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Move Chris Higgins??

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Old
12-19-2008, 05:47 PM
  #126
5 man unit
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Higgins plays a north american game, which is not something this team is very deep in. He is not one of the redundant offensive forwards that we we are so deepin. He can compete offensively and defensively. He can chip in on the power play and the PK. He can fill a top six role or a shutdown role. He is young and still improving.

All the 'trade higgins' and 'Higgins sucks' peoplle here are probably too young and hyper to realize exactly what he is.

Higgins is hurt...ahhhhhhhhhh
Higgins has had a poor offensive month...ahhhhhhhhhhh

The season is a marathon
A career is a marathon
So many people want results from everyone now. Face it. Not everyone on the team will perform at their best all the time. Some will start slow, some will finish slow. Some will start fast and some will finish fast. Some will take longer to develop than others. Being a GM is a game for patient men, and Gainey is nothing if not patient.

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12-19-2008, 05:49 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
I don't know about poorest, he had a similar PPG in his playoff career to his season PPG. He stays the same. There's guys like Claude Lemieux who break out, but Higgins doesn't dissapear. What you see is what you get, he's no superstar but he does what his contract and previous performances suggest he would do. About 0.5PPG in the playoffs. Not a problem for a guy making 1.7 mil. If he were a superstar getting 5, then yes, major problem.
The issue is that he played with Kovalev and Koivu, who got respectively 11 points in 12 games and 9 points in 8 games. However, he was great defensively and was in no way responsible for our loss. He's been unlucky some times, but to say that Higgins is money in the playoffs isn't quite acurate.

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12-19-2008, 05:55 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by TimminsTheStorm View Post
The issue is that he played with Kovalev and Koivu, who got respectively 11 points in 12 games and 9 points in 8 games. However, he was great defensively and was in no way responsible for our loss. He's been unlucky some times, but to say that Higgins is money in the playoffs isn't quite acurate.
It's nonsense to suggest he's a playoff performer, I agree with that. He isn't gonna win you a cup, but a guy who can put the same point totals in the season and playoffs seems like a straight forward player that compliments star players. You know what you get with higgins and people fail to see them. He's never been under 20 goals in his entire pro career, AHL, NHL, rookie year, always at least 20, that's gotta be worth something. He provides secondary offense but as you suggested, he won't win you a playoff series, but there's no need for anyone to suggest he didn't do much in the playoffs. Including this beauty in the playoffs:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YerbuBzmeYQ

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Old
12-19-2008, 06:15 PM
  #129
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The only guy who could replace Chris Higgins:

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...TRUE&pid=93688

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12-19-2008, 07:07 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by 5 man unit View Post
Higgins plays a north american game, which is not something this team is very deep in. He is not one of the redundant offensive forwards that we we are so deepin. He can compete offensively and defensively. He can chip in on the power play and the PK. He can fill a top six role or a shutdown role. He is young and still improving.

All the 'trade higgins' and 'Higgins sucks' peoplle here are probably too young and hyper to realize exactly what he is.

Higgins is hurt...ahhhhhhhhhh
Higgins has had a poor offensive month...ahhhhhhhhhhh

The season is a marathon
A career is a marathon
So many people want results from everyone now. Face it. Not everyone on the team will perform at their best all the time. Some will start slow, some will finish slow. Some will start fast and some will finish fast. Some will take longer to develop than others. Being a GM is a game for patient men, and Gainey is nothing if not patient.
I agree 100%, but I have the nagging feeling that if the volume of roster players becomes an issue, and it easily could, and if an asset has to nbe moved, he might fit the bill, partly because he does have value. They can't make much of a prospect/picks deal as there are just too many bodies.

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12-19-2008, 08:33 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by mcphee View Post
I agree 100%, but I have the nagging feeling that if the volume of roster players becomes an issue, and it easily could, and if an asset has to nbe moved, he might fit the bill, partly because he does have value. They can't make much of a prospect/picks deal as there are just too many bodies.
I think they might move a player that is more redundant. I know Higgins probably has the most value, but I think he has the most value to us as well.

I'm not in Gainey's head, but I really hope he agrees with me.

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12-19-2008, 09:28 PM
  #132
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I'd love to know why the people who put down Higgins think he'll get us any value compared to what they say about him in a trade. I mean, why aren't you asking the Habs to put him on waivers? Or are all NHL GM's just so stupid they believe the same "lie" that everyone except you and your motley crew believe, so you feel you could swindle them?

Seriously.

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Old
12-19-2008, 10:00 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Lone Rogue View Post
I'd love to know why the people who put down Higgins think he'll get us any value compared to what they say about him in a trade. I mean, why aren't you asking the Habs to put him on waivers? Or are all NHL GM's just so stupid they believe the same "lie" that everyone except you and your motley crew believe, so you feel you could swindle them?

Seriously.
Nobody's bringing Higgins down. At least, I don't.

I'm just saying that he has a decent trade value, and while he's a good player, he's in my opinion expendable for the Habs as we need a d-man more than a winger right now, and because D'Agostini, if he keeps it up, could replace him more than adequately, at least offensively.

It's not a matter that he's garbage. It's a matter that he's our best trading-chip at the moment, all factors being considered.

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12-20-2008, 10:03 AM
  #134
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Originally Posted by 5 man unit View Post
I think they might move a player that is more redundant. I know Higgins probably has the most value, but I think he has the most value to us as well.

I'm not in Gainey's head, but I really hope he agrees with me.
I love the thought of having Higgins Koivu and D'agostini lining up against good offensive opposition, I think they could play a solid defensive game and burn them with outside speed. I have the nagging feeling that I won't get my wish, but we'll see. They need a better mix of north south guys on the team, and after the time investment in some of these guys, I hate to see them leave.

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12-20-2008, 11:24 AM
  #135
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Originally Posted by 5 man unit View Post
Higgins plays a north american game, which is not something this team is very deep in. He is not one of the redundant offensive forwards that we we are so deepin. He can compete offensively and defensively. He can chip in on the power play and the PK. He can fill a top six role or a shutdown role. He is young and still improving.

All the 'trade higgins' and 'Higgins sucks' peoplle here are probably too young and hyper to realize exactly what he is.

Higgins is hurt...ahhhhhhhhhh
Higgins has had a poor offensive month...ahhhhhhhhhhh

The season is a marathon
A career is a marathon
So many people want results from everyone now. Face it. Not everyone on the team will perform at their best all the time. Some will start slow, some will finish slow. Some will start fast and some will finish fast. Some will take longer to develop than others. Being a GM is a game for patient men, and Gainey is nothing if not patient.
For being a North-American type of player, at what point is this guy going to be a physical force of any kind. He has the size, but he's completely allergic to defending teammates or getting involved in that side of the game. Trade this guy in a package for a defenseman, it's needed and overall Higgins is just terribly replaceable.

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12-20-2008, 11:34 AM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Slapshot09 View Post
For being a North-American type of player, at what point is this guy going to be a physical force of any kind. He has the size, but he's completely allergic to defending teammates or getting involved in that side of the game. Trade this guy in a package for a defenseman, it's needed and overall Higgins is just terribly replaceable.
He doesn't brawl but he's always bumping in the corners. He plays an effective 2way game, can score goals, and can be slotted anywhere on lines 1-3, + PK duty. Good teams need guys like this as their wingers.

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12-20-2008, 11:45 AM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Turboflex View Post
He doesn't brawl but he's always bumping in the corners. He plays an effective 2way game, can score goals, and can be slotted anywhere on lines 1-3, + PK duty. Good teams need guys like this as their wingers.
"Bumping" in the corners isn't enough. He isn't mean, he isn't nasty, and considering his shortcomings he needs to be. We also need a guy not named Brisebois on our top-6 if we plan on making any noise in the playoffs, and Higgins is the expendable bargaining chip we need to use to make that happen.

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12-20-2008, 11:47 AM
  #138
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Originally Posted by mcphee View Post
I love the thought of having Higgins Koivu and D'agostini lining up against good offensive opposition, I think they could play a solid defensive game and burn them with outside speed. I have the nagging feeling that I won't get my wish, but we'll see. They need a better mix of north south guys on the team, and after the time investment in some of these guys, I hate to see them leave.
I completely agree with you. North-south...north american, were saying the same thing.

Is it all the rumours that you give you this nagging feeling? I know it's not Erika k.

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12-20-2008, 12:08 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by 5 man unit View Post
I completely agree with you. North-south...north american, were saying the same thing.

Is it all the rumours that you give you this nagging feeling? I know it's not Erika k.
I don't see them moving a Kostitsyn at this point, for a few reasons, Plekanec could go, but C is thin down thru the org., moving Lats won't get you much, and I can see Pacioretty doing Higgins job with a bit more sandpaper.

I don't have any problem with Higgins not getting involved in after the whistle crap, but the team does need a bit more edge. Tanguay isn't going anywhere, so couple all that with giving a touch of creedence to some of the rumours, it makes some sense. I have no problem with a player as long as he heads into all areas of the ice, and Higgins does that. That's my gripe with the younger Kostitsyn, he's hesitant to head into traffic. Shoving after the whistle is nice, but I'd rather a guy head into the area where goals are scored.

In the end, Higgins will get you something. If a serviceable C comes back, then Plekanec will get you something. To me, it's one or the other.

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12-20-2008, 12:12 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by BigTimer* View Post
"Bumping" in the corners isn't enough. He isn't mean, he isn't nasty, and considering his shortcomings he needs to be. We also need a guy not named Brisebois on our top-6 if we plan on making any noise in the playoffs, and Higgins is the expendable bargaining chip we need to use to make that happen.
So you'd rather keep ultra soft euro guys like Plekanic or less effective offensive players like S.Kostytsin?

I agree on the Defence depth problem, but someone can be acquired without dumping a good, young forward.

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12-20-2008, 12:25 PM
  #141
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I'll just post satistics from last season:

Top shot blocking forward: 65(1st!), next player has 39.
Giveaways: 18,(ranked 18th on the team)
Takeaways: 50,(3rd on the team)
Shots: 241,(1st on the team)
Goals: 27,(3rd on the team)
PPG goals: 12(tied in second)
ES goals: 15(tied in second)
GWG: 5(tied in second)
PIM: 22(20th on the team) Players after? Smolinski(64 GP), Chipchura(36 GP), Grabovski(24 GP), Stewart, D'ags, Locke(1 GP each) He basically took the less PIM per any full time player.
Asisists: 25 (7th on team)
Points: 52 (7th on team)
PP points: 25 (ranked 5th, 3rd out of forwards)
PP effectiveness: Every 7.488 min on PP makes one point. Plek=7.8, Koivu=7.3333. He's not the best, I didn't do kovy's and streit's average, but it goes to show he clicks just as well as others on the PP.

Do you really think anyone can replace him as if this very moment? His defensive game is top on the team(positioning wise). Look at the ratio of takeaways and giveaways! He leads forwards in blocked shots! What is he doing on the pp? 3rd most points out of forwards on the PP. What about ES? No problem! Any situation, any time of the game, Higgins can play. Realize that as much value as he may have to other teams, there's a reason, he has value to us too...more than people give him credit for.

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Old
12-20-2008, 02:32 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by BigTimer* View Post
"Bumping" in the corners isn't enough. He isn't mean, he isn't nasty, and considering his shortcomings he needs to be. We also need a guy not named Brisebois on our top-6 if we plan on making any noise in the playoffs, and Higgins is the expendable bargaining chip we need to use to make that happen.
No, Higgins isn't mean and nasty; he also isn't 6'3" and 240 lbs. Christopher Higgins is a very nice two-way player who has happened to have a bad year in terms of injuries. He is the type of player that every team needs to win the Cup and having more players like him on the team is a good thing.

Seriously, I am happy that a lot of people on this board have never been GM of the Canadiens. If they were, Patrick Roy would have been traded before 1993, Alex Kovalev would have had a great season for some other team last year after being released on waivers, and Gilbert Dionne would have been signed to a long-term, big money contract after the 1992-93 season. The Canadiens would also average about three head coaches per season. Of course, these potential GMs would be shocked when they tried discussing trades to find out that other GMs were not willing to give great value for "expendable" players.

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12-20-2008, 03:35 PM
  #143
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Would someone explain to me why the less important of the two Kostitsyns is better than Higgins? Is he a better goal scorer? No. Does he get more involved against the boards or in front of the net? No. Is he better defensively? No. Is he smarter in avoiding penalties? No.

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12-20-2008, 03:56 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
Would someone explain to me why the less important of the two Kostitsyns is better than Higgins? Is he a better goal scorer? No. Does he get more involved against the boards or in front of the net? No. Is he better defensively? No. Is he smarter in avoiding penalties? No.
He has more potential, he's underrated defensively i think. Either way, if you trade sergei, be prepared to trade his brother too. They aren't crybabys or anything, but brothers on the same team who arent exactly 100% comfortable with the NA culture being seperated won't give either extra confidence. I'd keep both. At this point it's almost like trading the Sedins, it's just dumb to do it. It's hard to trade anyone on our team really. I'd rather trade UFAs than RFAs though.

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12-20-2008, 03:57 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
Would someone explain to me why the less important of the two Kostitsyns is better than Higgins? Is he a better goal scorer? No. Does he get more involved against the boards or in front of the net? No. Is he better defensively? No. Is he smarter in avoiding penalties? No.
He is just so feisty though!

I still wonder why people still think Andrei Kostitsyn scored 28 goals last season, when he only scored 26, one less than that streaky lazy useless third liner Chris Higgins.

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Old
12-20-2008, 09:54 PM
  #146
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Montreal could do without Higgins.
D'Agostini has 2 points less than higgins and has played 11 games less with less ice time.

Ship Higgins in a package for PP d-men or physical a shut down d-men or a Kubina!!!

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12-20-2008, 10:13 PM
  #147
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I'd much rather have Higgins on my team than SKost, the problem is if Mtl wants a top 4 Dman Higgy is the bait. Pleks, SKost & Lats are no where near as valuable ... it's either Higgins and/or prospects and picks, or a combo of the above.

Higgins is a complete hockey player, the type a team needs to win the cup.

I personally would rather package Pleks, a prospect & pick for a top Dman.

- - - - - - - - - - - -

People thinking Higgins should be a 30+ goal scorer (let alone a 40 goal player) are asking too much, he doesn't have the natural hands to put up those numbers. But that doesn't mean he's not a valuable player.


Last edited by HabsPack: 12-20-2008 at 10:24 PM.
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12-20-2008, 10:22 PM
  #148
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I'd much rather have Higgins on my team than SKost, the problem is if Mtl wants a top 4 Dman Higgy is the bait. Pleks, SKost & Lats are no where near as valuable ... it's either Higgins and/or prospects and picks, or a combo of the above.

Higgins is a complete hockey player, the type a team needs to win the cup.
I personally would rather package Pleks, a prospect & pick for a top Dman.

LOL and LOL

Seriously, it's laughable how "Mr. Stone Hands" Higgins is overrated on this board. People just keep believing he's something that he is not in real life. Keep dreaming people. It's Christmas time, you're wish might come true...

Sergei Kostitsyn >>>> Christopher Higgins and it's not even close !!


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12-20-2008, 10:32 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by Erika Kostitsyn View Post
LOL and LOL

Seriously, it's laughable how "Mr. Stone Hands" Higgins is overrated on this board. People just keep believing he's something that he is not in real life. Keep dreaming people. It's Christmas time, you're wish might come true...

I added something before I saw your post ...

Higgins will never be a sniper, but he's a hard working hockey player in the mold that the Habs have a lack of. If I were coach wanting to win a game, I'd rather have Higgins on the ice than SKost ... but that's just my opinion. I have a feeling Higgy will be moved as he's the most wanted by other teams.


Last edited by Habs10Habs: 12-21-2008 at 12:23 AM.
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12-21-2008, 08:22 AM
  #150
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Originally Posted by Erika Kostitsyn View Post
LOL and LOL

Seriously, it's laughable how "Mr. Stone Hands" Higgins is overrated on this board. People just keep believing he's something that he is not in real life. Keep dreaming people. It's Christmas time, you're wish might come true...

Sergei Kostitsyn >>>> Christopher Higgins and it's not even close !!

again, rather than discuss what each brings to the table, and what each would command in a deal, you go with my guy's better than your guy. Are you insecure about talking hockey ? You shouldn't be, it's just a game that grownups, or semi grownups get paid lavishly to play, explain your point of view rather than the hit and run approach. What's the worst that could happen ?

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