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Old
02-26-2009, 01:39 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Kritter471 View Post
Ideally, Robidas is a four, and I hope that some of the sophomore D develop enough that he can be that role next year. His upside is that he's cheap and he can eat minutes without a huge downgrade in play, like he is this year.
Ideally he's a five but four works too. All the things you said make him a great trade chip. A team gets a good guy for the playoffs and a very reasonable contract for next year too.

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The spreadsheet I keep of dmen stats, the one that makes Sydor look so damn bad, says Robidas is the best all-around defensemen the Stars have right now. He's lightyears ahead of Niskanen's defense and about equal offensively. He's about equal with Grossman defensively and lightyears ahead of him offensively. He's not a No. 1, or even a legit No. 2, but with so many spazzy sophomores this year (and, it follows, spazzy third year guys next year), his ability to eat minutes without hurting the team is a huge asset.
Grossman is never going to be an offensive guy. He really is Norstrom reincarnated on the Dallas blueline. I love him and hope he's back there for several years. Ideally he's your number two guy. Paired with a more offensively gifted defenseman who cleans up in front of his own net.

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Honestly, I'm scared this is the real Matt Niskanen, and that you'll need a guy of Robidas' ilk to take the minutes they'd hoped to give him. We've seen a season and a half of this from Niskanen and about a half season of pretty good. When does that start being the aberration instead of the expectation?
We've had this discussion before. I really think he's our Matt Carle and giving up on him early will bite us on the ass later. The best thing that could happen to him is to get away from Sydor. He needs a defensive guy. I'd love to see him and Fistric given a go for a few games. He's one of the reasons I'm also not really enamored of Wilson. His defensive coaching of the young guys leaves a lot to be desired.

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I would move one, but only one, of the three sophomores before I moved Robidas. Those guys will bring better return because of their age, and the Stars are struggling with so many guys at the same difficult developmental stage. Good teams have a range of ages, and the Stars D is, as a whole, way too young. D-men don't hit their stride until about Daley's age/experience, and in general, it's better to have a young guy or two, two or three veterans and two or three prime players. Without Robidas, this team is woefully lacking in "in their prime" defensemen.
Journeyman fours and fives can be found. Good young defenseman who are cheap and can grow can't be found as easily. Daley's had his struggles but he and Robidas have been good together and I'd rather pay him the extra money for the extra two years than Robidas. Again at 25 he hasn't even come into his prime as a defenseman in this league. Besides Dallas has to cut back somewhere, since most of our money is tied up in forwards the defense has to be cheaper or Turco has to be sent packing.

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And Lehtinen's absence had a huge impact on the team early this season. Almost as soon as he came back the defense and backchecking from the forwards, as a group, because markedly better. I didn't blame Turco for the sucking early, and I don't credit him fully for the improvement. The team D, from the forwards in particular, is eons better than it was early. And the Avery thing is so very impossible to sort out who was what and how it affected who. But I believe Lehtinen (and Ott's) return had a lot to do with the Stars' turnaround even as Morrow went out.
Lot's of things had to do with this team being awful. Morrow was suiting up and still they were terrible. I just think you're being overly generous to Jere. Again I like him but if I can give him up for 20 games (come the deadline) and get back a pick and prospect I don't hesitate. Well as long as the prospect and pick are good.

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Old
02-26-2009, 01:44 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by piqued1457 View Post
Doesn't Kassian seem like the prototypical Stars pick? They're probably very familiar with him through monitoring Korostin.

You don't trade any of Ott, Lehtinen, or Robidas. Come on. These are the players we need.
Kassian would be great. One of the Swedish defenseman like Rundblad wouldn't bother me either. I just am really averse to Ryan. 5'10" is over estimating his height.


As for players Dallas needs. Ribiero, Richards, Morrow, Eriksson, Neal, Brunnstrom, Grossman, Niskanen, Fistric, and Daley.

Ott almost kinda makes the list but I think his offense is an aberration and at the end of the day he's no more than a checking forward. Which has great value but he'll be a UFA after next year. That plays a role too.

Everyone else plays a supporting role to those guys. You can't build a roster of stars. Every team has support players. I'm saying you can sign your Sutherbys, Barchs, and Robidas or go find others elsewhere.

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Old
02-26-2009, 08:50 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Hull Fan View Post
And BigG44, I assume you're talking about Jared Cowen? Superstud? If only he'd fall to Dallas. Even with his injury I just can't picture him dropping that far down.
Yeah, I was going off of memory. All I could think of was J.

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Originally Posted by piqued1457 View Post
Doesn't Kassian seem like the prototypical Stars pick? They're probably very familiar with him through monitoring Korostin.

You don't trade any of Ott, Lehtinen, or Robidas. Come on. These are the players we need.
I've read Kassian is one of the more feared players in the OHL. I've also seen that his skating is an issue. With the way Chicago dominated the Stars this year, I hope they add some speed.

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Old
02-26-2009, 09:00 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Hull Fan View Post
Ott almost kinda makes the list but I think his offense is an aberration and at the end of the day he's no more than a checking forward. Which has great value but he'll be a UFA after next year. That plays a role too.
His offense is secondary, and he's more than a checking line player. Steve Ott puts Dallas on the PP more than the PK, and he can completely take superstar players out of their game (Thornton and Iginla say hi).

Hull and Jackson were right that they needed that type of player when the signed Sean Avery. The morons just forgot they already had that with Steve Ott.

Almost anything you trade Steve Ott for won't be as valuable as him still playing for the Stars. Agitators aren't hot commodities because the most part their a dime a dozen. The fact that Ott is the top in the league probably doesn't matter to most GM's.

Plus, Steve Ott is the type a player IMO who would take a less valuable deal to stay in Dallas. In 2010, these players will be very important. I could see some guys taking 1 year deals waiting for the cap to go higher (assuming it falls $6 million like predicted).

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02-26-2009, 02:06 PM
  #55
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I'd kill to draft Jordan Schroeder. He's perfect in that he's crafty with the puck whether he's shooting or passing, he's American right around the time Mike Modano will retire, and he seems like he'd be a great player. Especially with a lot of guys to make space for him on the Stars. I would give up a 3rd easily to get up to the top 10, that's an easy decision in this draft.

I think you're delusional if you think Lehtinen will garner a top pairing D-man by the way. I'd definitely call him a core player though, for his great defensive play and his occasional goals. I still don't think he's a top line RW though, he's too old and beaten for that. I hope Eriksson turns out to be as good as Jere Lehtinen was in his prime, that's be a great transition. Especially since Eriksson probably has better offensive skills too.

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02-26-2009, 05:10 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Silent Bob View Post
I'd kill to draft Jordan Schroeder. He's perfect in that he's crafty with the puck whether he's shooting or passing, he's American right around the time Mike Modano will retire, and he seems like he'd be a great player. Especially with a lot of guys to make space for him on the Stars. I would give up a 3rd easily to get up to the top 10, that's an easy decision in this draft.

I think you're delusional if you think Lehtinen will garner a top pairing D-man by the way. I'd definitely call him a core player though, for his great defensive play and his occasional goals. I still don't think he's a top line RW though, he's too old and beaten for that. I hope Eriksson turns out to be as good as Jere Lehtinen was in his prime, that's be a great transition. Especially since Eriksson probably has better offensive skills too.
....And you're delusional if you think our 1st plus a 3rd is all it would take to get into the top 10.

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02-26-2009, 05:23 PM
  #57
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....And you're delusional if you think our 1st plus a 3rd is all it would take to get into the top 10.
What do you know, you drink milk from a bag.

Do top 10 picks come in bags? Hmm...

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02-26-2009, 05:54 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by piqued1457 View Post
What do you know, you drink milk from a bag.

Do top 10 picks come in bags? Hmm...


I think the US should be the ones building towards proper milk consumption!

Bags are the way of the future!

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02-26-2009, 06:01 PM
  #59
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I have never heard of milk in bags before that thread

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02-26-2009, 06:06 PM
  #60
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Crazy Canadians. All of y'all are out of your minds and have no idea how to speak English.

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02-26-2009, 07:25 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by piqued1457 View Post
What do you know, you drink milk from a bag.

Do top 10 picks come in bags? Hmm...
We drink milk in bags???? Hmmm...news to me. Plastic jugs baby!!!

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02-26-2009, 08:25 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Modo View Post
....And you're delusional if you think our 1st plus a 3rd is all it would take to get into the top 10.
Haha yeah, I know this. I just know someone else mentioned that it only took a 3rd to go from 17th to 10th for some other team, but it's definitely not going to happen with this draft.

And by the way, in elementary schools they had milk in a bag in my cafeteria. I'm not a big fan of milk, but I refuse to drink milk in a bag.

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Old
03-02-2009, 09:17 AM
  #63
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This season is going straight to hell.
Never more true.

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Old
03-02-2009, 09:51 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Hull Fan View Post
How much of that has to do with the departure of Avery and the improved play of Turco? They don't get all the love because then they deserve the criticism because all of a sudden this team can't find an offense. RICHARDS stirs that drink. As he goes so go the others.
Fixed.

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03-02-2009, 09:56 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Hull Fan View Post
We've had this discussion before. I really think he's our Matt Carle and giving up on him early will bite us on the ass later.
Not that anyone is just going to give the Stars a No. 1 defenceman like Tampa Bay did with Boyle, but I don't think San Jose feels giving up on Carle bit them in the ass.

If someone wants Niskanen enough to cough up an established blueliner, I'm looking long and hard at that. We have no shortage of depth in that age group with Fistric, Grossman, and Vishnevsky even if Niskanen is more of a two-way guy.

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Old
03-02-2009, 01:46 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by BeaverSports View Post
Not that anyone is just going to give the Stars a No. 1 defenceman like Tampa Bay did with Boyle, but I don't think San Jose feels giving up on Carle bit them in the ass.

If someone wants Niskanen enough to cough up an established blueliner, I'm looking long and hard at that. We have no shortage of depth in that age group with Fistric, Grossman, and Vishnevsky even if Niskanen is more of a two-way guy.
San Jose may not miss him but Tampa Bay may regret giving up on him early. I just mean that at 22 Niskanen is hardly a finished product yet. Dallas shouldn't dump him unless the return is a guy like Kaberle.

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