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Gomez to Atlanta

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Old
02-24-2009, 10:53 AM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Addiction View Post
I just don't see how Gomez will help Atlanta. He can't even the Rangers at the moment who have more talent than Atlanta has. I would love to see Gomez go but but the Rangers are going to have to sweeten the deal with picks or prospect i think in order for another team to take on that fat contract.
The Thrashers play a much more wide open offensive game, I think Gomez would thrive in Atlanta. Look at the numbers that Kozlov, White, Little, and Peverley in his short stint have put up.

I really like Enstrom, but the only reason I think the Thrashers would include him is to get rid of some long term salary since they would be adding Gomez's cap number. You could switch out Hainsey for Enstrom in this and I think it still works. It all depends on who the Thrashers would rather hold on to.

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02-24-2009, 10:59 AM
  #27
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If the choice is Enstrom or Hainsey, I'd have to say Hejdå, Enstrom!

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02-24-2009, 11:39 AM
  #28
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Well its probably just me but i really dont think Enstrom is that good. And he is locked up for many years for almost 4 mil per year in future so possible awful contract going the other way. And yea well, that 2nd pick is perhaps too high i admit that.

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02-24-2009, 11:48 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4rde View Post
Well its probably just me but i really dont think Enstrom is that good. And he is locked up for many years for almost 4 mil per year in future so possible awful contract going the other way. And yea well, that 2nd pick is perhaps too high i admit that.
Enstrom has shown flashes of brilliance. This year, he's not had as many opportunities on the power play as he did last year. I agree with those who say his stick is far too long for him, and really feel he could improve his game if only he would use equipment more suited for a player his size. I can't imagine the stick thing is something he picked up with Modo.

Enstrom is a diamond in the rough kind of thing. Yeah, his 4m/yr deal is a little pricey for the kind of player he seems to be so far this year, but with a few fundamental changes, he could be a real steal for the Rangers -- assuming Atlanta opts to move him. He's young still, too, so that's another plus.

As for that 2nd, if the team you were talking trade with was both (a) in a position to take on the salary and (b) in playoff contention, I could see that pick from that team coming back the other way. However, Atlanta is [re]building [again]. Indeed, those stakes are a little too high for a team that is 29th in the league. But you know this

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02-24-2009, 11:55 AM
  #30
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Enstrom is almost a + player on the Thrashers, along with Havelid. His offensive production has gone down due to Hainsey, Schnieder, and Bogosian coming in, but he has vastly improved his defensive play this year.

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02-24-2009, 12:00 PM
  #31
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What about Gomez for Enstrom straight up? no picks

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Old
02-24-2009, 12:06 PM
  #32
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Enstrom is a better player than he was last year. His offensive production is down because he no longer plays almost 6 minutes a game on the PP like he did last season, but he has been fantastic defensively. People who think he "isn't that good" and think that he has had a "disappointing season" probably haven't watched him play are are just looking at his point totals.

He is young and still the Thrashers' #1 defenseman. For that reason, they won't be moving him.

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Old
02-24-2009, 12:08 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toxostoma Rufum View Post
As I said, good in the corners and open ice, horrible around the crease and PK. His plus minus is largely caused by Havelid's excellent work.
You're dead wrong on this.

Plus/Minus
-2 Enstrom + Havelid
-1 Havelid apart from Enstrom
+4 Enstrom apart from Havelid

Shot Differential
-99 Enstrom + Havelid
-62 Havelid apart from Enstrom
+4 Enstrom apart from Havelid

Enstrom is much more effective apart from Havelid. Ergo it is Enstrom that is contributing the most to that pairing.

http://www.birdwatchersanonymous.com...ter-enstrom-of

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Old
02-24-2009, 12:11 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by btn View Post
The Thrashers play a much more wide open offensive game, I think Gomez would thrive in Atlanta. Look at the numbers that Kozlov, White, Little, and Peverley in his short stint have put up.

I really like Enstrom, but the only reason I think the Thrashers would include him is to get rid of some long term salary since they would be adding Gomez's cap number. You could switch out Hainsey for Enstrom in this and I think it still works. It all depends on who the Thrashers would rather hold on to.
Not to mention that Gomez isn't that fast--but he excels when paired with speedy wingers (Mogilny, Elias come to mind). If Gomez makes great out let passes to Kovalchuk and Little it could be a dynamic line.

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02-24-2009, 12:13 PM
  #35
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Enstrom is definitely vastly improved defensively. But his offensive production, along with being buried behind acquired depth, could also have something to do with that big stick he's wielding. Or it could be that opposing teams have adapted to him, and he needs to be a little less predictable.

Either way, he doesn't look the same now as he did then. He's not earning that 4mil/yr, but he's not being paid that much this year, either, so I'm not worried. I'd rather keep both Enstrom and Hainsey, and dump the dead weight. But seriously, what fan of their team wouldn't want to keep their quality (or potential quality) players and cut the guys not playing up to par?

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Old
02-24-2009, 12:26 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4rde View Post
So i saw topic about teams being interested getting Gomez so i thought Trashers to be one of them.

To Rangers:
Tobias Enstrom
2nd round pick in 09

Im really not sure if this is good proposal in any way, but Gomez to Atlanta feels pretty good to me so i just threw something out here.

7mil payroll isnt hurting their cap space much, they have almost 12mil cap space at the moment. 5mil should be enough to give Little raise and sign Kovalchuk again.

Atlanta picks Hedman in the draft to get new good young d-man And if they cant, well thats a shame then

Kovy - Gomez - Little
Kozlov - White - Peverley
This trade actually makes a lot of sense for both teams. Might have to remove the 2nd round pick because they are assuming Gomez huge contract but it works well for both teams. Gomez would be nasty paired with Kovalchuk.Enstrom comes cheap to the Rags and boosts their powerplay.

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Old
02-24-2009, 01:00 PM
  #37
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you could keep Gomez.

I'd rather use Todd White than horrid Gomez though White blows too.

We need JT more than Hedman.

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02-24-2009, 01:02 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dj4aces View Post
Enstrom is definitely vastly improved defensively. But his offensive production, along with being buried behind acquired depth, could also have something to do with that big stick he's wielding. Or it could be that opposing teams have adapted to him, and he needs to be a little less predictable.

Either way, he doesn't look the same now as he did then. He's not earning that 4mil/yr, but he's not being paid that much this year, either, so I'm not worried. I'd rather keep both Enstrom and Hainsey, and dump the dead weight. But seriously, what fan of their team wouldn't want to keep their quality (or potential quality) players and cut the guys not playing up to par?
Enstrom is young this is his second year. I wasnt expecting much out of him this season or anyone else on the team. He's fine. We don't need Gomez.

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02-24-2009, 01:15 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by 4rde View Post
Oh and yea i think Gomez still has value to GM's. He probably isnt that hated in their minds as he is in these boards.

He is around point per game player, good playmaker, plays good d (at least he did in NJ) and is experienced.

I think he is just having a bad season.
Gomez was probably the worst defensive forward who played a regular shift in NJ in the last five years.

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02-24-2009, 01:17 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Gomez was probably the worst defensive forward who played a regular shift in NJ in the last five years.
LOL ... just by hearing that first hand from a Devils fan, i think i'd pass on him and work with Peverly instead.

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02-24-2009, 01:19 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter View Post
If I am Columbus...in need a center to play with Nash...I try to get Gomez before anyone else can.

I trade Kris Russell, 1st pick '09 and Jason Williams (contract and body dump) to Rangers for Gomez...whom I am assuming is simply trying to dump a contract.
You are out of your ****ing mind.

Nash and Gomez making close to 15 million next season? No thank you. Stuff like this is how you get into cap trouble (see NY Rangers).

All the Jackets have to give up is our best shootout player, a good young puck moving defenseman, and a 1st round pick for a salary dump?!? Where do I sign?

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02-24-2009, 01:27 PM
  #42
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Todd White is Producing more and is paid about 1/3 of Gomez Salary.



I posted this in the other Gomez thread.....

Todd White 2,350,000 signed for 2 more years
ATL 60 15 36 51 -10 18

Scott Gomez 7,357,143 signed for 5 more years.
NYR 56 12 30 42 -9 46

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02-24-2009, 01:32 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by AtlantaSportsFan View Post
LOL ... just by hearing that first hand from a Devils fan, i think i'd pass on him and work with Peverly instead.
To be fair, you have to be adequate defensively to even get a regular shift in NJ. But on a team full of two-way forwards, Gomez's "average" defensive play definitely stuck out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Falconer View Post
Not to mention that Gomez isn't that fast--but he excels when paired with speedy wingers (Mogilny, Elias come to mind). If Gomez makes great out let passes to Kovalchuk and Little it could be a dynamic line.

This isn't true. Gomez's biggest strength is his speed, and his speed makes him one of the best trap-breakers in the league. If he was as good once he got into the offensive zone as he is at getting there, he might even be worth that horrendous contract.

I always thought Gomez was a fantastic skater, but overrated as a passer.

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02-24-2009, 01:34 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AtlantaSportsFan View Post
Enstrom is young this is his second year. I wasnt expecting much out of him this season or anyone else on the team. He's fine. We don't need Gomez.
I was hoping Enstrom would put up the numbers offensively, like he did last year. He got buried by acquired depth.

Really, though, his stick is quite long. I'd like to see him experiment with shorter sticks and see if he can put more shots on net.

Gomez would be a big body to create space for Kovalchuk, as well as put the puck on net for himself Kovalchuk hasn't had a big body since Savard. Atlanta can also afford him -- even with the cap potentially shrinking next year. Lastly, it gives Atlanta an opportunity to export some of its lesser performing players. It would be a good move for Atlanta for the future (Gomez would love the wide open system), as well as a good move for the Rangers (Nine players eating $40mil of salary? Not good!).

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEIV View Post
Todd White is Producing more and is paid about 1/3 of Gomez Salary.
There's also the issue of two (three, if you consider Torts coming in the door now) different systems. White is doing better than I expected or ever anticipated this year.

Think about it: Todd friggin' White is putting up good numbers in the John Anderson system. Peverley has already out-done the numbers he put up in Nashville in a fraction of the games he's played in Atlanta. Who is to say Gomez can't? He would be worth taking a chance on, if for no other reason than to create space for Kovalchuk.


Last edited by dj4aces: 02-24-2009 at 01:41 PM.
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Old
02-24-2009, 01:36 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEIV View Post
Todd White is Producing more and is paid about 1/3 of Gomez Salary.



I posted this in the other Gomez thread.....

Todd White 2,350,000 signed for 2 more years
ATL 60 15 36 51 -10 18

Scott Gomez 7,357,143 signed for 5 more years.
NYR 56 12 30 42 -9 46
The question you need to ask yourself, what would White have done under Renney's system, and what would Gomez have done under Anderson's system.

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02-24-2009, 01:42 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by The Falconer View Post
You're dead wrong on this.

Plus/Minus
-2 Enstrom + Havelid
-1 Havelid apart from Enstrom
+4 Enstrom apart from Havelid

Shot Differential
-99 Enstrom + Havelid
-62 Havelid apart from Enstrom
+4 Enstrom apart from Havelid

Enstrom is much more effective apart from Havelid. Ergo it is Enstrom that is contributing the most to that pairing.

http://www.birdwatchersanonymous.com...ter-enstrom-of
That's a great argument and good stats. Thank you. The only thing I'd counter to that is that I think Anderson will let Havelid stay out there for mis-matched longer shifts playing with Exelby or Valabik to get the pairings right etc. whereas Enstrom seems to quickly get off whenever the Havelid and Enstrom show is over. You rarely see Havelid getting off the ice before Enstrom even though they both log a lot of minutes.

If Enstrom was a less passive guy I'd be okay with keeping him. He's been treating the puck like a hot potato all year except when he has clear open ice, and then he flies. As for Gomez, the salary stinks, but I think we'd be better with White and Gomez up the middle than with Enstrom...we're going to see Bogosian and Hainsey on the PP, and we may end up with Hedman.

I guess if we go with Hainsey-Bogosian Hedman-Enstrom, then let's keep Enstrom. Go with a second line of Kozlov-Peverley-Armstrong.

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02-24-2009, 01:49 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dj4aces View Post
I was hoping Enstrom would put up the numbers offensively, like he did last year. He got buried by acquired depth.

Really, though, his stick is quite long. I'd like to see him experiment with shorter sticks and see if he can put more shots on net.

Gomez would be a big body to create space for Kovalchuk, as well as put the puck on net for himself Kovalchuk hasn't had a big body since Savard. Atlanta can also afford him -- even with the cap potentially shrinking next year. Lastly, it gives Atlanta an opportunity to export some of its lesser performing players. It would be a good move for Atlanta for the future (Gomez would love the wide open system), as well as a good move for the Rangers (Nine players eating $40mil of salary? Not good!).



There's also the issue of two (three, if you consider Torts coming in the door now) different systems. White is doing better than I expected or ever anticipated this year.

Think about it: Todd friggin' White is putting up good numbers in the John Anderson system. Peverley has already out-done the numbers he put up in Nashville in a fraction of the games he's played in Atlanta. Who is to say Gomez can't? He would be worth taking a chance on, if for no other reason than to create space for Kovalchuk.
Gomez a big body? Where do people get these things?

He's a smaller than average player, who is chippy along the boards, but not the type of player who would ever drive to the net. Seriously, when Gomez played with Gionta and Elias, Elias was the biggest, most physical player on the line. And Elias is a guy who generally plays better with an actual big body to open up space for him.

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02-24-2009, 01:49 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEIV View Post
Todd White is Producing more and is paid about 1/3 of Gomez Salary.



I posted this in the other Gomez thread.....

Todd White 2,350,000 signed for 2 more years
ATL 60 15 36 51 -10 18

Scott Gomez 7,357,143 signed for 5 more years.
NYR 56 12 30 42 -9 46
While that is true, Gomez destroyed White's production 70 points to 37 points in the year prior. Pound for pound Gomez has more offensive talent than White, the given the salary disparities Gomez might not be worth the cost it would take to get those extra points.

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02-24-2009, 01:53 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by btn View Post
The question you need to ask yourself, what would White have done under Renney's system, and what would Gomez have done under Anderson's system.
I'm not going to disagree...

But people need to remember, Gomez played under some pretty stiffling systems in the past -- One being Pat Burns and the other being Claude Julien.

Julien's system in New Jersey was probably the most restrait of offense I have ever seen as a Devil fan in over 25 years of following that team....Gomez career has pretty much been consistant over mutlipe systems and coaches with the exception of one big year(EDIT: A CONTRACT YEAR) where chemistry between Elias and Gionta was just incredible (And that was coached by half by Robinson and half by Lou).


What I'm saying is; I don't think that 7.4M Cap hit can be justifiable for what you will get with Gomez.

Last Edit: Don't miss understand me though, I would love to have Gomez back in New Jersey. I would just like to pay him 5 or less


Last edited by JimEIV: 02-24-2009 at 02:04 PM.
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02-24-2009, 01:57 PM
  #50
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Christensen/3rd/perrin/xlb (take 3/4)
for gomez.
Enstrom isnt going anywhere.
neither will Hainsey.
White is doing great in the system because Kozzy found hismelf, and little is a machine.
Hell, if we can get gomez for some spare parts, and give a lowtier 1st line center WITH speed., I'd be more then down for that. 8 mil is steep, but how old is gomez? 26?28?

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