HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Buffalo Sabres
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Purple Eagles moving to Atlantic Hockey Conference in 2010

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-30-2009, 02:31 AM
  #1
Buffaloed
Administrator
Webmaster
 
Buffaloed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Buffalo, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 24,967
vCash: 2635
Purple Eagles moving to Atlantic Hockey Conference in 2010

http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/story/563896.html
They plan to be in the CHA for one more year but I can see that changing if the automatic NCAA Tournament berth is dropped for the conference champion. It's very good news that Niagara has this lined up and will continue to be able to grow a successful program.

Quote:
The Purple Eagles will join Robert Morris in the expansion of Atlantic Hockey, bringing the league to 12 official members. Niagara joins cross-town rival Canisius, local opponent RIT, as well as former CHA member Air Force, Army, Holy Cross and Sacred Heart.

Buffaloed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 06:41 AM
  #2
jflory81
Garbo is coming
 
jflory81's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 21,504
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to jflory81
This can only be a good thing Niagara is another strong hockey program joining a conference that has steadily made up ground against some of the "power conferences"

What's interesting is the expected conference regions that haven't been formally announced...RIT, Niagara, Canisus, Mercyhurst, Air Force, and Robert Morris are all expected to be in the same 6 team region (where you'll play each opponent 3 times as opposed to 2) - and Mercyhurst, RIT, and Air Force are probably the best 3 teams now that are in the conference currently, and neither are hurting for current frosh and sophomore contributors.

That is going to be one tough region....

http://insidecollegehockey.com/inch/...ry/atl-hockey/ is where I got the region info from.

jflory81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 02:13 PM
  #3
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
While they will get conference stability from this move its a step back for them hockey wise.


Niagara has avoided Atlantic Hockey for years because of its scholarship limitations. It only allows for 11 (its going to 12 for next season) as opposed to the NCAA allowed limit of 18. Niagara will be giving up scholarships to join.

http://www.niagara-gazette.com/sport...029000258.html

Quote:
Niagara will join Robert Morris in making the jump, and both will be forced to take a hit in terms of scholarships. The NCAA allows Division I programs to have 18 full scholarships, but Atlantic Hockey has allowed just 11. The league will add another scholarship per team next season.
Quote:
And as for dropping scholarships, McLaughlin said he’ll look at alternatives in the near future.

“We can’t just not recruit,” he said.


They have tried in vain for years to get into one of the major conferences. None would have them. I think had Canisius committed to join one with them they may have had a better chance. But Canisius hasn't shown an interest to date in investing like that (18 scholarships). So Niagara along with some other schools got together to form the ad hoc conference known currently as College Hockey America or CHA. That was done so they could have a full allotment of scholarships. Every year that conference has had to scramble to keep enough members.

I guess Niagara just got tired of the uncertainty. Who could blame them.


Last edited by joshjull: 01-30-2009 at 03:50 PM.
joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 02:45 PM
  #4
eSabre
Registered User
 
eSabre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Nashville, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 6,477
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to eSabre
If they join AH, the program is basically dead.

eSabre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 05:24 PM
  #5
jflory81
Garbo is coming
 
jflory81's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 21,504
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to jflory81
Quote:
Originally Posted by eSabre View Post
If they join AH, the program is basically dead.
Oh please. Overdramatic much?

jflory81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 05:25 PM
  #6
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by eSabre View Post
If they join AH, the program is basically dead.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
Oh please. Overdramatic much?
In their sorrow they shall lash themselves and rend their garments.


Last edited by joshjull: 01-30-2009 at 06:29 PM.
joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 05:49 PM
  #7
Montag DP
Sabres fan in...
 
Montag DP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: ...Atlanta
Country: United States
Posts: 7,243
vCash: 50
Sweet, should be a good rivalry with RIT.

Montag DP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 07:26 PM
  #8
krt88
Registered User
 
krt88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Posts: 2,423
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to krt88
Good news! Are you clueless, they just dump 5 scholarships down the drain. AH will drive this program down. Now instead of 17 scholarships, they will only be allowed 12! They are going to lose out on many good players and their chances of competing with the top teams will be deminshed.

The news is horrible...stabily means crap when you have to play by those whimpy rules. They needed to find a way to foce themselves into the ECAC.

Don't give me they couldn't get in, expansion in the big conferences is coming because new school have joined in. Cansius and Niagara needed to join forces and try to get into the ECAC together. Now Niagara's only hope is convince the league to change the scholarship rules.

krt88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 07:45 PM
  #9
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by krt88 View Post
Good news! Are you clueless, they just dump 5 scholarships down the drain. AH will drive this program down. Now instead of 17 scholarships, they will only be allowed 12! They are going to lose out on many good players and their chances of competing with the top teams will be deminshed.

The news is horrible...stabily means crap when you have to play by those whimpy rules. They needed to find a way to foce themselves into the ECAC.

Don't give me they couldn't get in, expansion in the big conferences is coming because new school have joined in. Cansius and Niagara needed to join forces and try to get into the ECAC together. Now Niagara's only hope is convince the league to change the scholarship rules.

Don't give you they couldn't get in? They have already tried to gain entry into the ECAC, Hockey East and the CCHA and have been turned down by all of them.

I don't remember if they tried the WCHA which has recently lifted its moratorium on expanson.

Its fellow CHA member Bemidji State has already said it will apply for membership in the WCHA.http://www.uscho.com/news/college-ho...sInterest.html

But geographically Niagara wouldn't make sense in the WCHA.


Last edited by joshjull: 01-30-2009 at 07:56 PM.
joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 08:07 PM
  #10
jflory81
Garbo is coming
 
jflory81's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 21,504
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to jflory81
Quote:
Originally Posted by krt88 View Post
Good news! Are you clueless, they just dump 5 scholarships down the drain. AH will drive this program down. Now instead of 17 scholarships, they will only be allowed 12! They are going to lose out on many good players and their chances of competing with the top teams will be deminshed.

The news is horrible...stabily means crap when you have to play by those whimpy rules. They needed to find a way to foce themselves into the ECAC.

Don't give me they couldn't get in, expansion in the big conferences is coming because new school have joined in. Cansius and Niagara needed to join forces and try to get into the ECAC together. Now Niagara's only hope is convince the league to change the scholarship rules.
Someone certainly is clueless here....."force their way in to the ECAC?" Don't make me laugh. As JJ said, they've TRIED to get into the power conferences.

As for the scholarship thing, non-scholarship talent is undeniably out there. Simon Lambert and Matt Smith were both DIVISION 3 RECRUITS (ie no scholarships at all) - and all they did was be among the nation's best in points/game and goals/game respectively in Division 1 in their last season. If only 12 scholarships is such a huge deal, why is RIT among the deepest teams in the nation this season, which is their first with all D-1 recruits? Shouldn't they be top heavy?

It's not like Atlantic Hockey teams haven't knocked off teams from the power conferences. RIT beat both Minnesota and Cornell last year. Air Force beat then top 5 ranked ranked Colorado College. Army beat then #2 ranked University of Miami. Holy Cross tied (well, lost in a shootout because it was a tourney) Denver as well. Mercyhurst beat Princeton.

If you want to be an independant and have 0 shot at an NCAA berth every year, be my guest and stay out. Atlantic Hockey gives Niagara a chance to earn an automatic birth every single season they play.


Last edited by jflory81: 01-30-2009 at 09:00 PM.
jflory81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 08:16 PM
  #11
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
Looks like the ECAC didn't want them again and Atlantic Hockey changed their tune after the convention.

http://www.theithacajournal.com/arti...ORTS/901140314


Quote:
There seems to be a consensus across the college hockey world that for the good of the game, the four programs currently comprising College Hockey America need to be absorbed by the other five leagues.

It just seems that every league thinks another league should do it — ECAC Hockey included.

"We talked about (expansion) after Quinnipiac was added to replace Vermont (in 2005), and administrators as a whole just wanted the dust to settle a little bit," said Steve Hagwell, the ECAC Hockey commissioner. "We've had informal inquiries about programs, and teams in the CHA have been inquiring to leagues across the country. But from our league's standpoint, we're happy to be at 12 teams."
Quote:
Solutions may be hard to come by, especially if leagues aren't willing to budge on their current states. U.S. College Hockey Online has reported that Atlantic Hockey commissioner Bob DeGregorio said there is no imminent expansion for the league. College Hockey News has reported the CCHA has no interest in going beyond its current 12. Hockey East has its 10 and is geographically irrelevant to this topic. And while the WCHA seems set on its current 10 teams, that could all change this weekend and start toppling dominos.

The last time the ECAC rejected Niagara(2005) was due to teams concerned about traveling to Lewiston.

Quote:
....Niagara was passed over for Quinnipiac in 2005. Schafer said the biggest stumbling block for Niagara was that some of ECACH's eastern-most teams were concerned about traveling all the way to Lewiston, which is north of Buffalo.


The article is from January 14th right before the NCAA convention. Its a good read and gives some nice backround on the situation.

joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 08:19 PM
  #12
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
Someone certainly is clueless here....."force their way in to the ECAC?" Don't make me laugh. As JJ said, they've TRIED to get into the power conferences.

As for the scholarship thing, non-scholarship talent is undeniably out there. Simon Lambert and Matt Smith were both DIVISION 3 RECRUITS (ie no scholarships at all) - and all they did was be among the nation's best in points/game and goals/game respectively in Division 1 in their last season. If only 12 scholarships is such a huge deal, why is RIT among the deepest teams in the nation this season, which is their first with all D-1 recruits? Shouldn't they be top heavy?

It's not like Atlantic Hockey teams haven't knocked off teams from the power conferences. RIT beat both Minnesota and Cornell last year. Air Force beat then top 5 ranked ranked Denver. Army beat then #2 ranked University of Miami. Holy Cross tied (well, lost in a shootout because it was a tourney) Denver as well.

If you want to be an independant and have 0 shot at an NCAA berth every year, be my guest and stay out. Atlantic Hockey gives Niagara a chance to earn an automatic birth every single season they play.

Its just shame that Niagara was not given a chance by the ECAC becasue a few teams didn't want to travel to Lewiston.

Who knows, maybe they can lead a movement to up the scholarships in Atlantic Hockey. Its hardly the end of the world but its still got to be disappointing for their program.


Last edited by joshjull: 01-30-2009 at 08:25 PM.
joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 08:23 PM
  #13
jflory81
Garbo is coming
 
jflory81's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 21,504
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to jflory81
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Its just shame that Niagara was not given a chance by the ECAC becasue a few teams didn't want to travel to Lewiston.

Who knows, maybe they can lead a movement to up the scholarships in Atlantic Hockey. Its hardly the end of the world but its still got to be disappointing for their program.
I would love to see an increase in scholarships, and honestly, I think the inclusion of Niagara and Robert Morris can only help that cause.

I'm more just railing against assertions that teams "can't compete" and that the "program is dead" simply because the amount of scholarships that can be offered is going to be slashed by a third...

jflory81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 08:31 PM
  #14
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
I would love to see an increase in scholarships, and honestly, I think the inclusion of Niagara and Robert Morris can only help that cause.

I'm more just railing against assertions that teams "can't compete" and that the "program is dead" simply because the amount of scholarships that can be offered is going to be slashed by a third...

Yeah that was ridiculous. They will take a bit of a hit but will still be one the best in their new conference. Atlantic Hockey should have some great rivalries with the schools as close as they are

I'm still bummed that Canisius didn't complete their final stage of redeveloping the campus. When I was there they had the master plan in the bursars' office for all to see in the mid 90s. The last project listed was an ice rink. It would have been located where the front parking lot for the Kessler Center is (next to the athletic field) and would have been attached to the Kessler Center. I don't remember the seating capacity. But that would have been sweet, certainly better than having a DIII teams rink (Buff State) as your home rink.

This is a map, of the current campus. the Kessler center is on right, below the athletic fields

http://www.canisius.edu/admissions/P...us_Map2000.pdf


As a side note;

I'm curious to see what conference Alabama-Huntsville get into, if any.


Last edited by joshjull: 01-30-2009 at 08:53 PM.
joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 09:02 PM
  #15
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
This can only be a good thing Niagara is another strong hockey program joining a conference that has steadily made up ground against some of the "power conferences"

What's interesting is the expected conference regions that haven't been formally announced...RIT, Niagara, Canisus, Mercyhurst, Air Force, and Robert Morris are all expected to be in the same 6 team region (where you'll play each opponent 3 times as opposed to 2) - and Mercyhurst, RIT, and Air Force are probably the best 3 teams now that are in the conference currently, and neither are hurting for current frosh and sophomore contributors.

That is going to be one tough region....

http://insidecollegehockey.com/inch/...ry/atl-hockey/ is where I got the region info from.

Just reread the article you linked. That will certainly be some region as you said. Playing 3 games every year will really liven up the Niagara/Canisius rivalry. Hopefully my Griffs will be up to the challenges this schedule will present.

joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 09:13 PM
  #16
New Sabres Captain
ForFriendshipDikembe
 
New Sabres Captain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 40,155
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Yeah that was ridiculous. They will take a bit of a hit but will still be one the best in their new conference. Atlantic Hockey should have some great rivalries with the schools as close as they are

I'm still bummed that Canisius didn't complete their final stage of redeveloping the campus. When I was there they had the master plan in the bursars' office for all to see in the mid 90s. The last project listed was an ice rink. It would have been located where the front parking lot for the Kessler Center is (next to the athletic field) and would have been attached to the Kessler Center. I don't remember the seating capacity. But that would have been sweet, certainly better than having a DIII teams rink (Buff State) as your home rink.

This is a map, of the current campus. the Kessler center is on right, below the athletic fields

http://www.canisius.edu/admissions/P...us_Map2000.pdf


As a side note;

I'm curious to see what conference Alabama-Huntsville get into, if any.
I saw speculation (I believe at INCH, but I could be mistaken) that A-H would join CCHA, and Neb-Omaha would move to WCHA (along w/Bemidji St, which should get in since the WCHA unanimously agreed to lift the moratorium on expansion, presumably so that Bemidji St could join). Although Alaska-Fairbanks would seem a bit more logical choice to jump conferences, why they're in the CCHA instead of the WCHA is mind-boggling.

Niagara's program may take a bit of a hit, but they'll be on even footing with the other AHA teams so it's not like they're playing at a disadvantage in that regard. Having a shot at the tourney though would be huge exposure that could only help Niagara. Long-term, they're better off than becoming an independent, and if they're patient enough eventually either CCHA/ECAC will take them in (HE and WCHA just make very little sense geographically.

New Sabres Captain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 09:17 PM
  #17
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveDaSlug View Post
I saw speculation (I believe at INCH, but I could be mistaken) that A-H would join CCHA, and Neb-Omaha would move to WCHA (along w/Bemidji St, which should get in since the WCHA unanimously agreed to lift the moratorium on expansion, presumably so that Bemidji St could join). Although Alaska-Fairbanks would seem a bit more logical choice to jump conferences, why they're in the CCHA instead of the WCHA is mind-boggling.

Niagara's program may take a bit of a hit, but they'll be on even footing with the other AHA teams so it's not like they're playing at a disadvantage in that regard. Having a shot at the tourney though would be huge exposure that could only help Niagara. Long-term, they're better off than becoming an independent, and if they're patient enough eventually either CCHA/ECAC will take them in (HE and WCHA just make very little sense geographically.
At the end of the day thats what matters.

joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 10:03 PM
  #18
Buffaloed
Administrator
Webmaster
 
Buffaloed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Buffalo, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 24,967
vCash: 2635
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
I'm curious to see what conference Alabama-Huntsville get into, if any.
They're hoping to be accepted by the CCHA with the WCHA as Plan B. Incidentally, there's no way Niagara's getting into major conference unless they build a new arena. There's no sense in even wasting money on the application fee. A 2100 seat arena doesn't generate enough bucks these days to attract any interest. Most of them have minimum seating capacities for new members. They're a good fit where they are and the AHC will grow and improve.

http://www.al.com/uah/huntsvilletime...070.xml&coll=1

Buffaloed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2009, 10:18 PM
  #19
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffaloed View Post
They're hoping to be accepted by the CCHA with the WCHA as Plan B. Incidentally, there's no way Niagara's getting into major conference unless they build a new arena. There's no sense in even wasting money on the application fee. A 2100 seat arena doesn't generate enough bucks these days to attract any interest. Most of them have minimum seating capacities for new members. They're a good fit where they are and the AHC will grow and improve.

http://www.al.com/uah/huntsvilletime...070.xml&coll=1

Who'd a thunk it that a program could be successful in Alabama let alone started there.

I agree Niagara will definately be a good fit in their new conference. But they were aiming a bit higher when they started the program. I think the are accepting reality at this point.

EDIT: just out of curiousity I wanted to find out about the Alabama-Huntsville hockey program's history. This link is from their website if anyone is interested on how the program got going and got to where it is. http://www.uahchargers.com/index.php...=81&Itemid=152


Last edited by joshjull: 01-30-2009 at 10:26 PM.
joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-31-2009, 12:02 AM
  #20
Metssabres
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 74
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Its just shame that Niagara was not given a chance by the ECAC becasue a few teams didn't want to travel to Lewiston.

Who knows, maybe they can lead a movement to up the scholarships in Atlantic Hockey. Its hardly the end of the world but its still got to be disappointing for their program.
RIT would have gotten into the ECAC before Niagara, better academics.

Metssabres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-31-2009, 02:25 AM
  #21
eSabre
Registered User
 
eSabre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Nashville, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 6,477
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to eSabre
Quote:
Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
Oh please. Overdramatic much?
Any school expecting to put 8 walk-ons in their nightly lineup is not competing for a national championship.

eSabre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-31-2009, 02:29 AM
  #22
jflory81
Garbo is coming
 
jflory81's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 21,504
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to jflory81
Quote:
Originally Posted by eSabre View Post
Any school expecting to put 8 walk-ons in their nightly lineup is not competing for a national championship.
And Niagara is/was?

The AH champion has put a scare into the #1 or #2 OVERALL (not regional) seed each of the past 3 seasons. Holy Cross BEAT Minnesota in 2006. Which is more than you can say for Niagara who got smoked as the CHA champion (woo, 5 team conference) by Michigan last season.

There are at least 3 (and probably more like 6) schools in Atlantic Hockey who are better than the bottom half of the CHA. Frankly, it's a joke that that conference even HAS an automatic bid. It almost amounts to a freaking play in game to the NCAA tournament.

RIT's STRENGTH this year is depth. And a lot of that depth is from walk-ons. The talent, as I said, is out there.


Last edited by jflory81: 01-31-2009 at 02:36 AM.
jflory81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-31-2009, 11:58 AM
  #23
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 36,246
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metssabres View Post
RIT would have gotten into the ECAC before Niagara, better academics.
I didn't think RIT would even be part of the discussion in 2005. Only because they were just joining D1 at the time.

I thought the candidates back then were Holy Cross (good academic fit), Quinnipiac and Niagara


Last edited by joshjull: 01-31-2009 at 05:21 PM.
joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:19 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.