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Captain Koivu & Captain Kovalev...who's the the real leader?

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Old
02-01-2009, 02:56 AM
  #101
Fish on The Sand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkiness View Post
Keep a strong eye on him next game, you'll see what I'm talking about.

Koivu =/= 1st line material. Just keep that in mind.
1st line material has nothing to do with captaincy.

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02-01-2009, 03:51 AM
  #102
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They play differant game and i prefer Koivu's game personnaly, but Kovalev is way more inspirin than Koivu, so in the final i think both of them could make real good captain, that's why this conversation has been 5 pages.

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02-01-2009, 04:12 AM
  #103
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Kovalev can be inspiring, when things go well for him, sure. But would you rather have fair weather captain, or someone who puts it all in, in playoffs time or when his team is on losing streak?

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Old
02-01-2009, 04:37 AM
  #104
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you need to stop posting forever
Agreed.

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02-01-2009, 08:51 AM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Who's a leader?
Is it a guy that can't play with specific players?
Is it a guy who floats more often than not?
Is it a guy who tries to do it all himself?

No, and that's Kovalev.

Put anyone with Koivu and they are instantly better. Put anyone with Kovalev and they are instantly worse.
Well said sir.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lone Rogue View Post
Kovalev is a great player and a good leader.

Koivu is a good player and a great leader.

I'm happy to have both of them on this team, through the good times and the bad.
Well said too.

I'll put this to anyone really interested in a debate about the captaincy. How does the relocation of a small C shaped piece of vinyl material have any bearing on team results?

The short answer is "it doesn't". There could be any captain, or no captain, and the team would go about it's business, sorting out it's predicaments in and out of the dressing room and the same players would be on the PK, on the PP, and being asked to produce results when things are on the line and not. It's really only a topic for people who have run out of things to talk about.

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Old
02-01-2009, 08:55 AM
  #106
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I think Koivu is a great leader, so is Kovalev, Komisarek, Higgins.

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Old
02-01-2009, 09:13 AM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkiness View Post
When was the last time we remember Koivu turning the heat up and giving 110%?
I never have because the guy always gives everything he has and doesn't show up once every 5 games like Kovalev. I would much rather have 20 Koivu's on my team than 20 Kovalev's. Kovalev is a unique player because hes so highly skilled that he gets away with a lot of things 99% of the guys in the league couldn't get away with and thats why I hate him setting an example for our younger players. I'm beginning to wonder if Kovalev has influenced the way Sergei plays because his game is starting to remind me a lot of kovalevs.

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Old
02-01-2009, 04:44 PM
  #108
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Anyone still unclear about who the captain is?

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Old
02-01-2009, 04:47 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by dead View Post
Anyone still unclear about who the captain is?
Screw Kovalev, after one good year and all the love he got from Montreal fans, he doesn't even bother to show up for a game. I won't be disappointed if he doesn't come back next year.

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Old
02-01-2009, 04:58 PM
  #110
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The leader is the guy that leads by example, Screw Kovalev... he can do as many of his stupid dekes but he really is a heartless big floater

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Old
02-01-2009, 05:06 PM
  #111
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I am relieved to know Kovalev will not be back in a Habs uniform next season.

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Old
02-01-2009, 06:44 PM
  #112
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I am relieved to know Kovalev will not be back in a Habs uniform next season.
oh god it will be sweet

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Old
02-01-2009, 08:42 PM
  #113
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Carbonneau joins the Koivu club:

Quote:
There has been much debate of late over whether Kovalev's play falls off when captain Saku Koivu is in the lineup. Koivu returned Jan. 21 after missing 17 games with an ankle injury and Kovalev has not been at his best since then, except for one day when he was named MVP of the all-star game in Montreal last week.

"I hope that's not the truth or we're in trouble because I'm not taking the C off Saku - that's the bottom line," said Carbonneau, who plans to speak to Kovalev. "If anyone needs a letter to perform on the ice, I have trouble with that. That's not professional at all.

"Alex is not a rookie. Right now, he's struggling, but we need him (if we're going to) go far."

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:04 PM
  #114
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koivu during that PK today when he drilled wideman at the blue line...when was the last time kovalev hit anybody? tucker when he was with the leafs?

if kovalev is a 'leader' and 'captain' he sure doesn't show it. he's invisible for 75% of the season and basically plays when he wants. he looks completely uncoachable. and on top of that he takes dumb lazy selfish penalties that kill momentum

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:06 PM
  #115
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The leader is good, the leader is great, we surrender our will as of this date

Nana nana nana nana leader! Nana nana nana nana leader! LEADER! LEADER!! BATMAN!!!!

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:11 PM
  #116
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even as he gets older, talent diminished, speed decreases...saku plays hard every shift...thats a leader.

he may not be the type to speak up, i have no clue im not in the room, but from what i watch with these two on the ice...its clear its not even close

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:25 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by totalrecall View Post
The leader is good, the leader is great, we surrender our will as of this date

Nana nana nana nana leader! Nana nana nana nana leader! LEADER! LEADER!! BATMAN!!!!
Gotta love Simpsons!

But seriously, Kovalev plays better with the "C" because he has a "I'm Superior Complex" and I think there is a issue with Kovalev and Koivu.

Still, I would take 20 Koivu's over 20 Kovalev's any day because with 20 Koivu's ever player will touch the puck and play every game...with 20 Kovalev's 1 puck wouldn't be enough and who knows if they'll show up?

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:44 PM
  #118
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I've been a Kovalev defender but in light of the last 2 games i've even run out of patience. Never ragged on the guy before but I think it's time that "A" goes off Kovy's jersey and finds it's way back to Higgins.

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Old
02-02-2009, 01:36 AM
  #119
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Flash back to a year ago. It was Kovalev with the heart and Koivu with his head not in the game. Everyone was disappointed with Koivu's play with Kovalev was the "real leader".

Now, Kovalev is struggling and Koivu is the real leader.

Truth is, Koivu has always been the "real leader". People were insane to underrate him last year, and are dumb to underrate Kovalev this year. Hab fans have this bizarre fetish with tearing a player down for not performing to their standards. Am I denying that Kovalev should be working harder? No, but throwing him under the bus when he is still one of our best players is ridiculous. Aren't you Habs fans?

I'm right now disgusted with the Kostitsyn's lack of defensive awareness and Plekanec's cold streak and lack of toughness, but I only want them off the team if Vincent Lecavalier is coming back in the deal. Otherwise, I want them to turn a corner in a Habs uniform.

With exception to WeThreeKings, who just has sand in his vagina that he will never clean out, I really have to question some Hab fans for being so angry at Alex Kovalev. Are you angry by his lack of play or are you angry because he isn't meeting your standards in the 100th Year?

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Old
02-02-2009, 03:20 AM
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lone Rogue View Post
...I really have to question some Hab fans for being so angry at Alex Kovalev. Are you angry by his lack of play or are you angry because he isn't meeting your standards in the 100th Year?
I can't speak for anyone else, but here's my take for what it's worth. I've never been a Kovalev fan, or players like him, like Jagr, Bure and others who think that they're bigger than the team they play on. When things go their way, they're unstoppable but when there's something bothering them, as little as it might be, they start pouting and holding their team hostage by their lack of effort and poor attitudes.

Kovalev, it's been said many times over the years, is one of the most talented players in the entire NHL and he has been for many years. The book has been out on him for that long as well though, he's moody and terribly inconsistent. Kovalev plays when Kovalev feels like playing. Kovalev does what Kovalev wants to do.

He's happy with his All-Star game MVP? Well Kovy, shove it up your ****ing ass as the ASG doesn't mean **** to the team paying your salary. The least you could do to repay the fans who voted you in ahead of Ovechkin is to give it your all, to play the way you did last year.

So to sum it up for you Lone Rogue, the reason why so many were hard on Kovalev two years ago is the same reason why people are hard on him this year. Kovalev proved us right last year because we all knew what he was capable of doing. That's what's expected from Kovalev. No one here is expecting him to win a scoring title. No one here is expecting him to be Ovechkin. But I sure don't think it's a push to expect him to put up a point per game on average or, at the very least, give the necessary effort game in, game out.

To borrow a quote from a once popular TV show: Kovy, you're the weakest link. Bye-bye!

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Old
02-02-2009, 03:12 PM
  #121
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Dressing room to small for Kovy and Koivu?

Last year, Montreal medias were all over this, and we were many to not believe it. Since the start of the season, we had the chance to see Kovy with and without Koivu in the line-up for a long period of time. It appears evident that the artist was indeed better when Koivu was not dressed.

We also saw that Koivu don't seems to be a big factor as far as leadership is concerned. Obviously, we don't know what he's doing and saying in the dressing room, but I can't imagine he's doing a great job out there like Souray did when he was here.

This year, many of our forwards are underperforming despite having the best edition of « Les Glorieux » since the early 90ies. Why? Sure we had and still have many injuries, but most of them appears dry on the ice for most of the games.

That's why I think we are in a very important period for our future. I think it's time to change the top of this team, and when I say the top, I mean the most « important » players, like we are used to say since a few years.

If I was Gainey, I would let go Koivu AND Kovalev.

Kovalev is popular, but on the ice, it's not always great. For each successful play, he creates 5 turnovers. Also, he don't let his teammates play the style they are used to. Good chemistry seems to be hard to get while playing with the Artist. We only saw Pleks and Kost doing well with him for half a season.

As for Koivu, he's doing good on the ice, but it's his team since too long. I think the others players, most of them young, would react better to a Komisarek.

It's not really a knock on these two players, but just the sad reality...at least, in my opinion.

But of course, losing both of them would hurt us if we don't do anything to fill the gaps. That's where Gainey has to make a few calls to know who's available. We can't have good players anymore. We need a great one. It's already aquired that we made a few inquiries about Lecavalier, and we'll continue to do so. But Vinny isn't alone in the « could be available » category.

Kovalchuk is an option for sure.

Brad Richards might be a possibility in a near future.

And Daniel Brière, believe it or not, might be one of the best option. Most great players will cost a lot, and I don't know if we would be able to make a huge deal. Brière might not be needed in Philly anymore, and they might move him for less in order to shed some salary, and add depth. We could try to get him, and re-sign Tanguay to a fair contract. I think they would play well together, and for once, I think we'd have a « clean » team who would be able to work together, as a team. We draft many hard workers, but for some reasons, it don't work in Montreal.

And those change could be made around the draft...

Anyways, I really think it's time for a real change...

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Old
02-02-2009, 03:14 PM
  #122
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Koivu plays well regardless of whether or not Kovalev's in the lineup. Kovalev decides to play well when Koivu's not there. If anything, Kovalev just needs a big kick to the ass.

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Old
02-02-2009, 03:15 PM
  #123
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You really don't see Koivu's impact as a leader? I guess you close your eyes when he's always talking to the rookies on the bench, on the ice, even after a goal it's not a normal celebration for him, you can see him say many things after a goal to guys like D'Ago

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Old
02-02-2009, 03:16 PM
  #124
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not this crap again.

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Old
02-02-2009, 03:18 PM
  #125
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kovy need to go...im done with him and same thing with our little girl plekanec

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