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Old
11-20-2008, 02:42 AM
  #76
levski87
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Renney will not get fired anytime soon. Its just damn near impossible. We need a losing season with a top 5 draft pick for Sather to even THINK about firing Renney. Our coach just has no creativity when it comes to offense. This team CAN be very fast, but they worry way to much about defense. Tonight it **** on them, 4 quick goals.

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11-20-2008, 03:10 AM
  #77
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WTF? Get over it. Hes not going anywhere.

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11-20-2008, 09:04 AM
  #78
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Fire the fans !

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11-20-2008, 09:15 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
this is a lottery team without Henrik, period.

other teams can survive short periods of time w/o their best player. the pens played well w/o crosby last season. this team would fall apart w/o henrik. he is the only reason we have more than 4 or 5 wins this season. w/o him, we're talking about how awesome tavares would look in ranger blue.

Tom Renney is the most overrated coach in this league bar none. he gets so little out of so much its not even funny. Sather bring in players to play an up tempo offensive style a-la Buffalo from 2 years ago, we play NJD hockey. He has puck control players capable of wearing down teams 2 years ago, he has them playing NJD style hockey.

Tom Renney would be the perfect coach for a team like the Atlanta Thrashers or another ultra low payroll team. A team that wants to be competitive by playing that style of hockey, but who will never do anything but make the first round of the playoffs, 2nd max, and then be promptly slaughtered by the better teams in the league.

for a team with a perennially high payroll, he gets remarkably little out of his players. he is the ultimate square peg-round hole coach.

absolutely totally agree. reneny is the most overrated coach in the league. period.

without hank, we have what.... 5-6 wins perhaps.

i am sick and tired of hearing how renneys system is responsible for our success and how hes designed a system around our talent. give me a friggin break. hes forcing our guys to play his system when we have players who want to skate and open it up and create.

gomez, zherdev, dubi, drury, naslund, korpedo and heaven forbid petr prucha are not defensive shutdown players. they are skaters. these guys can all skate. we dont have ANY SIZE but for voros, the rest are smallish guys yet they are told to go in the corners. our best hitter for crying out loud is ryan freekin callahan who what 6'0 180 lbs? renney and his system is stifling these guys and making them all into blair betts.

there are so many tell tale signs of renneys weaknesses but here one that stands out to me.

which line seems to be renneys perfect line? which line seems to get alot more time than they deserve? which line has the least talent? well, its renneys favorite line - the 4th line. renneys perfect player- colton orr. tries hard. cant skate. cant score and focuses on nothing but defense. the perfect renney player. ugh.

he over plays the 4th line constantly. even last year with hollweg, he had them out there a key time in close games when we need to score a goal yet hes got them out there to make sure the other team doesnt score a goal. you never have your LEAST TALENTED players on the ice at crucial times of close games. and hes doing the same thing this year. how many times last year did the 4th line get more time that the second or third lines? many. ridiculous. he is so conservative and afraid of letting his guys play, that he smothers them and the result is going to be player frustration and revolt.

hes going to ruin zherdev. ill tell you right now, zherdev is a stallion. hes not a 2 way hockey player, hes a scorer. if renney tries to change him, he will take away his best attributes- his creativity and pure hockey talent.

both zherdev and gomez left boring defense first teams to sign here only to get more of the same. thats gotts suk for them.

if you listen closely and watch and read between the lines, there are cracks begining to show. renneys starting to lose some control. benching voros and z during the sens game. henrik saying " it would be nice to score a few more goals" so every game isnt a 1 goal game and if he makes a mistake they lose. now hank taking himself out last night and showing up renney.

this team is beginning to come apart and it wont be long before our record isnt enough to fall back on.

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11-20-2008, 09:21 AM
  #80
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I don't understand why people are upset about last night. The fact that there was finally a game that gave a reason to bump this thread must thrill people.

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11-20-2008, 09:25 AM
  #81
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I really really hate renney but I don't want him fired. I want him just to revise his plan and adjust his system to account for the mistakes that are consistently being made.

But i do think that involves getting a new power play coach - sorry Perry.

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11-20-2008, 09:25 AM
  #82
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I knew coming to the boards today would be fun.

It took 22 games, but now the inmates finally have a chance to run the asylum.

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11-20-2008, 09:28 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I knew coming to the boards today would be fun.

It took 22 games, but now the inmates finally have a chance to run the asylum.
22 games in and our first real clunker - i'll take it every year.

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11-20-2008, 09:33 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
22 games in and our first real clunker - i'll take it every year.
Agreed, although we had a clunker of a 3rd period in Toronto, but that was due to a couple of Valliquette softies.

This wont appease those that want the Rangers to play perfect hockey all season...and not only score a lot of goals, but pretty goals!

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11-20-2008, 09:39 AM
  #85
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Tom Renney: All of the blame, none of the credit.

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11-20-2008, 09:48 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
Tom Renney: All of the blame, none of the credit.
what credit does he deserve? Does he deserve credit for Making Lundy one of the best goalies? NO, Lundy deserves the credit (also Allaire). does he deserve credit for having a dominant forward such as Jagr? (no sather deserves credit for that great trade). Does he deserve credit for Jagr playing out of his mind when it counts? No that would be Jagr. Does he deserve credit for Nylander running the PP, scoring and setting up countless scoring chances? No that would be Nylander who gets the credit and Jagr.

But I will give him credit for a couple of things:

1. Stifling this teams offensive prowess
2. Creating the most boring hockey team EVER
3. Making young players play timid and scared b/c one mistake they get benched
4. Not holding vet players responsible for mistakes, but smashing youngings.

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Old
11-20-2008, 09:53 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Whoot Whoot View Post
I really really hate renney but I don't want him fired. I want him just to revise his plan and adjust his system to account for the mistakes that are consistently being made.

But i do think that involves getting a new power play coach - sorry Perry.
firing renney isnt the answer until the season plays out. right now, were stuck with him and its up to him to lead the team. i happen to think hes not the right guy for the job and im pretty sure he will continue to struggle in the spotlight. changing things on the fly and making corrections has never been his strong suit. hes more of a, same stuff over and over, kinda guy.

after the season, i would like him replaced. im not and never have been a renney guy and ive been consistent with that. i just believe that there are better coaches out there and he would be better suited working with young guys developing talent rather than coaching the ny rangers.

it not irrational hate or emotional overreaction. its just that ive seen what he brings and it aint that great.

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Old
11-20-2008, 09:55 AM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I don't understand why people are upset about last night. The fact that there was finally a game that gave a reason to bump this thread must thrill people.
Have you seen any indication that our team can win in the playoffs, though, SBOB?

What if we are out in the 2nd round again this year?

We need to see some sort of tangible progress.

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11-20-2008, 09:56 AM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
22 games in and our first real clunker - i'll take it every year.
Like I asked SBOB... Are you going to still be a Renney supporter if we are bounced in the 2nd round again?

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Old
11-20-2008, 10:01 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Like I asked SBOB... Are you going to still be a Renney supporter if we are bounced in the 2nd round again?
The team basically got gutted last offseason, and you're expecting to reach the conference finals? Talk about unfair expectations.

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Old
11-20-2008, 10:02 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Like I asked SBOB... Are you going to still be a Renney supporter if we are bounced in the 2nd round again?
Probably.

This team is a few pieces away, I don't expect any coach to work miracles.

If Sather addresses some things then maybe i'll expect more, but for now I'm just glad we're in the mix cause this is an unfinished team.

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Old
11-20-2008, 10:05 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
The team basically got gutted last offseason, and you're expecting to reach the conference finals? Talk about unfair expectations.
talk about lowering the bar. gutted? we lost some fossils and signed younger talent.

this team is MORE talented than last years team. hello?

i am certainly not expecting anything more than making the playoffs and getting a decent seed. other than that, its gravy.

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11-20-2008, 10:05 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
what credit does he deserve? Does he deserve credit for Making Lundy one of the best goalies? NO, Lundy deserves the credit (also Allaire). does he deserve credit for having a dominant forward such as Jagr? (no sather deserves credit for that great trade). Does he deserve credit for Jagr playing out of his mind when it counts? No that would be Jagr. Does he deserve credit for Nylander running the PP, scoring and setting up countless scoring chances? No that would be Nylander who gets the credit and Jagr.
The credit he deserves is for creating a system that his players buy in to. He deserves credit for injecting more youth into this lineup than we've seen in years. He deserves credit for winning games when he does not have a dominant players. He deserves credit for playing to this team's strength.

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But I will give him credit for a couple of things:

1. Stifling this teams offensive prowess
What offensive prowess are you referring to? Not one player on this team scored more than 26 goals last season. 6 players who have been used on the top nine spots (Dubinsky, Dawes, Voros, Callahan, Koropikoski and Fritsche) have combined for a total of 96 career goals.

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2. Creating the most boring hockey team EVER
Or built a team that works hard and knows that it can't count on outscoring its opponents every night. A team that knows it probably won't win a game if the first one to 4 wins. Oh, and I don't find winning boring.

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3. Making young players play timid and scared b/c one mistake they get benched
Source? That's just ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
4. Not holding vet players responsible for mistakes, but smashing youngings.
You have no idea whether this is true or not. The fact he does not do it publicly, does not mean it doesn't happen.

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11-20-2008, 10:08 AM
  #94
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Probably.

This team is a few pieces away, I don't expect any coach to work miracles.

If Sather addresses some things then maybe i'll expect more, but for now I'm just glad we're in the mix cause this is an unfinished team.
this team has been a few pieces away the last two seasons as well. And frankly I think that team (06-07) was a helluva lot closer than this team. They were one second line center away from being a really really good team.


But we all know what happened in the aftermath. We got rid of our first line center and brought in two second line centers.

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11-20-2008, 10:11 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
what credit does he deserve? Does he deserve credit for Making Lundy one of the best goalies? NO, Lundy deserves the credit (also Allaire). does he deserve credit for having a dominant forward such as Jagr? (no sather deserves credit for that great trade). Does he deserve credit for Jagr playing out of his mind when it counts? No that would be Jagr. Does he deserve credit for Nylander running the PP, scoring and setting up countless scoring chances? No that would be Nylander who gets the credit and Jagr.

But I will give him credit for a couple of things:

1. Stifling this teams offensive prowess
2. Creating the most boring hockey team EVER
3. Making young players play timid and scared b/c one mistake they get benched
4. Not holding vet players responsible for mistakes, but smashing youngings.
The 'blame Renney' argument isn't one that can be used only when it's convenient.

Either Renney was completely useless in getting us to the playoffs three years in a row, or he was at least partially responsible and deserves credit for doing so. If he had no part in getting us that far, then the credit goes solely to the players and the BLAME for not getting beyond the 2nd round lies solely with the players as well. You can't have it both ways.

People (including yourself) are so thrilled with the way Zherdev has been playing since he came to NY, raving about how his two-way game has improved, yet none of that can be attributed to Renney.

He's created the most boring hockey team ever? So this team is lacking offensive fire-power, yet he's supposed to engineer a way to turn the team into an exciting, high-scoring team? Yeah, I'm sure people are lining up to take that job.

What 'younging' has he ever 'smashed'? He's benched Zherdev once after playing a poor game and he's benched Dubinsky once after he took two awful penalties in the first 10 minutes of the game. So please, give me an example of this alleged 'smashing'.

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Old
11-20-2008, 10:12 AM
  #96
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Have you seen any indication that our team can win in the playoffs, though, SBOB?

What if we are out in the 2nd round again this year?

We need to see some sort of tangible progress.
Yes. I do.

1) They have the goaltending.

2) They have a good defense.

3) As bad as the PP has been, the PK has been as good.

4) They have shown ability and willingness to score garbage goals. This team has scored more goals for 5 feet away from the net than I can recall in the past three seasons. And those are the kind of goals you need to score in the playoffs.

5) You have to believe that the young forwards are going to get better as the year progresses. You would expect Callahan, Dubinsky, Korpikoski and Dawes to improve between now and the playoffs.

6) They are a young team and should not wear down as the season goes on.

7) I don't see a team in the East that is any more or less consistent than the Rangers are.

8) This team is not a finished product. And doesn't have to be a week before Thanksgiving.

If they get bounced in the second round again does he come back? Probably. If the team gets bounced in the second round and they see vast improvement in the play of their young forwards and defensemen, he's certainly back.

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11-20-2008, 10:13 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I don't understand why people are upset about last night. The fact that there was finally a game that gave a reason to bump this thread must thrill people.

Yeah because i am sure that because people think this team is flawed and the record isnt a true reflection of our play means we are just all itching to lose games just so we can bump a thread on here.

No we all want to win every game the Rangers play but just because some wont sit there and be fooled by our record then it doesnt mean we dont want to see a successful team. I understand its frustrating to see threads with so many complaints in them when our record is so good but our performances dont match our record, what happens when the bounces stop going our way? Hank has a dip in form? god forbid we get injuries?

I have to agree with the guys who posted about not liking the way this team is built but no matter what i will support them every game even though there is a few players i'd rather werent here.

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11-20-2008, 10:13 AM
  #98
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this team has been a few pieces away the last two seasons as well. And frankly I think that team (06-07) was a helluva lot closer than this team. They were one second line center away from being a really really good team.


But we all know what happened in the aftermath. We got rid of our first line center and brought in two second line centers.
And that's Renney's fault?

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11-20-2008, 10:18 AM
  #99
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talk about lowering the bar. gutted? we lost some fossils and signed younger talent.

this team is MORE talented than last years team. hello?

i am certainly not expecting anything more than making the playoffs and getting a decent seed. other than that, its gravy.
They lost 4 of their top 8 scorers.

And, no, its not a more talented team.

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11-20-2008, 10:21 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
People (including yourself) are so thrilled with the way Zherdev has been playing since he came to NY, raving about how his two-way game has improved, yet none of that can be attributed to Renney.
Not going to wade into the Great Renney Debate, but Zherdev's 2-way game is on Hitch, not Renney. No way Renney gets credit for that one.

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They lost 4 of their top 8 scorers.
By their choice. You reap what you sow.

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