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Kaberle and Antropov to Vancouver

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Old
02-25-2009, 04:59 PM
  #26
Passthedonuts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
Source?

i mustve missed this one
Bob McKenzie on TSN a few days ago.

Apparently the list had 10 teams, all in the East.

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Old
02-25-2009, 05:05 PM
  #27
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So, there are only four teams in the East he wouldn't go to? I love it.

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Old
02-25-2009, 05:33 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alternate View Post
so you don't see the difference in signing a UFA when we have tons of cap space or moving our top 2 prospects?
What happens when you can't sign a UFA that will make an impact? Sign one that won't?

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Old
02-25-2009, 06:19 PM
  #29
Schenn
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i say a bit closer would be..

to Toronto: Hodgeson
Schneider
1st 10
O'Brien

to Vancouver: Kaberle
Moore
Pogge

Because burke wants a 1st prospect and nhl ready player for kaberle..,
The 1st in 2010 cuzz gillis said he wouldnt trade hodgeson or the 09 first., but BB and gillis can compromise hedgeson and 1st in 2010.
O'brien cuzz he can fill the hole in defence and is a posible trading asset for vancouver.
pogge and moore for schneider because pogge is not wuite as good of a prospect goalie, and moore is there because it cant be straight up pooge-schnieder. gillis would never accept that.

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Old
02-25-2009, 06:20 PM
  #30
Nizdizzle
Salary cap? Huh?
 
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Oh **** no. Really, really big pass on that one.

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Old
02-25-2009, 06:23 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roddy View Post
Well he is five years younger.

And if you compare Hodgson to Carter when he was a similar age, it's pretty easy to make the case that Hodgson at age 19 looks like a better prospect than Carter did at age 19.

Carter 2003-04 GP 59 G 36 A 30 P 66
Hodgson 2008-09* GP 44 G 33 A 39 P 72

We'll see what Hodgson can do over the rest of the season.

But of course, the Leafs can't wait for a prospect to develop right? They need someone to help them win now.
Or you could not use stats and compare their respective prospect grades

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Old
02-25-2009, 06:31 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Nathan311 View Post
Or you could not use stats and compare their respective prospect grades
Mike Richards and Derick Brassard are both 7.5 C's on Hockey's Future.com

nbd, js.

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Old
02-25-2009, 06:45 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathan311 View Post
Or you could not use stats and compare their respective prospect grades

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Old
02-25-2009, 06:52 PM
  #34
R0bert0 Lu0ng0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathan311 View Post
Or you could not use stats and compare their respective prospect grades
Yes.. yes you could do that. But why would you?

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Old
02-25-2009, 07:00 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roddy View Post
Yes.. yes you could do that. But why would you?
Never mind the prospect grades, but surely you realize that comparing junior stats isn't a valid comparison for young players. There's no evidence that Hodgson is the offensive force that Carter was at that age. Most scouts talk about him as being a good two-way player with good intangibles. If he can get to the NHL and chip in some points thats great, but they're completely different players.

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Old
02-25-2009, 07:09 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schenn29 View Post
i say a bit closer would be..

to Toronto: Hodgeson
Schneider
1st 10
O'Brien

to Vancouver: Kaberle
Moore
Pogge

Because burke wants a 1st prospect and nhl ready player for kaberle..,
The 1st in 2010 cuzz gillis said he wouldnt trade hodgeson or the 09 first., but BB and gillis can compromise hedgeson and 1st in 2010.
O'brien cuzz he can fill the hole in defence and is a posible trading asset for vancouver.
pogge and moore for schneider because pogge is not wuite as good of a prospect goalie, and moore is there because it cant be straight up pooge-schnieder. gillis would never accept that.
You people are nuts. Hodgson and Schneider are not going to TO. Burke would be hailed as a hero if he could swing that deal.

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Old
02-25-2009, 07:26 PM
  #37
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The sad thing about this thread is watching the Leafs fans set themselves up for such disappointment. It's going to be really ugly for them come March 4th.

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Old
02-25-2009, 07:27 PM
  #38
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Kaberle doesn't want to go to the Western Conference - thank God. So we don't have to talk about this anymore.

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Old
02-25-2009, 07:28 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grabo84 View Post
Never mind the prospect grades, but surely you realize that comparing junior stats isn't a valid comparison for young players.
Well I'm not going to say it's the be all and end all - I mean, Matt Cooke had a 95 point season in junior.

That being said, I don't think it's some kind of sin to compare how two players did in the same development year in the same league - I never said that I expect Hodgson will be a top ten scorer in the NHL as a 24 year-old or anything, just that based on the indications, he may be as good a player as Carter.

Quote:
There's no evidence that Hodgson is the offensive force that Carter was at that age.
Well, I said better prospect - not better scorer.

That being said, Hodgson was one of Team Canada's leading scorers and quarterbacked the powerplay at the WJC's - he's also 11th in scoring in the OHL despite having played fewer games than everybody ahead of him.

By comparison, Carter was 32nd in OHL scoring in the same development year.

Quote:
Most scouts talk about him as being a good two-way player with good intangibles.
Scouts also talk about him having first-line talent, some even said that he had all the tools that Steven Stamkos has minus the explosive speed.

Quote:
If he can get to the NHL and chip in some points thats great, but they're completely different players.
Yes, they are completely different players.. but you're making it sound like Hodgson is destined to be a third liner.

But keep in mind that Hodgson was drafted 10th overall in a draft that many compared to the 2003 draft (when Carter was selected 11th) in terms of depth - I don't think they're as far off from one another as you're implying.

Anyways, we won't know for years whether Hodgson's on-ice contributions are close to Carter's.

But before this season I don't think many would have argued with my assertion - and Hodgson is a long way away from showing us what he can do at age 24 and 25, so we just have to look at what Carter was doing at ages 18 and 19.

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Old
02-25-2009, 07:33 PM
  #40
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Some Canuck fans on their board wouldn't trade Heatly for Hodgson so I doubt they do this.

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Old
02-25-2009, 07:36 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roddy View Post
Scouts also talk about him having first-line talent, some even said that he had all the tools that Steven Stamkos has minus the explosive speed.
And his skating improved significantly since being drafted thanks to spending the summer training with Dave Gagner at his sports facility. In fact, IIRC, the knock against Sam Gagner when he was drafted was his skating and he improved on that as well.

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Old
02-25-2009, 07:37 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roddy View Post
Yes, they are completely different players.. but you're making it sound like Hodgson is destined to be a third liner.
Well, that wasn't what I meant it to sound like. I agree with your post here, this all makes sense to me. It's another piece of the puzzle, and it gives some sort of indication, but it isn't really that helpful at this point in time.

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Old
02-25-2009, 08:48 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schenn29 View Post
i say a bit closer would be..

to Toronto: Hodgeson
Schneider
1st 10
O'Brien

to Vancouver: Kaberle
Moore
Pogge

Because burke wants a 1st prospect and nhl ready player for kaberle..,
The 1st in 2010 cuzz gillis said he wouldnt trade hodgeson or the 09 first., but BB and gillis can compromise hedgeson and 1st in 2010.
O'brien cuzz he can fill the hole in defence and is a posible trading asset for vancouver.
pogge and moore for schneider because pogge is not wuite as good of a prospect goalie, and moore is there because it cant be straight up pooge-schnieder. gillis would never accept that.
i lol'd

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Old
02-25-2009, 08:49 PM
  #44
R0bert0 Lu0ng0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowShot View Post
Some Canuck fans on their board wouldn't trade Heatly for Hodgson so I doubt they do this.
I can't really disagree with your assessment. I'd trade Hodgson for Heatley in a second of course, and Mike Gillis would too.

But as MG's first draft pick and a player that embodies the virtues Gillis has been telling everyone he values, I think most Canuck fans perceive that it would take a sweetheart deal (maybe not Heatley, but you get the picture) to convince Gillis to trade Hodgson.

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Old
02-25-2009, 08:50 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by stop View Post
i lol'd
I'm assuming he left out Kaberle by accident.

I still wouldn't do it, but it at least looks realistic.

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Old
02-25-2009, 09:00 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roddy View Post
I can't really disagree with your assessment. I'd trade Hodgson for Heatley in a second of course, and Mike Gillis would too.

But as MG's first draft pick and a player that embodies the virtues Gillis has been telling everyone he values, I think most Canuck fans perceive that it would take a sweetheart deal (maybe not Heatley, but you get the picture) to convince Gillis to trade Hodgson.
I agree that he would have a tough time trading his first draft pick who so far looks great. Though I never understood why the Canucks fired Nonis. He never traded youth and signs players to good contracts. Gillis seems like a copy of him with not wanting to trade any good prospects or high draft picks.

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Old
02-25-2009, 09:16 PM
  #47
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Vancouver and Toronto dont make great dance partners this season. Vancouver wants a quicky and Toronto want to have kids on the first date

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Old
02-25-2009, 09:20 PM
  #48
R0bert0 Lu0ng0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowShot View Post
Though I never understood why the Canucks fired Nonis. He never traded youth and signs players to good contracts. Gillis seems like a copy of him with not wanting to trade any good prospects or high draft picks.
Well they seem to say they have similar philosophies but Nonis threw away a lot of high draft picks - just no 1sts - on temporary, mediocre assets like Brent Sopel, Bryan Smolinski, Eric Weinrich, Mika Noronen, etc.

Furthermore his first round picks in the last few years (Grabner, White) seem like major projects - Luc Bourdon aside, we haven't seen any significant return from any Nonis draft aside from 2004.

Gillis isn't entirely opposed to trading away high picks - see the Bernier deal, he was also shopping his 1st for Mike Cammalleri and Oscar Moller last summer - provided they return a long-term asset to the team.

Gillis seems to have some novel ideas as well - he has poured money into player development, which has become very hands-on, and has gone the extra mile in doing everything from studying players' sleep patterns to ensuring a less taxing travel schedule for Western teams next year.

Basically what Nonis succeeded most in (aside from acquiring Luongo) was in resigning players to sensible, medium-term contracts. He wasn't great at drafting or developing players, he wasn't robbing other teams via trade (aside from that one exception), he was just kind of coasting along without doing anything TOO stupid.

At the end of the day what probably matters most is that Nonis was put in place by John McCaw and Stan McCammon, he was just not Francesco Aquilini's "guy." Where it was rumoured that FA was pressuring Nonis to make certain moves last year to bolster the team, Gillis seems to have his complete confidence.

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