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Renney Tinkering Again

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Old
01-05-2009, 12:20 PM
  #51
NYR Sting
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This team is a joke.

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Old
01-05-2009, 12:21 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
What's he supposed to do?

This guy is damed if he do or damned if he don't around here.
What?

It's JANUARY and he's still juggling the lines around.

At some point of the season, he's going to have to stop. It's getting ridiculous now.

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01-05-2009, 12:21 PM
  #53
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No balls. None.

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01-05-2009, 12:22 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by NYR6814 View Post
What?

It's JANUARY and he's still juggling the lines around.

At some point of the season, he's going to have to stop. It's getting ridiculous now.
Its January and the team is not playing well. What does the date have to do with anything?

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01-05-2009, 12:27 PM
  #55
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The Voros move is for extra grit against a division rival. I like what I've seen from Korpikoski so far, but if it comes down to deleting Korps, Prucha, or Dawes from the lineup right now, Korpikoski is going to be the one to sit tonight.

Also, I get a kick out of those who chastise Renney for holding back what could apparently be a dominant offense (HA!), and then chastise him AGAIN when he juggles the lines in an effort to generate more offense. Then again, I just have to remind myself how Ranger fans always need to scapegoat somebody, and how 70% of the posters here want to demote Renney after 3 straight playoff berths and being 10 games over .500 halfway through season #4.

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01-05-2009, 12:31 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by HockeyBasedNYC View Post
Unbelievable.

Now Korpikoski is out for Voros.

One of the only bright spots lately up front and he takes him out..

How about sitting Drury and putting Korpikoski at center? dont you think that would send a better message if "Itís a matter of getting Voros in and I had to move someone. Itís as simple as that.Ē"

How about Gomez???

http://rangers.lohudblogs.com/
Now this is the definition of insanity. Alot of people came down on me for saying it, but Renney plays favorites and then there are guys he is more comfortable sitting on a personal level. This isn't based on hockey, this isn't accountability. Voros should have been sat in November to get the message, not the last week of December. Kalinin should have taken a seat already. This is silliness.

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01-05-2009, 12:33 PM
  #57
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When you carry too many forwards this type of thing is going to happen, but to sit Korpikoski doesn't make much sense. He's a quick skater that is strong on the puck and should be in the lineup every game.

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01-05-2009, 12:37 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
The Voros move is for extra grit against a division rival. I like what I've seen from Korpikoski so far, but if it comes down to deleting Korps, Prucha, or Dawes from the lineup right now, Korpikoski is going to be the one to sit tonight.

Also, I get a kick out of those who chastise Renney for holding back what could apparently be a dominant offense (HA!), and then chastise him AGAIN when he juggles the lines in an effort to generate more offense. Then again, I just have to remind myself how Ranger fans always need to scapegoat somebody, and how 70% of the posters here want to demote Renney after 3 straight playoff berths and being 10 games over .500 halfway through season #4.
Voros has no grit, he has size but he doesn't use it. Dawes, Prucha and Korps have grit but lack the size. It shouldn't come down to 3 players when decisions about the lineup are made. It should come down to 23 roster players each and every night. You cannot be content in this league. If someone deserves to play, the scratch should go to the most deserving player. If no one deserves to sit, Voros has to bid his time.

Renney's one and only solution to problems is change the lines. It hasn't worked yet. At some point the solution has to come from a change in strategy. At some point you have to allow chemistry to develop between the lines.

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01-05-2009, 12:38 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Its January and the team is not playing well. What does the date have to do with anything?
Tom Renney should not still be juggling the lines around in January. Perhaps there is a correlation between Tom's line juggling and the team's poor play?

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Old
01-05-2009, 12:39 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by HockeyBasedNYC View Post
The common misconception of the hockey most of us Renney detractors want the Rangers to play is that its a "wide open style" or getting into a "track meet" as Renney likes to say.

Thats not the kind of hockey they should be employing. What you are saying is true, they dont have the big sniper, but what they do have are players who can play an uptempo forecheck game that generates chances by getting to the net. Its tough to get to the net when the 2nd and third forwards are always worried about being high in the zone and the defenseman have little or no screens in front or options down low.

You can play an umptempo game without sacrificing defense. We saw it early this season but Renneys balls shrunk back into his mangina. Listen, theres no question that certain players should be producing more, and with that others will follow, but I think part of the problem stems from their mindset of playing not to lose, which essentially boils down to a defensive 1-2-2 game trying to win 2-1. For a team full of midgets thats not the way to go out and play. They have the force the issue and have the opponent come to them, not the other way around.

They were talking about how Ovechkin wants to be the hunter and not the hunted. Same thing applies for a team. A mindset goes a long way, that has a lot to do with how a coach approaches the team.

For me, you have to attack the other team. Currently its a half-assed effort all around because of the shyness of their system. It might work with the bigger players and power forwards, but not this team. Would it really be any worse than how they are playing now? Uninspired, listless hockey?
I'm not going to disagree with most of this.

However, i still believe that most of the problems are because of player personnel.

Renney is not immune, here either. But he can only work with what he has. The veterans shouldn't need a coach to instill motivation into them. They should be able to recognize what is at stake and self motivate.

Gomez, Drury, Redden, Kalinin... they can't self motivate. Naslund has been scoring, but most of the time he floats around, too.


I strongly dislike the juggling of lines, too. And, i dislike how loyal he is to some players and punishes others, who typically don't deserve the punishment.


Who knows. If Renney gets fired, it better be for someone much better, otherwise it would be pointless.

And that still doesn't solve the player personnel issues. Or the crappy contracts. There still has to be some major salary dumps, as well.





And as i type this, it is out that Korpikoski is sitting for Voros... which is mind numbingly stupid. Unless Korpikoski is ill, or banged up a little, there is no sense in that decision.

And reading his rational makes it worse.

Why is Orr still in the lineup every night? What exactly does he provide, other then the chance that he will fight? And how does that help the team win? How does Orr either being in the penalty box or getting beat by better players help his team, again?

Korpikoski gets scratched for Voros, why didn't Orr get scratched for Voros.


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Old
01-05-2009, 12:43 PM
  #61
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How long is it going to take people to realize that it doesn't matter what the lines are with this team. This team does not have talent. This is a team without a single first line forward. This is a roster dominated by diminutive third line players. Horribly constructed team. It doesn't matter what the lines are.

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Old
01-05-2009, 12:45 PM
  #62
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Btw, Korpikoski is sitting out the month or just one game? I can't tell the difference because of some of these responses

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01-05-2009, 12:50 PM
  #63
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Bleed Ranger...

there always needs to be a scapegoat - as someone needs to be blamed if a team doesn't do well. And there's nothing wrong with that. If a team sucks, it's either the GM who put together the team or the coach who's coaching the team. You can blame the players, but of course it goes back to the GM who brought in those players, or the coach who couldn't get the players to play.

NYR6814...it doesn't matter at what point in the season you are, lines will continue to be juggled for some teams, even a team with a guy like Crosby and Malkin. I think we need to go back to the beginning of the season and recall that this team's top 6 (or even top 9) experienced a complete overhaul. Gone were Jagr, Avery Shanny and Straka - 2/3 of this team's top six. In came Zherdev and Naslund to replace them on the wing (oh yeah, Fritsche and Voros also were signed to replace them along with the maturation of Korps and the moving of Drury to the wing). It's inevitable that you'll reach January and would still be trying to find what works, and I don't blame Renney much for that. I can scratch my head about where he's played certain players, the roles, who he gives a long leash and who he doesn't, but that's a whole other story. But when it comes to this team's forwards, especially it's top six (of which there aren'y six), I can't say I'm surprised the lines are still being juggled to be optimized. There are only four legit top six forward on this team (Gomez, Drury, Naslund and Zherdev). Yet you want to roll four lines and get scoring from at least three of them, so finding the right combo is an issue. Some thoughts are you create a real top line and stick with it (and that can only be created by using Naslund-Gomez-Zherdev). Some thoughts (which is what Renney is most comforatable doing) is to spread it out (which I can see the logic, but it just dilutes some talents at the expense of lesser talents and doesn't always work). But the bottom line is the juggling is not a surprise. And hey, this team is still comfortably around the #6 spot - in the thick of things and each game they lose is a close one. This isn't Tampa, Florida or Atlanta, so things aren't as dire as we make them out to be in this forum.

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Old
01-05-2009, 12:53 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR6814 View Post
Tom Renney should not still be juggling the lines around in January. Perhaps there is a correlation between Tom's line juggling and the team's poor play?
So line juggling is based on the calendar and not what happens on the ice. Got it.

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01-05-2009, 12:56 PM
  #65
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Sonic...

I do wonder why Orr wouldn't sit for Voros. It wasn't like he gave Brashear a beat-down the other night nor did he deter anyone on Washington from holding back. Heck, it wasn't like he was even noticed. But to be honest, I still don't know why Korps isn't in HFD playing on a top line and finding the scoring touch he's never had the opportunity to hone over the last four seasons. He made strides last season, which was a break-out year for him, and he should still be there. His goal scoring totals over the last few years (Finland and AHL combined + playoffs) = 1, 6, 11, 25 and then this season. Some more time in the AHL won't kill him.

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01-05-2009, 12:58 PM
  #66
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correlation between juggling and poor play? I think the poor play preceded the juggling and the juggling was meant as a means to correct that. But I think reality is the offense has struggled all season long, except for the fast start. We didn't recognize this as poor play as much until Lundqvist was looking more and more human.

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01-05-2009, 01:03 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
correlation between juggling and poor play? I think the poor play preceded the juggling and the juggling was meant as a means to correct that. But I think reality is the offense has struggled all season long, except for the fast start. We didn't recognize this as poor play as much until Lundqvist was looking more and more human.
That's my point.

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Old
01-05-2009, 01:05 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
How long is it going to take people to realize that it doesn't matter what the lines are with this team. This team does not have talent. This is a team without a single first line forward. This is a roster dominated by diminutive third line players. Horribly constructed team. It doesn't matter what the lines are.
Bingo. So then why not keep the lines together, and hope that they develop decent chemistry? It's not like constantly juggling the lines around is going to all of a sudden turn the offense on. We lack bonafide goal-scoring talent -- which is why we don't score much. Fiddling with the lines is probably only making things worse.

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01-05-2009, 01:06 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by HockeyBasedNYC View Post
Unbelievable.

Now Korpikoski is out for Voros.

One of the only bright spots lately up front and he takes him out..

How about sitting Drury and putting Korpikoski at center? dont you think that would send a better message if "Itís a matter of getting Voros in and I had to move someone. Itís as simple as that.Ē"

How about Gomez???

http://rangers.lohudblogs.com/

Any idea what the lines are like now?

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01-05-2009, 01:12 PM
  #70
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Sting - you may be right - that there's nothing to be gained by juggling lines - but why not at least continue to try to see what, if anything, works while this team is still solidly in a playoff spot and before Sather decides to trade one of these kids for a rental? Why not try to make it work? Right now, the offense needs to get going because Lundqvist has been inconsistent - can't remain status quo and hope he's going to bail this team out.

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01-05-2009, 01:13 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by Garfinkel1 View Post
Any idea what the lines are like now?
Naslund - Gomez - Callahan
Voros - Dubi - Zherdev
Dawes - Drury - Prucha
Sjo - Betts - Orr

At least thats what it seems to be.

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01-05-2009, 01:14 PM
  #72
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Hbnyc..

Korps is not a good centerman. Sticking him in for Drury is not an option. In fact, we shouldn't even talk about the notion of Drury getting benched - it's not going to happen. Wouldn't mind seeing a couple minutes less per game, only to keep him fresh because I don't think he can handle 20+ minutes per night, much like last season, but a benching, I think, is out of the question.

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01-05-2009, 01:14 PM
  #73
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chemistry is hard to find when the lines change constantly.

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01-05-2009, 01:17 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
How long is it going to take people to realize that it doesn't matter what the lines are with this team. This team does not have talent. This is a team without a single first line forward. This is a roster dominated by diminutive third line players. Horribly constructed team. It doesn't matter what the lines are.
It might not matter what the lines are, but it matters when you are constantly changing them and putting players out of the positions they can or have succeeded in.

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01-05-2009, 01:19 PM
  #75
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Korps is not a good centerman. Sticking him in for Drury is not an option. In fact, we shouldn't even talk about the notion of Drury getting benched - it's not going to happen. Wouldn't mind seeing a couple minutes less per game, only to keep him fresh because I don't think he can handle 20+ minutes per night, much like last season, but a benching, I think, is out of the question.
Of course its out of the question, because the leaders of this team will never be held accountable.

Im merely suggesting that Renney should practice what he preaches, and it wouldnt hurt to make an example out of a big name once in a while if he had some balls to do it.

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