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Old
01-01-2009, 09:01 PM
  #26
Grant Dovey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chaosof99 View Post
In the draft picks you list that we have two Tampa Bay fourth round picks. How can any team have two picks assigned to it in the same round?
You also list Randy Jones for 186 days, but he was riding the LTIR until recently. Shouldn't his Days be a lot smaller?
The draft picks are being worked on right now.

As for Jones, I think that he still counts as playing 186 days. Phlocky or MountainHawk can maybe clear that up.

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01-02-2009, 08:26 AM
  #27
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So how many picks do we have?

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01-02-2009, 08:47 AM
  #28
Chuck Downie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
So how many picks do we have?
This (http://www.prosportstransactions.com...ades/2009.htms) says -

1rst
3rd, 3rd
5th
6th, 6th
7th, 7th

edit: one of those 3rds could be a 4th if we resign Alberts.


Last edited by Chuck Downie: 01-02-2009 at 08:53 AM.
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01-02-2009, 04:56 PM
  #29
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Nice chart.

Here's another one to take into consideration if you want the whole NHL.
http://proicehockey.about.com/gi/dyn...rs%2Findex.asp

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01-05-2009, 11:08 AM
  #30
Grant Dovey
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phlocky, are you sure it is calculated on a day-to-day basis. I heard somewhere else that it is not.

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01-05-2009, 11:25 AM
  #31
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Yes I'm certain. You subtact out how much you spent that day, add back in any LTIR medical allotment and that is how much money you have remaining to spend for the remainder of the year. Then you divide the amount of money you have remaining (your unspent cap number) and divide by the number of days remaining. Multiply this number by the total number of days in the calander year and this gives you the MAXIMUM salary of your current active roster (this doesn not include any players on LTIR because you are eligible to recieve LTIR medical reimbursment for those players). If ay any time your active roster exceeds this number then you are not in cap compliance and any transaction that would make you non-cap compliant would not be honored. Thus, even if Briere is capable to returning right now the Flyers CAN'T activate him because we would not be cap compliant. We must be able to be cap compliant BEFORE he is activated.

I can't tell you what Homer is thinking of doing or what moves he'll make (if I could I'd have my own psyic TV show) but I can tell you that Briere cannot and WILL NOT be activated until we have made some other moves.

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01-05-2009, 11:50 AM
  #32
Grant Dovey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phlocky View Post
Yes I'm certain. You subtact out how much you spent that day, add back in any LTIR medical allotment and that is how much money you have remaining to spend for the remainder of the year. Then you divide the amount of money you have remaining (your unspent cap number) and divide by the number of days remaining. Multiply this number by the total number of days in the calander year and this gives you the MAXIMUM salary of your current active roster (this doesn not include any players on LTIR because you are eligible to recieve LTIR medical reimbursment for those players). If ay any time your active roster exceeds this number then you are not in cap compliance and any transaction that would make you non-cap compliant would not be honored. Thus, even if Briere is capable to returning right now the Flyers CAN'T activate him because we would not be cap compliant. We must be able to be cap compliant BEFORE he is activated.

I can't tell you what Homer is thinking of doing or what moves he'll make (if I could I'd have my own psyic TV show) but I can tell you that Briere cannot and WILL NOT be activated until we have made some other moves.
So for an example, this is how we look today:

Richards - $30,914
Gagne - $28,226
Carter - $26,882
Hartnell - $22,581
Knuble - $15,054
Lupul - $12,428
Upshall - $6,586
Metropolit - $5,376
Kalinski - $4,704
Giroux - $4,418
Cote - $2,957
Gratton - $2,957
Powe - $2,796

Timonen - $34,050
Carle - $18,481
Jones - $14,785
Coburn - $6,989
Alberts - $6,720
Vaananen - $5,376
Kukkonen - $4,704
Sbisa - $4,704

Biron - $18,817
Niittymaki - $6,586

Add that up and you equal $287,091. That leaves $17,748 to work with today and then add in the LTIR of Asham, Briere, Hatcher and Rathje and that totals $76,021.

Subtract the $17,748 from $76,021 and that gives $58,273 of extra money for today, correct?

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01-05-2009, 12:27 PM
  #33
phlocky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goflyguys View Post
So for an example, this is how we look today:

Richards - $30,914
Gagne - $28,226
Carter - $26,882
Hartnell - $22,581
Knuble - $15,054
Lupul - $12,428
Upshall - $6,586
Metropolit - $5,376
Kalinski - $4,704
Giroux - $4,418
Cote - $2,957
Gratton - $2,957
Powe - $2,796

Timonen - $34,050
Carle - $18,481
Jones - $14,785
Coburn - $6,989
Alberts - $6,720
Vaananen - $5,376
Kukkonen - $4,704
Sbisa - $4,704

Biron - $18,817
Niittymaki - $6,586

Add that up and you equal $287,091. That leaves $17,748 to work with today and then add in the LTIR of Asham, Briere, Hatcher and Rathje and that totals $76,021.

Subtract the $17,748 from $76,021 and that gives $58,273 of extra money for today, correct?
Basically. Our total cost for today is $363,112 however we gain #58,273 in medical allotment. The way it is actually computed at the league offices is that we spent $363,112 today and that comes off what we have remaining in our cap space. However, we get that $58,273 into our medical reimbursment limit and the sum of what's remaining in our unspent cap plus our medical allotment is what we have left to spend for each year. I believe that at our current rate we will have spent our entire 56.7 mil in cap money sometime in late February. We will then be down to spending what we have in medical allotment.

It looks like you have a basic understanding of what's going on but to try and explain it over a message board is almost impossible. Unless you just really really get mathamatics I doubt it can be explained here. There are so many varialbles and potential situations that would have to be accounted for that a simple spread sheet is not sufficient. I know how I'd do it but it would be very long and involved. It is 100 times easier to simply do it by hand on a daily basis at this point for the Flyers. I could write one for the league that could be used for any and every team (and note, it would also have to be able to compute for spending at least the league minimum in additon to the league maximum). I have spent hundreds of hours writing spread sheets for use in engineering but they have saved tens of thousands of hours of computations in return.


Understanding all the little quirks of calculating the Flyers cap situation is no small feet. I applaud your attempt but it is so complex that unless you have been keeping track every day individually to this point, you will be spending way more time just trying to get caught up than it is really worth.

Again, the most important thing to understand is that with all the LTIR we have we will spend the absolute maximum every single day of the year this year (again, barring us trading Rathje and Hatcher). We can never have an active roster whose total cap number will exceed 56.7 mil this year no matter how much we may be under this on a daily basis for an active roster.

Also, again barring the trade of Rathje, you can probably count on the Flyers hitting the maximum possible spent every day next year too. Unless we have an active roster salary more than 3.5 mil under the cap maximum we will not accrue and "cap cusion" next season either. Thus, even next season we won't be able to add anyone at the trade deadline who would make us exceed the 56.7 mil limit (or whatever it will be for next season). AFTER next season we will actually be able to accrue some cap cusion at the beginning of the season unless we have anther player who starts the season on LTIR and with their cap number putting us over the cap limit. It's pretty messed up but unless you run a couple of mil under the limit AND remain healthy or at least under the cap limit while INCLUDING all your LTIR salary then you just won't accrue any cap cusion and have it mean much at the trade deadline.

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Old
01-05-2009, 12:34 PM
  #34
Grant Dovey
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Well I attached my spreadsheet, I have definitely caught up, just don't know if it is right haha.
Attached Files
File Type: xls flyerssal.xls‎ (83.5 KB, 4 views)

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Old
01-05-2009, 01:56 PM
  #35
Grant Dovey
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Well according to the NHL, your way is not correct.

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01-05-2009, 02:20 PM
  #36
Chuck Downie
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Download the CBA file from here:

http://www.nhlpa.com/CBA/2005CBA.asp

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01-05-2009, 02:25 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goflyguys View Post
Well according to the NHL, your way is not correct.
Salary cap figures are calculated day-to-day. This is why you see teams ship down two-way contracts between games at times, it saves them some cap. It's also how you figure out pro-rated contracts.

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Old
01-05-2009, 03:39 PM
  #38
Grant Dovey
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Chart is updated:
http://flyerscap.com/currentcap.htm

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01-08-2009, 12:31 PM
  #39
Grant Dovey
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I have some updated numbers, although I have not updated the chart yet to reflect this.

1. I had Raduns cap number at $550k, but fixed it to $555k. Just a little change.

2. Carle loses a day of his salary paid by Philadelphia because the trade occurred after 5 p.m. on whatever day it was, so Tampa has to pick up the extra day. We also had to pick up another day for Eminger because of this, but not Downie because he was on the Phantoms at the time of the trade.

3. The numbers are ALWAYS going to be a tiny bit off unfortunately because of unattainable bonuses. The players that this effects are Downie, Nodl and Kalinski.

4. I took Briere off the LTIR and put Kalinski on there retroactive to January 4th and it looks like the Flyers will need to dump $3,262,572 just to break even.

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01-08-2009, 01:11 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goflyguys View Post
4. I took Briere off the LTIR and put Kalinski on there retroactive to January 4th and it looks like the Flyers will need to dump $3,262,572 just to break even.
Nah, you're off. I just redid the calculations and the Flyers will need to dump $3,262,578.

In all seriousness, though...great work on that chart. It's very nicely done. I'm sure you're very close with what they need to rid themselves of with that $3.2 number.

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Old
01-12-2009, 06:43 PM
  #41
Grant Dovey
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Chart updated as of right now with the subtraction of Scott Munroe.

Added Gratton and Kalinski to LTIR.

http://www.flyerscap.com/currentcap.htm

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