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Lets say New York Rangers pick up Avery on Re-Entry waivers...

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Old
02-07-2009, 04:48 PM
  #1
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What happens if NYR decides that Avery wasn't worth the risk, and then waives him, puts him back on re-entry waivers.

Does:

Dallas pay 1/2 salary with 1/2 counting towards cap, NYR pay 1/4 salary, with 1/4 counting against cap, and Team C picking up the tab for 1/4 salary and 1/4 coutning against cap.

OR

Dallas pays 1/4 and 1/4, nyr 1/4 and 1/4, and Team C 1/2 and 1/2?

Or something entirely different?

What about waiver exemptions?

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Old
02-07-2009, 04:53 PM
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*sigh* Fugu was supposed to have made this point #29 in the FAQ thread, but apparently someone is slacking around here ... so I'll have to answer this for the 4th time.

-- Dallas sends Avery down to the minors, then recalls him and the Rangers claim him on the way back up. The Rangers and Stars split the salary and cap hit remaining on his contract 50/50.
-- The Rangers then waive him, but someone else [say Toronto] picks him up. The Maple Leafs and Stars then split Avery's contract 50/50, and the Rangers are off the hook.
-- Say the Rangers instead assign Avery to the minors, and no one claims him [not even Dallas]. The Rangers and Stars continue to split his salary, but no cap hit is incurred as Avery is in the minors and not subject to the "35 and older" clause.
-- The Rangers recall Avery from the minors after having assigned him, and Toronto claims him on the way back up. The Maple Leafs and Rangers now split Avery's cap hit and salary, and Dallas is off the hook.

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Old
02-07-2009, 05:14 PM
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Hey, I just moved the posts to the thread, numbers 29 and 30.

Errr-- you have a point 29 and 30. Was I supposed to ruin your orderly FAQ section?

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=300664

I've been busy marauding, and filling up my Locker.

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Old
02-11-2009, 10:20 AM
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If Avery was traded to a team while he was in the minors, would he have to go through re-entry waivers before playing with them?

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Old
02-11-2009, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
If Avery was traded to a team while he was in the minors, would he have to go through re-entry waivers before playing with them?
No. The AHL team does not own his rights, the Stars do. The only way he could switch AHL teams is if the Stars consent - and, since it's a minor-league transaction, waivers would not be required.

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Old
02-11-2009, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Irish Blues View Post
No. The AHL team does not own his rights, the Stars do. The only way he could switch AHL teams is if the Stars consent - and, since it's a minor-league transaction, waivers would not be required.
I'm sorry. I wasn't clear.

Avery is currently in the minors. If by some minute chance Avery is traded to another NHL team, would he have to clear re-entry waivers before leaving the AHL and playing with his new NHL team?

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Old
02-11-2009, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
Hey, I just moved the posts to the thread, numbers 29 and 30.

Errr-- you have a point 29 and 30. Was I supposed to ruin your orderly FAQ section?

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=300664

I've been busy marauding, and filling up my Locker.
So is it now official that you go out looking for booty?

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Old
02-11-2009, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
I'm sorry. I wasn't clear.

Avery is currently in the minors. If by some minute chance Avery is traded to another NHL team, would he have to clear re-entry waivers before leaving the AHL and playing with his new NHL team?
Yes, he would. It would be identical to the Josef Melichar trade between Carolina and Tampa Bay.

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So is it now official that you go out looking for booty?
hfbb.

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Old
02-11-2009, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Blues View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigG44
I'm sorry. I wasn't clear.

Avery is currently in the minors. If by some minute chance Avery is traded to another NHL team, would he have to clear re-entry waivers before leaving the AHL and playing with his new NHL team?
Yes, he would. It would be identical to the Josef Melichar trade between Carolina and Tampa Bay.
Are you sure?

Article 50.9(g) could be interpreted otherwise:

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBA Article 50.9(g)
(ii) To the extent the Player does require Waivers to be Loaned to a
minor league affiliate
, he cannot be Loaned or recalled without
first clearing regular Waivers, and then cannot be Recalled to the
NHL parent Club
during the same League Year without also
clearing a new Re-Entry Waiver procedure, pursuant to which the
Player can be claimed by another NHL Club for fifty (50) percent
of the contract's remaining amounts to be paid, with the balance to
be paid by and charged to the waiving NHL Club (both amounts to
be counted against each Club's Upper Limit, Actual Club Salary
and Averaged Club Salary, and counted against the Players'
Share); and
Does 50.9(g) apply only if a player is loaned to an affiliate and then recalled by that same parent club?

This could be interpeted as if Avery is traded (to any team other than the Rangers to get around the Dallas-has-no-AHL-team-so-we-will-loan-him-to-sombody-else's problem) then that new team could immediately recall him w/o Re-Entry waivers if they never assign him to their AHL affiliate - since it would not be the case of him being recalled to the NHL parent club.

Do you know if Alex Auld was exposed to Re-Entry Waivers last season after he was traded PHX->BOS and then recalled by the Bruins?

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Old
02-11-2009, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by kdb209 View Post
Are you sure?

Article 50.9(g) could be interpreted otherwise:
There's 2 ways to think of this ...

1. Think of a player subject to regular waivers but not subject to recall waivers, that is loaned to the minors and is later traded to another NHL team while he is in the minors: does he have to clear regular waivers to join the new AHL team? [Answer: no ... unless you for some reason think that the trade goes down as "we recalled him, we traded him to the other NHL team, and they proceeded to assign him" - which is not the case.]

2. The rights of the player signed to an NHL contract are held by the NHL team - not the AHL team. As such, the NHL team could move him from their farm club to any other AHL team and waivers would not be required to make the move ... as long as the player is not recalled to the NHL in the process. [Unless, similar to above, you think this would be "we recall him so we can assign him elsewhere" - but again, that's not the case.]


Quote:
Originally Posted by kdb209 View Post
Does 50.9(g) apply only if a player is loaned to an affiliate and then recalled by that same parent club?
No, because Melichar had to clear re-entry waivers with Tampa [who obviously didn't assign him to the AHL].

Quote:
Originally Posted by kdb209 View Post
Do you know if Alex Auld was exposed to Re-Entry Waivers last season after he was traded PHX->BOS and then recalled by the Bruins?
No ... because Auld had a 2-way contract and the AHL component of it had a $100,000 salary ... so he wouldn't have been subject to recall waivers. Even if his AHL salary had been in excess of $100K, he still wouldn't have been subject because he had logged over 180 pro games going into the 2007-08 season and thus would have been exempt from the restriction on minor league salary and compensation.

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Old
02-11-2009, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Blues View Post
No ... because Auld had a 2-way contract and the AHL component of it had a $100,000 salary ... so he wouldn't have been subject to recall waivers. Even if his AHL salary had been in excess of $100K, he still wouldn't have been subject because he had logged over 180 pro games going into the 2007-08 season and thus would have been exempt from the restriction on minor league salary and compensation.
I wasn't aware that Auld was on a two-way deal.

He was NOT exempt from Re-Entry Waivers under the Veteran Minor League Player exemption - 320+ (180+ for goalies) professional (NHL, AHL, ECHL) games played and < 40/80 games on an NHL roster the previous year / two years. He played 94 games the previous two seasons (67 games for Vancouver in '05-'06 and 27 for Florida in '06-'07).

I had assumed that the UFA deal he signed with Phoenix in '07 was a one-way deal, and the fact that there were no Re-Entry Waivers (that I recalled) after the trade to Boston, led me to give weight to the interpretation of 50.9(g) that I posted above.

But the case of Melichar seems to give a definitive answer.

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Old
02-11-2009, 04:47 PM
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FWIW, the AHL transaction site says Auld was recalled by Phoenix on the same day as the trade. Though that could be due to a limitation of the AHL transaction system to record he was recalled to a different NHL team.

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Old
02-11-2009, 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted by kdb209 View Post
He was NOT exempt from Re-Entry Waivers under the Veteran Minor League Player exemption - 320+ (180+ for goalies) professional (NHL, AHL, ECHL) games played and < 40/80 games on an NHL roster the previous year / two years.
I didn't have that piece at my fingertips ... something about locking up the computer and not being able to access anything else except that post [after which, the computer utterly crashed and IT is having to fix tonight].

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