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Sergei's days are numbered?

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Old
12-01-2008, 09:56 PM
  #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
I don't know why when talking about a player, one must turn it onto another player. If we're talking about Kostitsyn having to step it up one notch, why do we have to bring in Latendresse and/or Higgins and/or Kovalev into the mix? Because someone else doesn't play well doesn't change the fact that young Kostitsyn needs to improve, in my opinion. It's a smoke screen that's pretty easy to read through...

In both young Kostitsyn and Latendresse's cases, they're young. Give them time as they're not the problem. The main problem sits with some veterans (young and older) not playing the way they did last year.
In Lats defense he's been out 10 days and didn't play a ton last game.

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12-01-2008, 09:57 PM
  #102
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That's a good point - a lot of threads degenerate into mindless exchanges of "your favourite player sucks, my favourite can do no wrong"...etc. But in this case, Sergei played like a fool and it is Carbonneau's job to call him out on it. Taking stupid penalties did nothing to help his cause, he should have taken inspiration from his brother and scored for a change.

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12-01-2008, 09:58 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Well Jean-Charles has a freakin point. DeFoy wants Latendresse to be meaner and tougher and use his body...the GUY NEVER DID IT! He was a lot bigger than most guys in the Q and even then, wasn't using his body so much, now he has to do it on bigger guys.

Latendresse needs to play on an offensive line and scores. That's why they got him. They didn't draft him so he could play the role of a 3rd and 4th liner. But for that to happen, he needs to be in an offensive line, needs to stay close to the net, needs to pick up the rebounds and needs to play a role in the powerplay. That's what Latendresse is all about.

Then if you try him extensively and it doesn't work, then you can either trade him or explain to the guy that he can't be succesful as a sniper and be a 3rd liner who can score from time to time.

But Latendresse becoming meaner makes as much sense as Higgins having better hands...
You have a very very good point... although I remember Guy's physical game during his first two training camps being light years ahead of where it is now. He has the ability to do it, he just can't sustain it over an 82 game season. It just isn't his style.

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12-01-2008, 10:00 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Well Jean-Charles has a freakin point. DeFoy wants Latendresse to be meaner and tougher and use his body...the GUY NEVER DID IT! He was a lot bigger than most guys in the Q and even then, wasn't using his body so much, now he has to do it on bigger guys.

Latendresse needs to play on an offensive line and scores. That's why they got him. They didn't draft him so he could play the role of a 3rd and 4th liner. But for that to happen, he needs to be in an offensive line, needs to stay close to the net, needs to pick up the rebounds and needs to play a role in the powerplay. That's what Latendresse is all about.

Then if you try him extensively and it doesn't work, then you can either trade him or explain to the guy that he can't be succesful as a sniper and be a 3rd liner who can score from time to time.

But Latendresse becoming meaner makes as much sense as Higgins having better hands...
If he is not mean, then so are 90% of NHLers as he "outhits" them.

I liked him with Koivu and Tanguay except he was trying too hard to set them up instead of shooting himself, also going to the net more. These are subtle adjustments that are needed, not exactly earth shattering.

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12-01-2008, 10:05 PM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
I don't know why when talking about a player, one must turn it onto another player. If we're talking about Kostitsyn having to step it up one notch, why do we have to bring in Latendresse and/or Higgins and/or Kovalev into the mix? Because someone else doesn't play well doesn't change the fact that young Kostitsyn needs to improve, in my opinion. It's a smoke screen that's pretty easy to read through...

In both young Kostitsyn and Latendresse's cases, they're young. Give them time as they're not the problem. The main problem sits with some veterans (young and older) not playing the way they did last year.
I can agree with leaving other players out of the equation. Unfortunately the tendency is for folks to compare

To me a lot of this revolves around expectations. Both Lats and SK are below expectations at the present moment. However, I think they have a lot of company on the Habs.

I have a sneaking suspicion that if SK and Lats were playing well, we'd still have a lot of things up in the air.

Some folks can be so reactionary it's scary. Bench! Trade! Demote! A few weeks earlier or later they are laying palms before their feet. Look at the cycle Price has gone through already.

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Old
12-01-2008, 10:06 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Well Jean-Charles has a freakin point. DeFoy wants Latendresse to be meaner and tougher and use his body...the GUY NEVER DID IT! He was a lot bigger than most guys in the Q and even then, wasn't using his body so much, now he has to do it on bigger guys.

Latendresse needs to play on an offensive line and scores. That's why they got him. They didn't draft him so he could play the role of a 3rd and 4th liner. But for that to happen, he needs to be in an offensive line, needs to stay close to the net, needs to pick up the rebounds and needs to play a role in the powerplay. That's what Latendresse is all about.



Then if you try him extensively and it doesn't work, then you can either trade him or explain to the guy that he can't be succesful as a sniper and be a 3rd liner who can score from time to time.

But Latendresse becoming meaner makes as much sense as Higgins having better hands...
Jean-Charles also said that if Latendresse had slipped a bit it paled in comparison to the huge "débarque" SKost had taken (complete with Jean-Charles swinging his arm to show the "débarque"). He also said that SKost should be taken off the power play "right now" (totally oblivious to the fact that the Habs score more PP points for every 60 minutes of icetime with SKost than any other PP regular).

I agree with the jist of the rest of your post.

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12-01-2008, 10:09 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
If he is not mean, then so are 90% of NHLers as he "outhits" them.

I liked him with Koivu and Tanguay except he was trying too hard to set them up instead of shooting himself, also going to the net more. These are subtle adjustments that are needed, not exactly earth shattering.
I see a lot of finishing checks than hits to actually separate the puck from the puck carrier. And you can give checks without being mean. Clearly, the kid is not stupid, he's been ask to hit, he does it. Like some fighters who are ask to fight, but don't like it.....we know one here.....But I'm pretty certain that if Latendresse was asked to be a dominant factor offensively, he would choose that over hitting any day of the week. And when I also think of somebody who is mean, it could also actually mean that whenever there's a scrap in front of the goalie, you can actually look in the guy's eyes you're "scrapping" with.....

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12-01-2008, 10:12 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
Jean-Charles also said that if Latendresse had slipped a bit it paled in comparison to the huge "débarque" SKost had taken (complete with Jean-Charles swinging his arm to show the "débarque"). He also said that SKost should be taken off the power play "right now" (totally oblivious to the fact that the Habs score more PP points for every 60 minutes of icetime with SKost than any other PP regular).

I agree with the jist of the rest of your post.
Well it remains to be seen to see the effect that Latendresse could have on a PP 'cause we didn't see a whole lot of that. And actually if removing SKost is to give Lats in there, I say why not. 'Cause again, we would see if Lats is interested in being in front of the net receiving shots from d-men and pucks on his body. If so, it would mean that he understands his role. Would gain confidence by doing so and scoring and would start doing it 5 on 5. I keep having in mind what AKost did with Chara, pushing him like it was nothing just with his freakin butt.....can't imagine what Lats could do if he uses his body more adequately. No need to send a guy in the 3rd row. Just to create yourself more space.

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12-01-2008, 10:15 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
I see a lot of finishing checks than hits to actually separate the puck from the puck carrier. And you can give checks without being mean. Clearly, the kid is not stupid, he's been ask to hit, he does it. Like some fighters who are ask to fight, but don't like it.....we know one here.....But I'm pretty certain that if Latendresse was asked to be a dominant factor offensively, he would choose that over hitting any day of the week. And when I also think of somebody who is mean, it could also actually mean that whenever there's a scrap in front of the goalie, you can actually look in the guy's eyes you're "scrapping" with.....
It's normal for young players to emphasise certain things to stay in the lineup or on a certain line.

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12-01-2008, 10:19 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erika Kostitsyn View Post
Just ship this lazy Bum out of this town. This team doesn't need young intense, feisty, cocky, arrogant and talented future star players like Sergei.

We need more guys like Chris Higgins who's despite continuously playing on the first line with the best center of the team and receiving first powerplay ice time, managed to put up impressive numbers (5 goals - 4 assists = 9 points in 17 games, with a 3 goals game).

Despite floating around in 70% of the games, missing open nets, can't score or pass to save his life, he is still the future leader of this team that will win you numerous cups.
You are so far removed from reality when it comes to Sergei it's unbelievable. Its clear that this obsessive "crush" that you have on him greatly influences your opinions, creating a huge bias. Higgins has nothing to prove compared to Sergei. He put his time in the AHL, and has been resonably successful at the NHL level while displaying strong leadership qualities. Sergei got rocketed to the NHL because of personel reasons and he managed to string together a good half season. So far this season, he has been struggling to be the player that he is capible of being. Thats the reality, he got lucky, and did well with the break he got.

Sergei is a good player, but he oozes arrogance and I can beleive that he is acting the way the article portrayed. He needs a couple games in the press box, and if that doesn't humble him, then a stint in the AHL is necessary. You simply can't have anyone think they are automatically entitled to anything on a hockey team, especially if they are a softmore player on the 3rd line, who is playing well below their potential. He'll bounce back, and its good that he's pissed about being on the 4th line, but I'm afraid its going to take another demotion to wake him up...

And before Erika flames me for being a Higgins fanboy, for the record, I am a big S. Kost fan...

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12-01-2008, 10:41 PM
  #111
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So now Sergei is arrogant. Is this because he took 2-3 penalties last game? What a joke. He's a small but feisty player. If that's arrogance someone please re-write the dictionary.

This is the guy that flat out said that he won't bolt to Russia for more money and that he doesn't mind playing a limited role because that's what the coach wants, that's what he does and that's what is ultimately best for the team.

He's just had a bad stretch. It's not like he's turning the puck over every game like Higgins and Kovalev. He's just missed a few chances playing on the bottom 2 lines with useless players like Begin and Dandenault.

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12-01-2008, 11:01 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Bileur View Post
He's a BUM! Thankfully the Sens will take a hit for their Canadiens friends and him off your hands.
Sergei for Phillips, book it.

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12-01-2008, 11:03 PM
  #113
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I hate reading this title.

Can we change it to "Pat Hickey speculates Sergei may be out of the lineup"...?

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12-02-2008, 01:57 AM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CdHC View Post
So now Sergei is arrogant. Is this because he took 2-3 penalties last game? What a joke. He's a small but feisty player. If that's arrogance someone please re-write the dictionary.

This is the guy that flat out said that he won't bolt to Russia for more money and that he doesn't mind playing a limited role because that's what the coach wants, that's what he does and that's what is ultimately best for the team.

He's just had a bad stretch. It's not like he's turning the puck over every game like Higgins and Kovalev. He's just missed a few chances playing on the bottom 2 lines with useless players like Begin and Dandenault.
Don't forget the coach stating publicly, 'his a 2nd year player acting like his been here 10 years' when talking about the demotion.

Edit: That is disconcerning, I hope it plays itself out. Sounds like the kid needs an attitude adjustment.


Last edited by Arctic_Hab_Fan: 12-02-2008 at 02:23 AM.
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12-02-2008, 02:02 AM
  #115
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That could mean anything from he handled it like a professional or he whined like a baby (Brisebois/Dandenault/Begin). What is the context of that quote? Knowing the media, I am sure it was taken out of context

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12-02-2008, 02:14 AM
  #116
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Quote:
Canadiens coach Guy Carbonneau expressed his displeasure with the younger Kostitsyn after the Canadiens practised in Verdun today.
That pretty much answers your question.

Edit: and then theres this bit...
Quote:
Sergei Kostitsyn spent most the third period nailed to the bench after his third penalty, a retaliatory slash in a one-goal hockey game.
These quotes are from an article...http://habsinsideout.com/boone/11928


Last edited by Arctic_Hab_Fan: 12-02-2008 at 02:22 AM.
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12-02-2008, 02:23 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Arctic_Hab_Fan View Post
That pretty much answers your question.
Not really. That comment can refer to his on ice performance of late, not how he handled the demotion. All the article said was that Sergei was upset that he was on the 4th line at practice. Surely he wasn't going to be happy about it, was he? Nowhere did it say he handled it like an arrogant player and complained about it.

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12-02-2008, 02:31 AM
  #118
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The Coach Expressed his displeasure...I don't know how else one can describe it, the kid gets demoted...coach says 'his a 2nd year player acting like his been here ten years'...

How else are you going to interpret that?

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12-02-2008, 02:34 AM
  #119
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And no, Sergei and his Brother were relegated to the fourth line on Saturday.

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12-02-2008, 06:57 AM
  #120
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LOL Do we actually have set lines on this team?

What was the 4th line THIS time. Seems like everybody has been on it

Carbo is not happy. Fine. He is the coach, it's his job to deal with players. Is it a big enough issue to talk to the press about? Hardly

Is the coach going to discuss the emotional levels of all the guys on the team with the press?

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12-02-2008, 07:14 AM
  #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CdHC View Post
Habs fans are such drama queens. Just because he sits a game or two does not end a career
That sums it up nicely. I can't believe people are going so crazy over something that is not that big of a deal.

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12-02-2008, 07:28 AM
  #122
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My guess is that something in the kid's demeanour probably at practice, maybe on the bench after his last penalty, pissed Carbo off.

If he's sulking about what line he's on, he's got a problem then, because when things aren't working out, you look in the mirror not for excuses. He has tyhe necessary tools to be an exceptional player but has to prove that he wants to put the work in more than the lifestyle it gives him. I don't see why he won't.

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12-02-2008, 08:14 AM
  #123
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As always people need to be patient with the young guys. I don't see anything wrong with SKost aside from an obvious lack of immaturity that will only come with time and experience. People expecting 70 pts from him this year need a reality check.

He's a heck of a hockey player and in a few yrs we'll be happy we didn't ship him too early like so many young players before him. Let's just hope the media doesn't make it happen..

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12-02-2008, 08:27 AM
  #124
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Originally Posted by Pascal View Post
As always people need to be patient with the young guys. I don't see anything wrong with SKost aside from an obvious lack of immaturity that will only come with time and experience. People expecting 70 pts from him this year need a reality check.

He's a heck of a hockey player and in a few yrs we'll be happy we didn't ship him too early like so many young players before him. Let's just hope the media doesn't make it happen..
Doesn't happen much though, does it. Of all the players currently with the Habs, here are the guys who have played the fewest games. I clearly highlighted all the ones who have managed to avoid people (of some sort or other) getting on their case so far this year. Number of games played (regular season only) in brackets:

D'Agostini (2)
Halak (28)
O'Byrne (52)
Price (59)
S Kostitsyn (75)
Lapierre (120)
A Kostitsyn (133)
Latendresse (173)
Gorges (188)
Higgins (242)
Plekanec (254)


Last edited by Qui Gon Dave: 12-02-2008 at 08:45 AM. Reason: Forgot Gorges
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