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Old
12-11-2008, 06:22 PM
  #26
Canadian_Brewtality
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
?

I hope you mean if we wanted to re-sign Jay Bo long-term, then yeah.

But Jay Bo's cap hit is 4.8 M, so we can fit him in our cap come February without a doubt. No need to move Hammer.
Was talking long term.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:23 PM
  #27
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3 first rounders for a guy who has yet to play a playoff game is a bit much. Gainey would rather find a cheaper alternative...

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:24 PM
  #28
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Anybody considering this deal is a fool.

You make this type of deal at the trade deadline if you feel you can make a run. Even then, you think not twice but ten times before making it.

Pitts made this deal for Hossa and he signed for next to nothing the following season with Detroit for a chance to win. Meanwhile, Pitts lost on some good young talent and it shows this season.

You can't compromise the future for the immediate future with a UFA. If he was signed that's one thing but he's free as air and we'd be giving up a lot of potential for a maybe resigning with us for the future.

No way you give up a 1st with Timmons calling the shots, Higgy and MaxPax for a possible resigning UFA later on? You would have to be nuts!!

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:25 PM
  #29
Marc the Habs Fan
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Originally Posted by Canadian_Brewtality View Post
Yes dreaming.
Because lesser players havent been traded for just as many prospects, picks, and players.

Habs fans just over-evaluate all of there prospects
Look at what Hossa (along Dupuis) got ATL (a good prospect with a high chance to be a bust in Esposito, a late 1st, 2 young NHL players who are mediocreties in Armstrong and Christensen) and that was considered a severe overpayment at the time.

Look at what Campbell got BUF, Bernier and a late 1st.

Ryan Smyth brought back a near bust in Nilsson at the time, a bust in O'Marra and a mid-1st.

It's not about over-evaluating our prospects at all. It's about what the cost has been for UFA to be rentals in recent years. Higgins, Max Pac and a 1st would be the most significant price paid.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:25 PM
  #30
Dan K
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Replace Pacioretty with Carle, White, or a similar mid-level prospect and I'd consider it. Higgins + a 1st won't be enough to get him.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:26 PM
  #31
Kirk Muller
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If sign and trade, then definitely. He is a franchise defenseman.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:27 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
Florida is dreaming if they think they can get that for a UFA-to-be. Dreaming.

It must be noted though that Pierre said something like ''Higgins, Pacioretty and a 1st gets it done TODAY''. As in, Florida would be stupid not to take such an offer at this point. I don't think he meant that it will DEFINITELY take that much to get Bouwmeester. He didn't say the Habs were in the Bouwmeester sweeps, he was just asked what the price could/would be. He also said earlier in the conversation that CGY wants Bouwmeester desperately, but a quick glance at their prospect situation/current roster and you notice they have almost nothing to offer in terms of expendable cheap young players.
exactly.. The Flames are a good example of my post above, they have no depth.. Nothing to offer.. Dustin Boyd is their only cheap and young player with some value but he is nowhere near to have the value a guy like Higgins have.. If the Flames had a Chris Higgins, they would keep him believe me, they wouldnt trade him for a guy they are not sure to resign at the end and they wouldnt make their team weaker up front to upgrade their D, not logic, its like changing 4 quarters for 1$.. On the other side, Habs can affort to give a guy like Higgins for immediate help on D, cause they have plenty young cheap skilled wingers for the years to come and they have a serious chance to go far in the playoffs..

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:33 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
1st round pick + Higgins + Pacioretty


He says thats what it would take for Montreal to get Jay Bo.
Take out Patches if he won't sign.

If he will sign before the trade is complete, I'd try and get them to take a defenseman (McDonough or Fischer) over Patches, but this is worth considering.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:33 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RushDP View Post
Anybody considering this deal is a fool.

You make this type of deal at the trade deadline if you feel you can make a run. Even then, you think not twice but ten times before making it.

Pitts made this deal for Hossa and he signed for next to nothing the following season with Detroit for a chance to win. Meanwhile, Pitts lost on some good young talent and it shows this season.

You can't compromise the future for the immediate future with a UFA. If he was signed that's one thing but he's free as air and we'd be giving up a lot of potential for a maybe resigning with us for the future.

No way you give up a 1st with Timmons calling the shots, Higgy and MaxPax for a possible resigning UFA later on? You would have to be nuts!!
You are mixing fruits and vegetables.. Pens' offer was laughable.. Christensen = Corey Locke.. Armstrong is a quality grinder and I dont remember the rest of the crap that poor Trashers GM got for Hossa..

Higgins alone eclipse that offer..

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:35 PM
  #35
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Higgins and a 1st I'd do.. if I had to add something, the best prospect I'd let us add is Fischer.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:36 PM
  #36
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If Bouwmeester were on a long-term contract it would be a fair trade and it might be enough to put the Habs ahead of the Bruins. The first rounder would probably not amount to much because the Habs would be yielding a low pick, Higgins is a very good player, and Pacioretty is very promising but Bouwmester would improve the PP and the defense quite a bit. The only reservation I would have is the contract. Without his signature on a 5-year pact, I'd say no thanks.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:37 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Andrei Kostopolous View Post
If sign and trade, then definitely. He is a franchise defenseman.
Under a cap era, a 7 millions Bouwmeester has less value on the market than a high touted prospect like Max Paccioretty already playing in the AHL at the age of 19 years old..

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:41 PM
  #38
Mats NAslund
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
1st round pick + Higgins + Pacioretty


He says thats what it would take for Montreal to get Jay Bo.
Switch Pacioretti for LAtendresse and Jaybo signs for 5 years and I say good deal.

Higgins
Latendresse
1st rounder

Jaybo signed 5 years

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:41 PM
  #39
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dont forget florida is a 500 team, and only 4 points back with a game in hand. who nos, maybe theyll wanna keep him if they can can grind into the playoffs. i at least dont see him goin anytime before feb though, which is probably a good thing for montreal.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:42 PM
  #40
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An equivalent trade to the Hossa deal would be:

Bouwmeester (= Hossa) and Peltonen (= Dupuis)

FOR

Latendresse (= Armstrong), S. Kostitsyn (= Christiensen), Fischer (1st rounder with question marks) and a 1st.

Christiensen was a young scorer who had just broken into the league. Armstrong was a solid 3rd liner who put up decent points. Esposito was a 1st rounder with huge question marks.

Not saying I'd do this, just saying, if you want to get as close as possible, this is it. Mind you, Hossa didn't sign. Statistically, Higgins is more comparable than Lats to Armstrong. I'd also say Bouwmeester's is lower than Hossa. But that's the closest I can get.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:42 PM
  #41
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No way I trade that package for a rental. A sign and trade would be dumb and almost suicidal with the cap going down in 2010-11, bob is smarter than that. No way I trade pacioretty for a rental, any rental that is.

The price I'd be willing to pay at the deadline for Bouvmeester is something like a 1st, Carle and perhaps Lats, but Lapierre would be my first choice. Not worth breaking the bank for a rental, especially since the draft has so much depth.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:44 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by NewHabsArea View Post
Under a cap era, a 7 millions Bouwmeester has less value on the market than a high touted prospect like Max Paccioretty already playing in the AHL at the age of 19 years old..
An all-star quality Dman like Bouwmeester eclipses an unproven, although promising, prospect. To put the trade in perspective, you couldn't get Bouwmeester for 5 Latendresses (and I don't mean Olivier).

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:45 PM
  #43
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I'm cool with the main piece being Higgins, given our offensive depth and his injury struggles.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:45 PM
  #44
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I'd do it if we replace Patch by Tender or another D prospect. We can't trade MaxPac since we don't have that much depth on front in the minors.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:46 PM
  #45
Team_Spirit
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Originally Posted by Canadian_Brewtality View Post
Yes dreaming.
Because lesser players havent been traded for just as many prospects, picks, and players.

Habs fans just over-evaluate all of there prospects
Could you please explain? If you allude to the Tkachuk and Hossa deals then you're out of lunch...

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:46 PM
  #46
Chomsky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
An all-star quality Dman like Bouwmeester eclipses an unproven, although promising, prospect. To put the trade in perspective, you couldn't get Bouwmeester for 5 Latendresses (and I don't mean Olivier).
You're over-rating JayBo.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:49 PM
  #47
Lucius
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You're over-rating JayBo.
I don't think he is.

However, let me point something else out.

Cap wise, that trade doesn't work.

Reality wise, we have Hammer and Markov down the left side. I love Bouwmeester, but Hammer is a bit highly paid to play on the 3rd pairing and if we're going to break the bank, I'd go for a right handed shot.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:51 PM
  #48
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So...Basically it would take 3 1st round draft picks. Higgins, Pacio and a future? Wow Florida can go **** someone else over with that deal.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:53 PM
  #49
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Switch MaxPac with Lats and I'm in.

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Old
12-11-2008, 06:57 PM
  #50
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No way i do that.
Max Pac is too good of a prospect to give up and you dont to that in a cap world. Let them draft their own prospects or go screw another team.

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