Hartnell - Richards - Lupul

Uppie - Carter - Asham (need the big guy)

Cote - Metro - Nodl (I like this guy from what I've seen but I think he should stay on the 4th to generate offense with these guys)
Why do we need offense from the 4th line? We are in the top 5 (I think) in scoring. The Upshall, Cart,er Nodl line has been very good

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Old
11-11-2008, 10:17 AM
  #218
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DUHockey9 View Post
I completely agree with you.

I think the best approach is to stick him back with Richards, and let him work through it. I don't think he's been a disaster...just struggling.

As I've said before...one thing we learned last year...

Carter + Upshall = Good

Richards + Lupul = Goood

How hard is it to keep that going?
We learned that last year but this year its not working, sometimes you have to piss him off and let him know that he hasnt earned any right to stay in the top 6 forever. Do you guys really think that jsut because hes there for one game that hes going to stay there for long? Calm down, its one game. I dont even mind it, Lupul has been terrible almost every game. He looks lost.

I love people say things like...well hes on pace for 32 goals, who cares how or when he scores them, thats what hes here for. But then Knuble puts in close to 30 every year and if on pace for 70 points this year everyone says how terrible he is because hes not the best away from the puck. Then they say things like, he scores most of his goals on the PP. Well shouldnt it be the same way, he scores goals and puts points on the board and thats what hes here for. Lupul who hasnt proven a thing gets a pass but the veteran Knuble doesnt.

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11-11-2008, 10:20 AM
  #219
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Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
We learned that last year but this year its not working, sometimes you have to piss him off and let him know that he hasnt earned any right to stay in the top 6 forever. Do you guys really think that jsut because hes there for one game that hes going to stay there for long? Calm down, its one game. I dont even mind it, Lupul has been terrible almost every game. He looks lost.

I love people say things like...well hes on pace for 32 goals, who cares how or when he scores them, thats what hes here for. But then Knuble puts in close to 30 every year and if on pace for 70 points this year everyone says how terrible he is because hes not the best away from the puck. Then they say things like, he scores most of his goals on the PP. Well shouldnt it be the same way, he scores goals and puts points on the board and thats what hes here for. Lupul who hasnt proven a thing gets a pass but the veteran Knuble doesnt.
But it isn't one game...it for 3 shifts, and then he's back, and then it's 2 more shifts, and then he's back for good.

Stevens tries to be a hard ass but he walks this line between actually disciplining his players (except for Downie) and just playing them and letting them get through it.

IMO...I'd just stick them back together and let them play through the struggle. But if that isn't an option, ACTUALLY discipline Lupul for poor play. Scratch him for a game...or play him on the 4th line for an ENTIRE game.

Also...I don't think Lupul has been horrendous...just struggling.

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Old
11-11-2008, 10:23 AM
  #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DUHockey9 View Post
But it isn't one game...it for 3 shifts, and then he's back, and then it's 2 more shifts, and then he's back for good.

Stevens tries to be a hard ass but he walks this line between actually disciplining his players (except for Downie) and just playing them and letting them get through it.

IMO...I'd just stick them back together and let them play through the struggle. But if that isn't an option, ACTUALLY discipline Lupul for poor play. Scratch him for a game...or play him on the 4th line for an ENTIRE game.

Also...I don't think Lupul has been horrendous...just struggling.
that i can agree with. Hes useless on the 4th line but I do not oppose to moving him off the Richards line for a game or two to wake him up. I guess what he's thinking is he will maybe let him go out and jsut play hard without having the pressure of scoring on him and then let him get some powerplay time where he will have more opportunities to score and snap out of the funk.

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11-11-2008, 10:31 AM
  #221
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I said this in the fire Stevens thread and I've also said this to the start of this year, but I still think the lines should have been as follows:

Gagne - Richards - Lupul
Upshall - Carter - Briere
Hartnell - Metro - Knuble
Cote - Matsumoto - Asham

Over course, you could always swap between Metro and Matsumoto, but I think that those lines would be the best way to go. Richards and Gagne proved that they can work together and Richards and Lupul have also shown in the past that they are effective. Why not have all three of them together? And seeing as to how Carter and Upshall play the game at full speed ahead, why not have Briere on that line as well? He'd be able to keep up with them and he'd be the guy who can distribute the puck on that line. Upshall would be the pest and Carter could launch his rocket wrist shot from the slot.

Some people call this lineup soft, but the only reason I think it's soft is simply because there doesn't seem to be any sort of system/game plan in place. As I mentioned in the fire Stevens thread, I really thought that the way the Flyers were building, Stevens was going to implement a puck possession system, but after watching the team, it's clear that nobody knows what kind of system John's trying to implement.

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11-11-2008, 10:56 AM
  #222
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Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
I guess if your confident that Lupes will score 32 goals then thats fine if it makes you feel better. The fact remains that he has been absent from the scoresheet in all but 3 games this season and if you want to do projections for the season that means he will be have 63 games this season that he has 0 points. Hes also on pace for 38 points this season. I guess thats OK with you but for me its not. He scored 2 goals in a 7-0 win...congrats. He scored 2 goals in a 6-3 win...congrats. He scored 1 goal and an assist in a 7-6 loss, which he did play very well in. Maybe its ok if he pads his stats in games that the Flyers light up the scoreboard but for me if the guy is playing on the second line with the best player on the team he should have more than 6 points in a 4 game span. If hes such a sniper why cant he score a goal in a tight game? Why cant he score a goal when the team scores less than 6 goals?

I'm not saying putting him on the 4th line with goons is going to help him but theyre obviously sending him a message. Saying if your not going to play hard someone else will. We all know hes not going to be on the 4th line all year and if Asham comes up and has 0 points today then its the same that Lupul has done in almost every game this year. Like i said before, I'll be surprised if the game ends with Asham playing more minutes than Lupul.
That is what goal scorers do.....They will have 8 goals in 9 games, and then go 12 without 1. Remember last year when he had a couple hat tricks in a row and then would go a couple weeks without a goal? That is nothing new with him or goal scorers in general.

If you want to send a message, bench him for a game or a period if you think he isnt working hard. Putting him out there on the ice with slop and ask him to play like the player he isnt will not help in the slightest.

If you think his issue is confidence, as Stevens said, than you put him on the top line with offensive players to get him going, not on the 4th line with guys that probably shouldnt ever be in the NHL.

Just more evidence that this baffoon doesnt know how to manage his players.

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11-11-2008, 11:12 AM
  #223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
That is what goal scorers do.....They will have 8 goals in 9 games, and then go 12 without 1. Remember last year when he had a couple hat tricks in a row and then would go a couple weeks without a goal? That is nothing new with him or goal scorers in general.

If you want to send a message, bench him for a game or a period if you think he isnt working hard. Putting him out there on the ice with slop and ask him to play like the player he isnt will not help in the slightest.

If you think his issue is confidence, as Stevens said, than you put him on the top line with offensive players to get him going, not on the 4th line with guys that probably shouldnt ever be in the NHL.

Just more evidence that this baffoon doesnt know how to manage his players.
I agree he doesnt know how to manage players. I think he should sit him down for a game if anything. Maybe not yet. I would wait and if he didnt score in the next 2 then sit him against montreal and bring him back against Atlanta where he will be pissed off and hopfully light them up for 2-3 and get going again.

The way he scored goals in bunches doesnt bother me but the fact that hes yet to record a single point this season in a game that the flyers didnt score 6 or more goals IS a problem.

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11-11-2008, 11:20 AM
  #224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
I said this in the fire Stevens thread and I've also said this to the start of this year, but I still think the lines should have been as follows:

Gagne - Richards - Lupul
Upshall - Carter - Briere
Hartnell - Metro - Knuble
Cote - Matsumoto - Asham

Over course, you could always swap between Metro and Matsumoto, but I think that those lines would be the best way to go. Richards and Gagne proved that they can work together and Richards and Lupul have also shown in the past that they are effective. Why not have all three of them together? And seeing as to how Carter and Upshall play the game at full speed ahead, why not have Briere on that line as well? He'd be able to keep up with them and he'd be the guy who can distribute the puck on that line. Upshall would be the pest and Carter could launch his rocket wrist shot from the slot.

Some people call this lineup soft, but the only reason I think it's soft is simply because there doesn't seem to be any sort of system/game plan in place. As I mentioned in the fire Stevens thread, I really thought that the way the Flyers were building, Stevens was going to implement a puck possession system, but after watching the team, it's clear that nobody knows what kind of system John's trying to implement.
Briere on Richard's wing didnt work so I doubt it will work with Carter. Briere at center with Gags works. I really wouldnt change that. I was one of the few that didnt like Briere at wing so I hope he stays in the middle.

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11-11-2008, 11:24 AM
  #225
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Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
I agree he doesnt know how to manage players. I think he should sit him down for a game if anything. Maybe not yet. I would wait and if he didnt score in the next 2 then sit him against montreal and bring him back against Atlanta where he will be pissed off and hopfully light them up for 2-3 and get going again.

The way he scored goals in bunches doesnt bother me but the fact that hes yet to record a single point this season in a game that the flyers didnt score 6 or more goals IS a problem.
But doesnt it mean that the games we scored 6 or more was cause Lups decided to put up 2 goals and 2 assists. His streakyness causes the high scoring games. The reason for the 6 or more games is that he scores 2 goals and puts up 2 assists but other people also score. He's a streaky player, I don't think one can change that. Its the same with Hartnell and Biron/Nitty.

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