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Old
01-13-2009, 08:55 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Alberta Yote View Post
So Lisin's 11 goals in 56 sporadic NHL games show nothing while Goligoski's 42 game NHL career does?
There's a reason that lots of us Pens fans would really like Lisin, and of course he has shown something. Mostly untapped potential and blistering speed.
But Goligoski was an AHL all-star and led all defenders in scoring during the playoffs last year (and in the top in playoff scoring overall too) in his first senior season, and in his first NHL season on a dysfunctional team he has more points than any other Pens' defender and more than Lisin has in more games covering a span of three seasons. Three seasons where he didn't really make himself a regular in any of them so far (for a variety of reasons I'm sure).

I think its hard to argue that Goligoski is not the more sure thing right now, even if I would agree with you that Lisin's ceiling could well be higher.

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01-13-2009, 09:19 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by There's only one 66 View Post
There's a reason that lots of us Pens fans would really like Lisin, and of course he has shown something. Mostly untapped potential and blistering speed.
But Goligoski was an AHL all-star and led all defenders in scoring during the playoffs last year (and in the top in playoff scoring overall too) in his first senior season, and in his first NHL season on a dysfunctional team he has more points than any other Pens' defender and more than Lisin has in more games covering a span of three seasons. Three seasons where he didn't really make himself a regular in any of them so far (for a variety of reasons I'm sure).

I think its hard to argue that Goligoski is not the more sure thing right now, even if I would agree with you that Lisin's ceiling could well be higher.
Very well put and exactly my point

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01-13-2009, 09:34 AM
  #53
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I'm in agreement that Goligoski is showing that he has the potential to be a very good offensive d-man, it's just that Lisin's games played and stats don't refelct what he is quickly becoming.

Gretzky, for whatever reason, has been more often than not finding reasons to keep Lisin out of the lineup than put him in even after games and stretches where he has appeared to be one of the better Coyotes. He is still learning the defensive part of the game but improving all the time and finding ways to use his speed on the backcheckl. When given the chance he has scored some goals while getting very few top line minutes and only scattered PP time.

Coyotes' fans are seeing the development and that he has had many games where he has been the most exciting young Coyote player on the ice. That is saying something with guys like Boedker, Mueller, Turris, Hanzal, etc. out there with him.

I think you'll find most Coyotes' fans would be quite reluctant to give up on him right now as his untapped potential is just starting to come out more regularly and nobody can ague that the speed and skill is there. The same reluctance is evident with Pens' fans and Goligoski and can be said about most fans with their team's prospects.

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01-13-2009, 09:43 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Alberta Yote View Post
Gretzky, for whatever reason, has been more often than not finding reasons to keep Lisin out of the lineup than put him in even after games and stretches where he has appeared to be one of the better Coyotes.
This - combined with RFA status - is obviously one of the reasons some of us believe/hope he could be had for less than what his raw potential might warrant. Gretzky is both coach and part-owner, and if he isn't sure on him...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alberta Yote View Post
I think you'll find most Coyotes' fans would be quite reluctant to give up on him right now as his untapped potential is just starting to come out more regularly and nobody can ague that the speed and skill is there. The same reluctance is evident with Pens' fans and Goligoski and can be said about most fans with their team's prospects.
And this I find very agreeable/understandable .

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01-13-2009, 12:01 PM
  #55
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wouldnt happen

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Old
01-13-2009, 02:40 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by indczn View Post
And gologovski does not fill a need for the coyotes.
His four power play goals beg to differ.

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01-13-2009, 02:43 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Avoid Lloyd View Post
Exactly he is Konstantin Koltsov right now.
That's where actually having seen the player, rather than going off of stats and second hand scouting reports, comes in handy.

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01-13-2009, 03:38 PM
  #58
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His four power play goals beg to differ.
I'm sure malkin could bounce in a few goals off me too. I suspect his 4 whole PP goals might just have something to do with who happens to be on the PP with him.

As for our PP, i dont think goligoski is going to somehow teach the yotes how to pass.

Says more about Jovo not doing his job than anything. We have other options before trading someone like lisin, it's just up to the coaching staff to let it happen.

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01-13-2009, 03:53 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by indczn View Post
I'm sure malkin could bounce in a few goals off me too. I suspect his 4 whole PP goals might just have something to do with who happens to be on the PP with him.

As for our PP, i dont think goligoski is going to somehow teach the yotes how to pass.

Says more about Jovo not doing his job than anything. We have other options before trading someone like lisin, it's just up to the coaching staff to let it happen.
Ya Malkin defiantly bounces pucks off the other point man and into the net. If you're gonna make that argument you should probably pick a guy who plays in from of the net.

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01-13-2009, 03:56 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by ASV 27 View Post
Ya Malkin defiantly bounces pucks off the other point man and into the net. If you're gonna make that argument you should probably pick a guy who plays in from of the net.
While he should probably have picked a more sensible way to illustrate his point it is still valid. The problems with the Coyotes' PP go much deeper than what thowing a rookie d-man, even one with good PP instincts, would solve.

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01-13-2009, 05:51 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Alberta Yote View Post
While he should probably have picked a more sensible way to illustrate his point it is still valid. The problems with the Coyotes' PP go much deeper than what thowing a rookie d-man, even one with good PP instincts, would solve.
I never called him the solution to all of our power play problems. However, I do believe he'd be a solid addition, and possibly a nice improvement. New blood couldn't hurt. He was great in Minny, and based purely on his stats, pretty damn good in Pittsburgh.

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Old
01-13-2009, 05:54 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by ASV 27 View Post
Ya Malkin defiantly bounces pucks off the other point man and into the net. If you're gonna make that argument you should probably pick a guy who plays in from of the net.
Not only that, but it's not as though the Pens have had some powerhouse PP, this season. They are currently ranked 20th league-wide in PP%. Certainly better than Phoenix's 28th, but not exactly cooking along at 20-25%, or anything.

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