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Old
02-01-2009, 11:33 PM
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dead View Post
I know you started the thread but could you stay on topic?
there was a mention of the PP struggling...and yah the loss of Mark Streit is a reason why it's struggling. It was a mistake by the guy i'm questioning...Bob Gainey.

Now if you want to say something about 'assets' we're willing to give up. Understand that Mike Komisarek is an unrestricted free agent and his value to a team that's floundering like the Canes is minimal when it means that they have to give up Eric Staal to get him.

Just sayin...

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:37 PM
  #52
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Some options include Andy McDonald, Keith Tkachuk, Doug Weight, Mike Comrie. An offensive centre is needed because Plekanec can`t get points this year and Chipchura is not an offensive player.

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:38 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 38 cupless years View Post
there was a mention of the PP struggling...and yah the loss of Mark Streit is a reason why it's struggling. It was a mistake by the guy i'm questioning...Bob Gainey.

Now if you want to say something about 'assets' we're willing to give up. Understand that Mike Komisarek is an unrestricted free agent and his value to a team that's floundering like the Canes is minimal when it means that they have to give up Eric Staal to get him.

Just sayin...
If we would've struggled last year on the PP, would you have blaimed it on the loss of Souray?

I'm the one who said that Stall is untouchable, did you read that part?

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:39 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
Some options include Andy McDonald, Keith Tkachuk, Doug Weight, Mike Comrie. An offensive centre is needed because Plekanec can`t get points this year and Chipchura is not an offensive player.
I think we can add Jordan Staal to that mix. But I think the asking price would be Komisarek because of Pittsburgh's lack of D.

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:39 PM
  #55
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you guys are being too hard on gainey. at the beginning of the year everybody tought we had a great team on paper. Injuries happens, it's not bob's fault. I'm sure he'll do something tho, its the centennial and people wants more than a first round exit... look for a big trade at the deadline

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:40 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 38 cupless years View Post
there was a mention of the PP struggling...and yah the loss of Mark Streit is a reason why it's struggling. It was a mistake by the guy i'm questioning...Bob Gainey.

Now if you want to say something about 'assets' we're willing to give up. Understand that Mike Komisarek is an unrestricted free agent and his value to a team that's floundering like the Canes is minimal when it means that they have to give up Eric Staal to get him.

Just sayin...
And the Streit topic has been done countless times, just post about that in those threads, pretty sure people are fed up of the whole Souray/Streit argument by now. They're both gone.

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:41 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yarfangor View Post
I think we can add Jordan Staal to that mix. But I think the asking price would be Komisarek because of Pittsburgh's lack of D.
Their starving for wingers, i'm sure we can put a package together that won't include Komi.

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:42 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
Some options include Andy McDonald, Keith Tkachuk, Doug Weight, Mike Comrie. An offensive centre is needed because Plekanec can`t get points this year and Chipchura is not an offensive player.
If we're looking at the Blues...i'd ask for Boyes (not sure about his contract) and Backes (love his game).

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02-01-2009, 11:45 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by 38 cupless years View Post
If we're looking at the Blues...i'd ask for Boyes (not sure about his contract) and Backes (love his game).
Boyes is 13.5 mill for next 3 then Ufa and Backes is 5 for next 2, starting next season for both.

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:47 PM
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Originally Posted by dead View Post
If we would've struggled last year on the PP, would you have blaimed it on the loss of Souray?
yes. But we didn't. We have the exact same players on the PP as last year, except we lost Streit who helped QB it. Do the math. And sure it's been discussed ad nauseum, but i'm just bringing it up because it was a fault of Gainey. He "assesses" the team so much, yet he makes a terrible read on the importance of Mark Streit who could have been had for Dandenault money.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dead View Post
I'm the one who said that Stall is untouchable, did you read that part?
ya you said he was untouchable unless we were willing to deal price, markov or Komi
;]

So yes, done talking about Streit. Blunder by Gainey. The End.

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:48 PM
  #61
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What does Bob do?

1) Enjoy the lowered fan expectations
2) Provide a list to Guy of the players that need to grow plums by April
3) Work on a reasonable multi year extension for Koivu that will set the tone for other needed deals
4) Behind closed doors leadership callouts .
5) Keep an eye on the goaltending situation. consider all avenues to ensure this spring has higher quality netminding than last
6) Implement policy: no rental players, no trading of top prospects or top draft picks
7) do like every other team, hope for good health, good goaltending, and good fortune (luck)

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:48 PM
  #62
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I don't expect Gainey to do much...It seems the Habs have been in a free fall since all those Vinny rumors started and they are going to have to get out of this funk by themselves.If they are waiting for Gainey to help them they could be waiting a long time...

The players need to step up and show some pride and that starts with Carbo motivating his team to play harder and the players actually showing up.The talent is there but the heart and desire to win surely isn't right now....

Anyway I prefer the Habs be in a funk right now than closer to playoff time...Having a great regular season means nothing if you have nothing left for the playoffs.There's still 30 or so games left before the playoffs start so we can only hope the Habs can find their "A" game before then...

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:50 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by earl the habs fan View Post
What does Bob do?

1) Enjoy the lowered fan expectations
2) Provide a list to Guy of the players that need to grow plums by April
3) Work on a reasonable multi year extension for Koivu that will set the tone for other needed deals
4) Behind closed doors leadership callouts .
5) Keep an eye on the goaltending situation. consider all avenues to ensure this spring has higher quality netminding than last
6) Implement policy: no rental players, no trading of top prospects or top draft picks
7) do like every other team, hope for good health, good goaltending, and good fortune (luck)
This issue has to be addressed soon imo. Just resign him now to a contract extension ex.3years for a lower salary, make him retire as the longest running captain.

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:52 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dead View Post
Boyes is 13.5 mill for next 3 then Ufa and Backes is 5 for next 2, starting next season for both.
Manageable contracts, but not sure what the Blues would want for them. Boyes is pretty young, and considering they gave him a 3 year deal shows that they have faith in him. Backes on the other hand could probably come cheaper...

Just get something done, bob.

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Old
02-01-2009, 11:53 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dead View Post
This issue has to be addressed soon imo. Just resign him now to a contract extension ex.3years for a lower salary, make him retire as the longest running captain.
As much as I love Koivu a long term deal with Komisarek is needed before a Saku deal.

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Old
02-02-2009, 12:36 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Souray44 View Post
Ah, the Hab fan. They live only in the moment. You can very rarely find this species of hockey fan anywhere else. They have a tendancy to be extremely reactionary. One moment they are blasting out of this world in pure joy, the next they are burning up upon re-entry as they hit rock bottom. The rockstars of NHL fandom.
live in the moment? sorry pal im not of those b.s. fans that think were gonna win the stanley cup after 4-game winning streak and just as much think that all hell is gonna break loose because we are in a slump. What i was suggesting is there is no point in making a trade just for the sake of it because it is not worth it, unless your doing it for a superstar in his prime signed to a long-term deal, we arent going far this year . You think we can beat boston or new jersey in a seven-game series then good for you, i dont think so. You wanna be the eternal optimist then good for you. Then tell me o'wise one what makes you think this team can win it all this year?

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Old
02-02-2009, 12:36 AM
  #67
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Doesn't Jagr want to make an NHL comeback ?
Maybe we should sign him...

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Old
02-02-2009, 12:57 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by 38 cupless years View Post
because we have faith in the team and that it just needs a shot in the arm to get going? i mean we were winning quite a few games with higgins, koivu, price and tanguay out all at the same time...so now 3 of 4 back we start to suck all of a sudden? this team can get it done, but it needs just a few modifications that shouldn't force us to sell the farm.

And what's the point in stocking up on all of these assets during a day of caps and shortened UFA eligibility? So for example we can get say Bouwmeester in the deal...but the deal maker comes in the form of us willing to deal McDonagh and we say no, because there's a chance that he'll be a good defenseman in 3-4 years? Screw that, We got Trevor Timmins...he'll find us another McDonagh. It's not like all of these prospects will play for us at the same time either, so i just don't see the point of stashing all of these assets when most of them won't make an impact for a few seasons. And besides once these assets ingrain themselves onto the team, the UFA ticker will begin...and we'll have to worry about their contracts as well.

And heck if we gave up what the Penguins did last year to get Hossa, we'd still have a plethora of good young assets. Unlike them, we can actually draft players that aren't dropped on our laps.
what the pens gave up last year was depth and its slowing them down this year because they are lacking it. I agree that you shouldnt stash away assets but you trade mcdonagh for bouw, well bouw better have an agreement in place for a long-term contract. You dont throw away blue-chip prospects for rentals. By growing up in your system, these prospects have a better chance of staying then trading for a guy thats gonna bolt as soon as he hits free agency because he didnt like it here in the first place. The you really get screwed. Whats the point of making all these trades when you know were not getting past boston or new jersey in the east. Thats why i say with all our ufas at the end of the year, we can reshape our roster without giving away too many assets that we would have at the deadline for a trade.

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Old
02-02-2009, 03:06 AM
  #69
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Sadly, my bet is that if a deal does go down, it will be of the Rivet or Huet variety... trading an important veteran for pics/prospects. yeah yeah yeah, 3 years later Max Pac and Gorges are great young assets to have, but the name of the game is playoff success, at some point accumulation of young "potential" at the expense of "current contribution" becomes pretty useless... maybe not two years ago, maybe not last year, but if not now, then when?

as frustrated as i'd be if Gainey sits on his hands and does nothing to address the all-to-obvious needs of the club (which i'd argue have been apparent for much longer than the past few weeks... more like past few seasons), I'll be much more upset if he fails to lock up komi at a reasonable salary on a long term deal.

as much as people like to celebrate Gainey's "achievements", fact is that high ranking n prospect depth and 2 second round playoff appearances really is nothing to write home about.
if he can't find a way to translate strong drafting into actual playoff success, then his tenure as GM will have FAIL written all over it.

losing Komj will be a step in the wrong direction even more painful to swallow then another early playoff exit.


on a side note, cue the posters lining up to make excuses for Gainey based on the injuries the team has suffered this year... funny how last season's great REGULAR SEASON was a clear sign of his brilliance, as if the teams freakishly lucky ability to avoid injuries all year had nothing to do with that...

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Old
02-02-2009, 04:05 AM
  #70
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Our first priority should be making the playoffs. Last years first place was a nice surprise, but it is unrealistic to expect it this year. I am confident that with some minor changes we can get to the playoffs safely.
We have the roster to make some damage in the playoffs, when healthy. An acquisition of lets say Bouwmeester or Lecavalier would improve our chances, but we would have to give up a lot for them. Both prospects and depth. If we look at the Penguins this year, we see that it is not worth it.
The most important thing is to gain back the confidence they had last year. Without that any acquisition will be pointless. And this must be done before the playoffs begin.

That is why I believe the best move would be to trade Kovalev+ for a young puckmoving D (like Letang). Yes, I jumped on the trade Kovalev bandwagon, but I think that his inconsistency is hurting the team confidence. Last year they rallied around him and they won the Eastern Conference. They sought to the same this year, but sadly this year Kovalev is his old self. He is without a doubt a valuable asset in the playoffs, but his play in the regular season will hurt the overall team confidence more than his postseason play is worth.
With the loss of Lang we should look to a veteran center, but not someone like Lecavalier or Eric/Joradan Staal, but a cheap veteran like McDonald or Weight.

For all those who want to trade our best prospects saying, there will be others, just look at Atlanta and their trade for Zhitnik and Tkachuk and how that has worked out.
And if you want Gainey to make a move everytime things become difficult, look no further then to Tampa Bay. They made a move almost weekly and we have seen how effective that has been.

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Old
02-02-2009, 04:35 AM
  #71
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The team is broken at the core, it's time to look to the next 1-3 yrs imo. There's no way the buildup of this team can go far in the playoffs unless we add a very good C, a 4th D and more grit into the lineup. I'm afraid we won't be able to do that without gutting our prospect pool..

I just don't see us going far with such a reliance on Kovalev, Plekanec and Higgins/Skost for offense and still no answer to the pp woes.. Koivu can't do everything and Lang is now out.

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Old
02-02-2009, 05:38 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by yarfangor View Post
I believe this is where we are headed. We went from having an OK season with the 100th year, Kovy being the Cinderella of the ASG, and now things have taken a turn for the worst and we are in a quick downward spiral. Ask yourself this....WHO IN THE HELL WOULD WANT TO TRADE WITH US? We can't give up Markov, Komi, Price, Andrei and Sergei are nearly untouchable...Lats, Tangs, Langs, Laraque, Dandenoooo, Gorges are injured. What do we have left? D'Ago, Patches, Koivu, Kovy, O'Byrne, Hammer, Higgins, Pleks. I mean theres not much to be had. You can't throw in Pleks, Higgins, and Fischer and hope to land Lecavalier, it just doesn't work. SO I say we ride the Tiger, cuz we can see his stripes but we know hes clean. Meaning we know whats ahead, but we don't waste our assets away. We went from looking great in depth to be ****ed over by injuries all year long. Maybe next year the Kostitsyns will have a break out year. I think you either make a push for a bonefide franchise player/impact player or don't do anything at all and fish for picks later.
This.

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Old
02-02-2009, 06:46 AM
  #73
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Bob needs to sit with Carbo, and give him the team, meaning that Kovy has to go, why? Because it's Saku's team.. Then take it from there and patch the holes..

Kovy needs to go, he's worth something to an experienced team like the Sharks or others already contending, looking for an extra spark..

Us? Youth, let them play and we still have a month to evaluate our needs..

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Old
02-02-2009, 07:24 AM
  #74
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Probably nothing, as usual.
+ 1000

Seriously, Gainey never ever panic. He never makes blockbuster moves at the deadline, doesn't negotiate contract extensions with pending UFA players during the season.

He only gets busy during the off-season.

I don't expect anything from Bob at this point other than a "Todd Simpson" type of deal.

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Old
02-02-2009, 07:36 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
Some options include Andy McDonald, Keith Tkachuk, Doug Weight, Mike Comrie. An offensive centre is needed because Plekanec can`t get points this year and Chipchura is not an offensive player.
Mcdonald is hurt I believe and Tkachuk already made a list of teams and Montreal is not on that list.

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