HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Winnipeg Jets
Notices

tonight was an example

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-06-2009, 09:33 PM
  #1
John Cena*
12x WWE CHAMPION!!!!
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Country: United States
Posts: 11,527
vCash: 500
tonight was an example

of how good Kari can be when he has a defense in front of him and doesn't have to face 40 shots.

The defense has looked better recently.

John Cena* is offline  
Old
03-06-2009, 09:46 PM
  #2
Georgia Dawg
Registered User
 
Georgia Dawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Atlanta, GA
Country: United States
Posts: 2,629
vCash: 500
I am beginning to think you are a close relative of his. Or Lehtonen himself.

Georgia Dawg is offline  
Old
03-06-2009, 09:58 PM
  #3
John Cena*
12x WWE CHAMPION!!!!
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Country: United States
Posts: 11,527
vCash: 500
huh? why is this lol? cause i am telling the truth about him?

too many people think Lehtonen is the problem. But yet, he was never even close to being the problem.

John Cena* is offline  
Old
03-06-2009, 11:13 PM
  #4
Lux Aurumque*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: St. Albert, Alberta
Country: Norway
Posts: 15,653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgia Dawg View Post
I am beginning to think you are a close relative of his. Or Lehtonen himself.
This.

Maybe I bash Lehtonen a little bit too much, but tonight's game was a perfect example of the defensemen actually doing their job. It had much less to do with Kari than with the rest of the team. The 25 shots against were far below what we usually see from this team.

If Lehtonen really was this amazing goalie that you claim him to be, ASF, then it wouldn't matter if he faced 25 shots, or 40 shots, he'd still be allowing very few goals. You don't see Roberto Luongo, Mikka Kiprusoff, or Niklas Backstrom allowing the amount of goals that Kari allows when they get a lot of shots against.

Lux Aurumque* is offline  
Old
03-06-2009, 11:40 PM
  #5
BreakTheWallsDown
HFBoards Prospect
 
BreakTheWallsDown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Kennesaw, GA
Country: United States
Posts: 2,317
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to BreakTheWallsDown Send a message via MSN to BreakTheWallsDown
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lux Aurumque View Post
This.

Maybe I bash Lehtonen a little bit too much, but tonight's game was a perfect example of the defensemen actually doing their job. It had much less to do with Kari than with the rest of the team. The 25 shots against were far below what we usually see from this team.

If Lehtonen really was this amazing goalie that you claim him to be, ASF, then it wouldn't matter if he faced 25 shots, or 40 shots, he'd still be allowing very few goals. You don't see Roberto Luongo, Mikka Kiprusoff, or Niklas Backstrom allowing the amount of goals that Kari allows when they get a lot of shots against.
can't argue with much of what you said here. tonight's performance was caused mainly by our team playing incredible defense.

about the bolded part though, those are kinda bad examples since the teams those guys play for are much, MUCH better defensively and very rarely ever allow them to see 40 shots per game like our thrashers do so often when kari is in net. perhaps if luongo had to face 40 shots in almost every single game, he'd lay an egg too every once in a while and give up multiple cheap goals in a game.

there really is only one way to test the theory though, and the way it has to start is by getting the thrashers to play consistent defense night after night. if that happens and kari still has games where he is just off, then we know something is wrong. if we can play better D and he starts dominating every night like he has been doing for us lately, then maybe that proves that his off games are just a product of having a workload that is much too severe to handle.

BreakTheWallsDown is offline  
Old
03-07-2009, 01:05 AM
  #6
blankspace6
 
blankspace6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Country: Georgia
Posts: 556
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lux Aurumque View Post
You don't see Roberto Luongo, Mikka Kiprusoff, or Niklas Backstrom allowing the amount of goals that Kari allows when they get a lot of shots against.
Feel free to do the math. Kari sees more shots per 60 minutes than any other starter in the league. The average for all the goalies you just listed is 30 shots per game with Luongo being the exception at 29. Kari sees an average of 34 per game. Those numbers add up quick when stretched out over 40-50+ games.

blankspace6 is offline  
Old
03-07-2009, 07:00 AM
  #7
jbreiner
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 121
vCash: 500
Why not compare Kari to Luongo's Florida numbers. I doubt anyone would argue he had a great defense in front of him then.

jbreiner is offline  
Old
03-07-2009, 10:14 AM
  #8
Tommy Hawk
Registered User
 
Tommy Hawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 3,380
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbreiner View Post
Why not compare Kari to Luongo's Florida numbers. I doubt anyone would argue he had a great defense in front of him then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lux Aurumque View Post
This.

Maybe I bash Lehtonen a little bit too much, but tonight's game was a perfect example of the defensemen actually doing their job. It had much less to do with Kari than with the rest of the team. The 25 shots against were far below what we usually see from this team.

If Lehtonen really was this amazing goalie that you claim him to be, ASF, then it wouldn't matter if he faced 25 shots, or 40 shots, he'd still be allowing very few goals. You don't see Roberto Luongo, Mikka Kiprusoff, or Niklas Backstrom allowing the amount of goals that Kari allows when they get a lot of shots against.
Your math doesn't make sense. Luongo has a save percent in his career of about .92 and he has been consistent with that number even in Florida. Kiprusoff about 91. Backstrom, so far, about 92. Lehtonen about 91.

So, over the course of a game, if a goalie with a 90 save percentage faces 30 shots, they give up 3 goals. If they face 40 they give up 4. So if their offense scores 3 goals per game and the goalie is on a team that gives up 40 shots they lose where if they only allow 30 shots, they tie, go into overtime and have a chance to win there or in the shootout.

The the big base components of teams winning or losing are the goals your teams scores per game and the goals they allow. The three big components of the goals being allowed is scoring chances, shots allowed, and save percent. In my example above, a team that score 3 goals per game can use a goalie with an 85 save percentage and get the same results as a 90 save percent if they only face 20 shots instead of 30 and a goalie with an 80 save percent facing 20 shots gives you the same result as a goalie with a 90 save percent facing 40 shots.

So which goalie would you rather have, 80 save percent or 91-92?

Tommy Hawk is offline  
Old
03-08-2009, 12:15 AM
  #9
Lux Aurumque*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: St. Albert, Alberta
Country: Norway
Posts: 15,653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by illusion856 View Post
can't argue with much of what you said here. tonight's performance was caused mainly by our team playing incredible defense.

about the bolded part though, those are kinda bad examples since the teams those guys play for are much, MUCH better defensively and very rarely ever allow them to see 40 shots per game like our thrashers do so often when kari is in net. perhaps if luongo had to face 40 shots in almost every single game, he'd lay an egg too every once in a while and give up multiple cheap goals in a game.

there really is only one way to test the theory though, and the way it has to start is by getting the thrashers to play consistent defense night after night. if that happens and kari still has games where he is just off, then we know something is wrong. if we can play better D and he starts dominating every night like he has been doing for us lately, then maybe that proves that his off games are just a product of having a workload that is much too severe to handle.
I do agree that Lehtonen would do better on a team with a better defense, however, I have to disagree with your first statement about Luongo. Luongo's save percentage in Florida was .920, whereas Lehtonen's save percentage in Atlanta is .912. Yes, .008 isn't a huge difference in a short span of time, but in the term of a full season, it certainly does make a big difference.

I've said from the beginning, Lehtonen just doesn't work for this team. Sure, he has a huge amount of potential, but he will NEVER achieve that potential in Atlanta. I honestly think that we'd be better to pick up a decent veteran, maybe someone like Dwayne Roloson, for next season, and have a 1a/1b rotation with him and Pavelec, while trading Lehtonen for a high value forward prospect. Pavelec oozes potential, and already has a hand up on Lehtonen by not being as weak mentally, which, as we have often seen while watching this team, results in so many weak goals against.

I think Lehtonen is a bit of a flavour of the month right now, because he's really been on his game. At this time, one year ago, people were whining about Lehtonen. I guess it's just the Atlanta model of a sports fanatic. The same kind of thing happens with the Braves and the Falcons. When they're doing good, everybody praises them. When they're doing bad, everybody on the team sucks (Thankfully, the fans don't do that with Kovalchuk, because he seems to never have a bad stretch). I'm not insulting the fans at all. Note that I've heard this stuff about fans in Atlanta from the fans themselves.

Lux Aurumque* is offline  
Old
03-08-2009, 04:34 AM
  #10
blankspace6
 
blankspace6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Country: Georgia
Posts: 556
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lux Aurumque View Post
I think Lehtonen is a bit of a flavour of the month right now, because he's really been on his game. At this time, one year ago, people were whining about Lehtonen.
Are you sure about that? http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/statis...s=all&split=47
This stats page may tell otherwise. Kari put up a .925 SV% for the Month of March last year.

You do this to yourself over and over again. If you'd do some research before you went spouting off on some rant, you'd probably have a lot more credibility.

blankspace6 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:27 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.