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Roster moves -- February 28, 2009

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Old
02-28-2009, 05:35 PM
  #51
phlocky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
It would be the first time they've ever taken action on it to anyone, if I recall, if not it's happened once. To start going to the forfeiture of games and draft picks is just a tad over the top.
I think that only the Devils were ever over the cap. The league tried to come down on them but they found some loop-holes in the CBA. The league quickly closed those loop-holes and I think that those penalties were added AFTER or AS PART OF the closing of those loop-holes. The league would NOT let us get away with actually being over the cap limit. It's clear cut now, there is no playing with the roster by sending down players between games. Players sent down are now forbidden to practice with the parent club. NHL teams have to maintain a minimum active roster or I think at least 22 players not including players on LTIR.

The only thing that we COULD have done was to declare Briere still unfit for play. At that point the League would have had to file a greivence against the Flyers and try to get their own doctors to evaluate Briere and decide if he was truly still unfit for play. If that were the cae, fines and penalties could be levied retroactive, our staff doctors could lose their license, and as part of the penalties all medical evaluations of players would probably be done by league doctors in Toronto for a certain period of time while we were under restriction.

The point is we weren't getting around this.

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02-28-2009, 05:45 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by MountainHawk View Post
They probably would have started with a fine of $3-5M to the Flyers, and suspending Holmgren until after the trade deadline. The Flyers would still be allowed to make moves, but Holmgren could have NO contact with the Flyers.

The only way they go to the forfeit games is if you do it on a game day IMO, and the only way they go draft picks is if you aren't in the playoff race so the draft pick is more painful than the loss of a game.

I definitely think there would be a daily fine for every day we were over the cap. Also, any game we played over the cap would most likely be forfeitted because you can't simply let a team spend over the cap limit near the end of the season just so they can ice the best team and win the cup. I mean ****, Snider is rich beyond belief and if he wanted to fork over say 50 mil in fines to win the cup then so be it, he'd probably make up close to that in the playoffs, merchandise sales, and increased revenue the following year. I think draft picks would be forfeitted for teams NOT in the playoff hunt just so they don't use that as a way of tanking the end of the season just to get Taveres or Hedman.

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Old
02-28-2009, 06:30 PM
  #53
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People are really arguing that we wouldn't get in trouble for going over the cap, or cheating our way around it? This league has a HARD CAP. That would NOT FLY without question. Not even worth discussion

Oh and i'm 99% sure that in the case of going over the cap, the last transaction that put you over the cap is reversed. Not sure exactly what it would be in this scenario with IR, but we would definitely be sitting players and paying fines until we were compliant

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02-28-2009, 07:05 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by The Inebriator View Post
People are really arguing that we wouldn't get in trouble for going over the cap, or cheating our way around it? This league has a HARD CAP. That would NOT FLY without question. Not even worth discussion

Oh and i'm 99% sure that in the case of going over the cap, the last transaction that put you over the cap is reversed. Not sure exactly what it would be in this scenario with IR, but we would definitely be sitting players and paying fines until we were compliant
yea I 100% agree, im usually not a stickler for rules, but this is just a no brainer...

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03-01-2009, 02:52 AM
  #55
Rick Deckard
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You all look at the wrong problem all the time. We've never been over the cap so the league can't penalize us for being over the cap. The incident they said they will monitor was Briere's medical status and if he is on the LTIR whether he is healthy or not.

Obviously, Holmgren wants Briere playing in the playoffs. The league said they won't allow him to play in the playoffs if he doesn't play in the regular season before. Holmgren had to fit Briere under the cap before the trade deadline because afterwards the only possible moves are between the Flyers and Phantoms. Waiving Väänänen and Metropolit could have been done later, but with the same result, they wouldn't play another game for the Flyers due to being claimed or subject to re-entry waivers. That Timonen is still ill is a distraction, nothing more, and it is the only reason for the roster moves discussed at the start of the thread.

Fining a team for circumventing the cap isn't an option. It would undercut the real purpose of the cap. Once the league imposes a fine on one team it indirectly allows the other rich teams to go over the cap by only paying a fine. That kills the hard cap and you have a luxury tax similar to the MLB.

And as GKJ said, they allowed the Devils to keep Matvichuk on LTIR for most of the regular season, but they had to activate him with one game left. The same rules are imposed on us, we could have kept Briere on the LTIR until the 81st game, but if we want him to play in the playoffs we have to activate him for the 82nd game.

The only fine the league could have imposed on us was keeping Briere from playing in the playoffs, nothing else. By activating Briere now we avoided that.

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03-01-2009, 02:58 AM
  #56
Juicy Couturier*
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The flyers traded jones carle haetnell she a 3rd for jbo.





it'S quite possible that was me hilucinating

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Old
03-01-2009, 08:33 AM
  #57
DeadPhish5858
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
The flyers traded jones carle haetnell she a 3rd for jbo.





it'S quite possible that was me hilucinating

Haha, who's Haetnell She?

Sounds like you had a good night.

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Old
03-01-2009, 09:04 AM
  #58
GKJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phlocky View Post
I think that only the Devils were ever over the cap. The league tried to come down on them but they found some loop-holes in the CBA. The league quickly closed those loop-holes and I think that those penalties were added AFTER or AS PART OF the closing of those loop-holes. The league would NOT let us get away with actually being over the cap limit. It's clear cut now, there is no playing with the roster by sending down players between games. Players sent down are now forbidden to practice with the parent club. NHL teams have to maintain a minimum active roster or I think at least 22 players not including players on LTIR.

The only thing that we COULD have done was to declare Briere still unfit for play. At that point the League would have had to file a greivence against the Flyers and try to get their own doctors to evaluate Briere and decide if he was truly still unfit for play. If that were the cae, fines and penalties could be levied retroactive, our staff doctors could lose their license, and as part of the penalties all medical evaluations of players would probably be done by league doctors in Toronto for a certain period of time while we were under restriction.

The point is we weren't getting around this.
What loopholes? Matvichuk was healthy for half the season while he was on LTIR. The only loophole is that they didn't make him bring him off of it.

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Old
03-01-2009, 11:53 AM
  #59
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We used to send people back and forth all the time.

And I still think Vaananen + Metro was enough for briere, so this must be for the deadline or other moves aswell

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Old
03-01-2009, 12:24 PM
  #60
Dig Out Your Soul
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Originally Posted by Hovercraft View Post
We used to send people back and forth all the time.

And I still think Vaananen + Metro was enough for briere, so this must be for the deadline or other moves aswell
Vaananen and Metro was enough for Briere and then we'd be right up against the cap. But then we needed a 7th defenseman on the roster because Timonen is still out. Giroux will be back when Guenin is gone.

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