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Rangers may be in a lot of cap trouble soon - Cap Going Down to 55M

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Old
11-21-2008, 07:10 AM
  #26
SaveByLundqvist
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Originally Posted by TheZherdev View Post
umm how incredibly contradictory. You make the point that we cant keep roszival because of his salary. So we trade him for J-bo who is expected to make a similar salary when he re-signs? Im more intent that by next year we trade roszival preferably for a pick, prospect, or a vermette type player (talented cheap salary). And we re-sign mara, and bring potter and Sangs into the mix. Eventually Del zotto will be ready. Honestly I wouldnt mind getting rid of both redden and roszival at some point. They are not worth their contracts, and our young guys are doing just as well as they do.

Staal-Girardi
Mara-Sanguinetti
Del Zotto-Potter

Im fine with that defensive line up 2 years down the road. If someone is not ready i dont mind keeping Kalinin around until we sort things out. Just imagine what we could do with our cap if we got rid of roszival and redden. In 2 years if redden roszival naslund prucha are all off the team. That frees up more than 16 million. WIth some of the raises players will get, I think we should still have room to sign kovlachuck.

it would be fun to see
kovalchuck-Gomez-Zherdev
Korpikoski-Dubinsky-Drury
Dawes-Anisimov-Callahan
Sjo-Betts-Orr/Fritsche

Staal-Girardi
Mara-Sanguinetti
Del Zotto-Potter

Lundqvist

I really do think that would be a cup contending line-up 2 years down the road.
i'm just saying i rather give a big contract to j-bo rather thanrozsival, rozsival makes too much for what he is... If J-bo resigns we strenthen our D and then shed cap elsewhere and it he doesn't we ended up having J-Bo for the rest of the year and dropped Rozy's 5 mil

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11-21-2008, 07:15 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
The Looney hit 79 cents on the dollar yesterday. If it goes much lower, it will singlehandidly drag the cap down. The only solace for the Rangers is that 10-12 teams will be in the same boatr.
Again, teh question was did you read the article?

The cap, if it goes down, is only expected to go down to 55million

The Rangers are far from in trouble.

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11-21-2008, 07:37 AM
  #28
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Based on the following like, the Rangers Cap hit drops to approx. $44.2 million after this season.

We lose Kalinin and Mara to UFA, Possibly Betts, Valliquette and Orr

We would be left with 10 players on the pro roster signed to that 44 million.

Our RFA's are Zherdev, Dubinsky, Callahan, Sjostrom, Fritsche, Prucha, Korpikoski and Dawes.

The key RFA's that we should resign are in bold.

On D I would expect to see Sanguinetti make the jump out of necessity as well as a stron push from Potter and or Fahey and both Potter and Sangs also need to be re-signed as they are also RFA's.

With the cap space available and the players we have in the system available, I'm not sure that I see a major problem. It will be tight but it will be done and I think I see a better team next year than the one we have this year.

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11-21-2008, 07:57 AM
  #29
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I keep seeing threads posted where the Rangers need to trade Roszival. I am with you guys and I agree that his contract hurts us. No one in the league is going to be doing the Rangers any favors by taking bad contracts off of our hands. I mentioned a few days ago that the Rangers would have to either take a bad contract back which makes it a moot point or send a high draft pick to the other team for the favor of taking the contract off our hands.

Sather has made some strange moves. (length and money given to Rissmiller, Redden, Roszival. I won't add Gomez or Drury because I was excited when they signed so I'd be a hypocrite but I do see the cap space situation their contracts create.)

We see the flaws of the team and players every night because it's our team. I am sure that NHL scouts see the same. Sather isn't going to "trick" anyone into accepting Roszival or Prucha in a trade. Put the shoe on the other foot. If you were scouting the Rangers, would you go to your team and say, we really need to get Michael Roszival on our team. Even if a team needs a defenseman. A contending team would most likely not have the space to accomodate Roszival's contract and a team that is rebuilding would most likely reserve that roster spot for a younger defenseman/prospect.

Since the salary cap era started in 2005-06, I have learned to lower my expectations and just route for the team. This team and at least the short term future beats the hell out of the teams from 1998-2004.

The team from two years ago 2006-07. A lot of people point to that team as being the best we had since the lockout. Let's not forget we lost a mid February game to Columbus and were very much out of a playoff spot (Avery had been acquired a week or two earlier). We went on an incredible run in March to get the 6th seed. And who knows what could have been if Drury doesn't score against us.

Call it blinders or nieve but I have confidence in upper management that we will be seeing a competitive team for a long time. Yes Drury and Gomez make a lot of money but they aren't the worst players to have on your team.

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11-21-2008, 08:35 AM
  #30
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honestly, id rather trade gomez and redden. longer bigger contracts.

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11-21-2008, 08:40 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
honestly, id rather trade gomez and redden. longer bigger contracts.
Thankfully, your wish wont be coming true anytime soon.

I think we're fine with the cap, people worry too much

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11-21-2008, 08:43 AM
  #32
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I just hope Rozi will be moved.

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11-21-2008, 08:46 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
honestly, id rather trade gomez and redden. longer bigger contracts.
agree with you 100%.

by the way, excellent article. completely true.

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11-21-2008, 08:58 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by bumrusherer View Post
But sometimes there are players out there who are worth the dollar.

I think this is much ado about nothing and would be surprised if the cap went down.


Yeah i agree there is players who would be worth it but we wont be going for any for a while because Sather has us locked in with so many big contracts with NTC's.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Thankfully, your wish wont be coming true anytime soon.

I think we're fine with the cap, people worry too much
Glen is that you

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Old
11-21-2008, 09:01 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
honestly, id rather trade gomez and redden. longer bigger contracts.
Where do I sign up for that?

Anyway, this should mean ticket prices go down as well.

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11-21-2008, 09:02 AM
  #36
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I think this only decreases the likelihood that these players signed to UFA contracts will be traded. Why would any team want to pay summer of '07 or '08 prices for a UFA when there will certainly be a market correction coming for UFA value?

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11-21-2008, 09:06 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
honestly, id rather trade gomez and redden. longer bigger contracts.
No one is going to be stupid enough to trade for Redden and his contract. Maybe they can find someone dumb enough to swindle with Gomez, but it won't happen.

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11-21-2008, 09:22 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Balej20 View Post
Where do I sign up for that?

Anyway, this should mean ticket prices go down as well.
ok lets not get carried away here.

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11-21-2008, 09:52 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
ok lets not get carried away here.
If we're lucky the prices won't increase next year. Which with the way things are going right now and if they continue this way, the Dolans would have to be the biggest pieces of crap in the world to increase ticket prices next year.

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11-21-2008, 12:00 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
No one is going to be stupid enough to trade for Redden and his contract. Maybe they can find someone dumb enough to swindle with Gomez, but it won't happen.
somebody took brian mccabe, someone will take wade redden.

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11-21-2008, 12:05 PM
  #41
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If we're lucky the prices won't increase next year. Which with the way things are going right now and if they continue this way, the Dolans would have to be the biggest pieces of crap in the world to increase ticket prices next year.
So what you're saying is.... ticket prices are going up?

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11-21-2008, 12:16 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
No one is going to be stupid enough to trade for Redden and his contract. Maybe they can find someone dumb enough to swindle with Gomez, but it won't happen.
We will NEVER be in salary cap hell.

Worst case scenario is if we have contracts that no one wants, we send them to Hartford.

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11-21-2008, 12:25 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
Again, teh question was did you read the article?

The cap, if it goes down, is only expected to go down to 55million

The Rangers are far from in trouble.
Yes I read the article. But I have also read other articles. The strength of the Canadian dollar has been one of the big cap drivers. Remove that variable and the cap could sag 2-3MM. And if that happens there are 10-12 teams in cap purgatory. How would you like to be Anaheim right now?

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11-21-2008, 12:57 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
Yes I read the article. But I have also read other articles. The strength of the Canadian dollar has been one of the big cap drivers. Remove that variable and the cap could sag 2-3MM. And if that happens there are 10-12 teams in cap purgatory. How would you like to be Anaheim right now?
Well, based off the following link http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=ANA I don't see a major issue there.

In fact they are going to have more cap space than the Rangers next year. They will also need to sign more players, but with the flexibility they have that we don't I kind of envy them.

With Escrow I don't see a major reduction in the annual cap number. The amount in escrow is pretty significant so I'm not sure that you are taking that totally into consideration.

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11-21-2008, 01:23 PM
  #45
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i dont see a problem.......if sather needs more room he can move rozsival...many people say that his signing was a bad idea and i dont understand......he is a very valuable trading chip if it comes down to that....you have to look at values when signing players too.....what if(god forbid) sanguinetti gets hurt this season and cant play for the rest of the year?....or the same thing happens to potter?......rozsival is a stop-gap IMO who will be traded once sather and renney feel the younger, cheaper players are ready and what is the worst they will get for him?.......a 2nd round pick?.....ill take that

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11-21-2008, 02:49 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
Why are we going to be in cap trouble? The cap will be about 55 million next season. We have about that in salary right now.

Its only going down 1.5 million.
I would expect that Zherdev, Dubinsky, Dawes, Callahan, Sjostrom and Fritsche will all be looking for raises.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drewcon40 View Post
How many years are left on the current CBA? I thought it was a 6 year agreement and we are in year 4 of it. Can anyone confirm or correct me?
At the end of this year the NHLPA has the option to opt out. From what I've read the players have made out better than expected so far so they probably won't opt out of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
honestly, id rather trade gomez and redden. longer bigger contracts.
Naslund, Rozsival, Drury are my picks, in that order. Naslund will most definitely be moved to a team with a self imposed cap. They'll have the space but won't want to spend the money, which is exactly what he will be in the 2nd year of his contract (i.e. McCabe to Florida).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Balej20 View Post
Anyway, this should mean ticket prices go down as well.
Not unless every company in and around Manhattan decides to cancel their season subscriptions. Then you might see some kind of family packages or fan based marketing, until then, good luck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
somebody took brian mccabe, someone will take wade redden.
McCabe makes less and his actual cost is nearly 1 million less than his cap hit. Redden, after his 1st year, is only a difference of 300k. There is really no savings to a team with a self imposed cap and too big of a hit for someone who is spending to the cap.

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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
i dont see a problem.......if sather needs more room he can move rozsival...many people say that his signing was a bad idea and i dont understand......he is a very valuable trading chip if it comes down to that....you have to look at values when signing players too.....what if(god forbid) sanguinetti gets hurt this season and cant play for the rest of the year?....or the same thing happens to potter?......rozsival is a stop-gap IMO who will be traded once sather and renney feel the younger, cheaper players are ready and what is the worst they will get for him?.......a 2nd round pick?.....ill take that
Girardi IS younger, cheaper and better. With Girardi and Redden, Rozsival is expendable. He's only worth his salary if he puts up numbers equal to last year, which I fear occurred because of him being motivated by his impending UFA status. If Redden and Girardi are the top 2 D-men, I'm comfortable with Staal and Mara at 3 and 4. Which means 5 could be Kalinin and a 6th could be anyone available for trade. The Rangers don't need Rozsival to be a top pairing D any more. If he plays well enough to justify his salary, he should be moved this offseason. If he doesn't, no one will want him.

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11-21-2008, 04:46 PM
  #47
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Lets break this down a little bit. For the sake of the argument lets operate under the premise that the cap will decrease slightly as the article indicates and we'll use 54 mill as the cap number for next season.


Under Contract for Next Year:

Forwards: (Cap Hits)

Scott Gomez - 7,357,143
Chris Drury - 7,050,000
Markus Naslund - 4,000,000
Aaron Voros - 1,000,000
Patrick Rissmiller - 1,000,000

Defense: (Cap Hits)

Wade Redden - 6,500,000
Michael Rozsival - 5,000,000
Dan Girardi - 1,550,000
Marc Staal - 826,667

Goalie: (Cap Hits)

Henrik Lundqvist - 6,875,000


Total Cap Hit: 41,158,810

54,000,000 - 41,158,810 =
12,841,190 (Left for RFA's and UFA's)


RFA's:

Nikolai Zherdev - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 3,250,000)
Brandon Dubinsky - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 635,000)
Petr Prucha - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 1,600,000)
Lauri Korpikoski - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 984,200)
Dan Fritsche - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 875,000)
Fredrik Sjostrom - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 840,000)
Nigel Dawes - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 587,500)
Ryan Callahan - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 575,000)

UFA's:

Blair Betts - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 615,000)
Colton Orr - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 550,000)
Dmitri Kalinin - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 2,100,000)
Paul Mara - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 1,950,000)
Stephen Valiquette - (2008/09 Actual Salary/Not Cap Hit - 725,000)


Alright so that is how it is laid out. We have 12,841,190 to bring back the above RFA's/UFA's that we want. Is that possible? I will give it a try below. I am working under the premise that no one offers any of our RFA's an offer sheet, specifically Dubinsky or Zherdev. If that happens we are probably gonna have to get really creative.

Everything I do is pure speculation in terms of what I believe players could potentially get in raises. Feel free to disagree.

RFA's:

Zherdev - raise from 3,250,000 to 4,000,000
Dubinsky - raise from 635,000 to 1,500,000
Prucha - no offer
Korpikoski - raise from 984,200 to 1,000,000
Fritsche - no offer
Sjostrom - raise from 840,000 to 900,000
Dawes - raise from 587,500 to 650,000
Callahan - raise from 575,000 to 900,000


UFA's:

Betts - re-sign for 950,000
Orr - re-sign for 650,000
Mara - re-sign for 3,000,000
Kalinin - No Offer
Valiquette - re-sign for 850,000

Total for the re-signing of the above RFA's and UFA's: 14,400,000

12,841,190 - 14,400,000 = -1,558,810

I think I kept my RFA and UFA salaries very modest and I still went into the red by 1,558,810 mill. So if the cap does in fact move slightly down or even stay the same we are not in really great shape. Nevermind bringing in any new UFA's, just trying to keep our team together will be difficult. If someone throws an offer sheet at Dubi or Zherdev things could get really interesting. I think this is the danger of operating every season under the expectation that the cap will keep going up every year. Which is what we have been doing.

Just to summarize the team I tried to create under the cap would look like this.....

Drury - Gomez - Naslund
Zherdev - Dubinsky - Voros
Dawes - Korpikoski - Callahan
Sjostrom - Betts - Orr

Redden - Girardi
Staal - Mara
Rozsival - ?

Henrik
Vally

Extra:
Patrick Rissmiller

If we keep Rissmiller in Hartford we clear 1,000,000 in salary. So that would make us 558,810 over the cap. While still needing a 6th D-Man and an extra forward. Not a very good position to be in.


Final Conclusion: Pray that the cap keeps going up.

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11-21-2008, 05:05 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
No one is going to be stupid enough to trade for Redden and his contract. Maybe they can find someone dumb enough to swindle with Gomez, but it won't happen.
That's a ridiculous statement. I'd bet my left nut that Columbus (and probably the likes of teams like Atlanta, Florida and maybe a few others - essentially teams that have major troubles attracting free agents) would take either one of Redden or Rozsival's contracts off our hands in the blink of an eye.

How quickly we forget that Columbus actually offered Redden an even larger contract, he simply didn't want to go there, and who could blame him?

Salaries can be moved, and our key pieces to be resigned are all RFAs, not UFAs, so there's really no problem, and I really don't see what the fuss is all about. Anyone who actually took the time to read the article would see that they're saying the teams' cap space wouldn't change, that each individual player's salary would take a hit as a result, relative to the percentage of his team's total salary cap amount.

Dubinsky won't just "refuse" to sign, as someone stated earlier, he's an RFA, what's he going to do? Go ahead, let some desperate GM offer him a $5mil+ contract, I'll take the picks.

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11-21-2008, 09:51 PM
  #49
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With teams desperate for D around the league, I really don't think we'll have that much trouble dumping Rozi and or Redden, preferably Rozi obviously if Rangers mang. choses to. We def. won't get equal value, but I don't think we'll have to ripen the deal with picks or anything.

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11-21-2008, 09:53 PM
  #50
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aren't we also giving raises to dubi and zherdev? so someone has to get the boot

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