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Line Changes: Avery up, Naslund down

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Old
03-11-2009, 02:31 PM
  #26
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Nice to see another hockey market figuring out that Naslund sucks it bad. Sorry you have another year of this sucking though. No team will ever win with that guy wearing a letter -

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03-11-2009, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billyH2O View Post
Avery has been playing well. You know? When he leaves it all on the ice, and doesn't be a huge attention grabber... he's not that horrible. I like him just being the feisty winger out there, as opposed to the vogue-interning, trash-talking, in your face player.
Ya know, I like you.

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03-11-2009, 02:40 PM
  #28
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I don't think Naslund was reprimanded or something. Avery was to play back with Gomez to begin with, but was placed on 3rd for the obvious political reasons and to be examined. Sean passed it well. It is also obvious that Naslund has no chemistry with Gomez (who does?) and may be very good with youngsters. Good move.

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03-11-2009, 02:42 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by 94now View Post
I don't think Naslund was reprimanded or something. Avery was to play back with Gomez to begin with, but was placed on 3rd for the obvious political reasons and to be examined. Sean passed it well. It is also obvious that Naslund has no chemistry with Gomez (who does?) and may be very good with youngsters. Good move.
Gionta

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Old
03-11-2009, 02:56 PM
  #30
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I'd like to see an Avery-Dubi-Zherdev line similar to the line last year with Jagr. That line would be pretty successful IMO.

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Old
03-11-2009, 03:04 PM
  #31
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I was really liking the Avery-Korpedo-Cally line. Fast, hard hitting, and getting chances.

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Old
03-11-2009, 03:14 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by NYRFAN218 View Post
I'd like to see an Avery-Dubi-Zherdev line similar to the line last year with Jagr. That line would be pretty successful IMO.
Wasn't there a reasonably successful Avery-Gomez-Jagr line? Maybe I'm just hallucinating...

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03-11-2009, 03:18 PM
  #33
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It was Avery-Gomez-Shanahan, although Jarg was tried there (whatever Renney tried with Gomez!), but with little success.

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03-11-2009, 03:29 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by we want cup View Post
Wasn't there a reasonably successful Avery-Gomez-Jagr line? Maybe I'm just hallucinating...
Pretty sure it was Avery-Dubinsky-Jagr

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Old
03-11-2009, 03:45 PM
  #35
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He was just a body to hold the spot for Antropov until tomorrow.
I hope Antropov didnt hurt his knee. He landed on it last game and looked in pain when he fell.. Keeping fingers crossed

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Old
03-11-2009, 03:45 PM
  #36
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I think Antripov's big body should be playing center setting up screens and getting in the face of defenders. Although, he doesn't strike me as a very aggressive agitating players in the 3 games thus far.

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Old
03-11-2009, 04:36 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by HockeyBasedNYC View Post
I know Naslund cares out there and he wants to win, but sometimes it just looks like hes skating in mud. I just dont think he has to foot speed anymore and has lost a major step. Those Nucks fans in the summer werent kidding.
I agree 100% with the quoted part.

We are getting what we paid for. I don't know if Näslund is worn out or if its age, but he just isn't fast anymore.

And when it comes to talk about him floating, I wonder if he isn't working harder here then he ever have in his career. You got to wonder if thoose who thinks that he doesn't care ever have seen him play before he came to NY, or if they just saw a (former) MVP (Lester...) and thought he would be the 2nd comming of AO... (like always when some big name signs in NY)

I don't for a second think Näslund is "punished" by beeing sent to the 3rd line. I think a smaller role fits him allot better. In another thread about next season I proposed that he should be put on the 3rd line for that reason atleast. Because of our shortness on the 1st line, Näslund is forced to be responsible for areas that he just not even remotely should be go into. On far to many shifts a 36 y/o Näslund is forced the be the 1st man in on the forecheck and try to create offense of turnovers -- playing against the best players on the other team. Its not strange that he takes some penaltys, he is clearly not up for that. Its better to have a Avery in that role and realize that we don't "1st line material" on this team.

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03-11-2009, 04:41 PM
  #38
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im liking torts being in control of this team. this smacks of changes based upon recent effort. guys are going get more time both on what line they start on and how much they play during the game. i like that.

naslund has slumped recently, he may be wearing down. top 6 minutes may be too much at this stage of the season. he still needs his pp minutes but at even strength he may need a blow playing in this uptempo system.

i have no problem with avery moving up. other than his stupid borderline penalties, hes been one of our best players in every game hes played. he brings it and in this system, hes going to score goals with his speed.

honestly, the one guy who i think has really played well lately and gets no love is freddie shoes. the guy can flat out fly and he creates with that speed. i would love to see him play on the 3rd line and flip flop with say, korpedo- who hasnt had a good stretch. i just think freddie has better hands then hes given credit for. he can beat any dman wide if he gets some speed on the edge. fast is good and hes very fast.

a line of dubinski cally and freddie would be sweet.

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Old
03-11-2009, 04:44 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
See i disagree there a bit, lack of effort results in hooking and tripping penalties IMO (of course not ALL but the ones he takes...)..If he knows he going to be a step behind someone then he's got to make the effort to lean the body into them, not be caught flat footed and reach his stick out. Or just let them go around. He's not the last line of defense and him letting them go around most likely inst creating an odd man rush. Smart penalties are one thing but his arent that type.
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
Doesn't help either that for such a soft player, hes 4th on the team in minor penalties(so those aren't roughing, crosschecking, elbowing, boarding type penalties)...we know what type those are.
Yeah, we know what type of penaltys they are. They come from a player on a 1st line who is expected to score -- or make that forced to score for this team to avg more then 1 goal a game -- but who instead most of the time is skating around chasing the puck all over the ice. Because his and his linemates shortcommings. Against the best players on the other team.

The result is that player gooing into defensive plays high up ice that he have no buisnis gooing into to start with. To win any of thoose defensive plays you need to hack and whack some. Its more desperation then floating if anything.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:03 PM
  #40
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If Voros has to play, I'd rather see him on the 4th line in limited minutes.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:10 PM
  #41
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I love how people are criticizing Naslund and praising Avery, and praising Torts for demanding "accountability".

If it had been Renney, he would have been criticized for changing the lines. And I guess memories are selective. No one remembers Avery costing us 2 power plays against carolina? That should be rewarded? Everyone ragged on Girardi because of an errant play with his stick against boston. Avery's penalties were worse IMO, because it was 2 bad plays rather than 1.

But whatever. People will read whatever they want into the line changes.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:14 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Ola View Post
Yeah, we know what type of penaltys they are. They come from a player on a 1st line who is expected to score -- or make that forced to score for this team to avg more then 1 goal a game -- but who instead most of the time is skating around chasing the puck all over the ice. Because his and his linemates shortcommings. Against the best players on the other team.

The result is that player gooing into defensive plays high up ice that he have no buisnis gooing into to start with. To win any of thoose defensive plays you need to hack and whack some. Its more desperation then floating if anything.

The amount of offense Naslund brings (or lack of), does not give him leeyway to not have to play defense too, like Jagr was given from time to time. So that point is pretty moot IMO. He is expected to play in the defensive end just like everyone else on the team is. So he has a lot of business being there. Just because he is not very good at is doesn't give him a free pass. He's not scoring 90 points anymore.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:15 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
Pretty sure it was Avery-Dubinsky-Jagr
I believe it was.


I've been hoping since the start of the season that a team will find value in Naslund for 3 million a year. There are many teams that are real money first and cap second in terms of finances and I'd be happy to see Naslund playing for one of them next year.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:15 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
I love how people are criticizing Naslund and praising Avery, and praising Torts for demanding "accountability".

If it had been Renney, he would have been criticized for changing the lines. And I guess memories are selective. No one remembers Avery costing us 2 power plays against carolina? That should be rewarded? Everyone ragged on Girardi because of an errant play with his stick against boston. Avery's penalties were worse IMO, because it was 2 bad plays rather than 1.

But whatever. People will read whatever they want into the line changes.
although averys penalties were ill timed, hes showing enormous heart and passion. the penalties were bad but again, if its not sean avery, are they even called?

hes exactly what this team needs more of minus the weak penalties.

im sorry, girardis play has been weak for over 2 months. nothin new there.

torts just needs to split up the lipstick ladies- rozy and redden. keep them away from the pp and limit their time against other top lines.

as for nazy, he seems to be wearing down. he has no wheels and he may need fewer minutes in this new system.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:25 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Ola View Post
The result is that player gooing into defensive plays high up ice that he have no buisnis gooing into to start with. To win any of thoose defensive plays you need to hack and whack some. Its more desperation then floating if anything.
Wouldn't this be true for every offensive player on this team? If it were, wouldn't it push him more into the middle of the pack in penalties?

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although averys penalties were ill timed, hes showing enormous heart and passion. the penalties were bad but again, if its not sean avery, are they even called?
I thought exactly that on the interference call against him late in one game and for the chop on the legs as he fell down to the ice. Avery has zero leeway right now as I'm sure many want to make his life as miserable as possible because of their disdain for him.

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as for nazy, he seems to be wearing down. he has no wheels and he may need fewer minutes in this new system.
Often older players are better off with less ice time and more days off, especially towards dog days of the season....Hockey really is like life. In life you start and end in diapers, bald, and having someone else feed you. In Hockey you start and end a career with minimal ice time and fighting to show your worth. There are always exceptions but many go the way of Gary Roberts.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:27 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
Pretty sure it was Avery-Dubinsky-Jagr
I know that incarnation was successful, but for some reason I thought it briefly featured Gomez in the middle.... guess I'm wrong. Oh well...

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:28 PM
  #47
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Do any of you guys ever watch teh games? Naslund is definitely not slow for a man his age. He seems to float around at times during the game, but he still backchecks.
I agree. The same problem with Shannahan might hold true with Naslund. I remember when Shanny was here and people were saying how slow and unproductive he was getting. Then everyone seemed to realize that the problem was he lost a step and couldn't keep up with the younger guys. He needs to play fewer games.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:35 PM
  #48
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I'm glad he split up Rosie and Redden, they were horrible together

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:41 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
The amount of offense Naslund brings (or lack of), does not give him leeyway to not have to play defense too, like Jagr was given from time to time. So that point is pretty moot IMO. He is expected to play in the defensive end just like everyone else on the team is. So he has a lot of business being there. Just because he is not very good at is doesn't give him a free pass. He's not scoring 90 points anymore.
Eh what?

That wasn't exactly what I wrote fly.

Many shifts the only way for that line to create any offense have been to strip D's of the puck. Most of the time, they aren't in a position to strip the D of the puck. Näslund isn't exactly a speedster anymore. The results are that inorder to get involved at all fly, Näslund have to whack and hack some. I don't know where you got 90 pts from, Näslund is on pace to score like 25 goals and 50 pts.

I am not saying that its well advised, we saw the same tendancys from JJ last season. But I think its ridiculos to say that he is taking penaltys because he is "floating", its more frustration that comes form trying to score at a pace that he isn't able to do anymore.

And I also don't get the talk about that he should be held accountable because he is floating, you say that he can't do it anymore because he isn't a 90 pts player anymore. Well, if this was all he could bring in his prime when he was scoring 90 pts -- what exactly did anyone think he would bring when he is 36 y/o?

If I want more from this team I would look at someone like Brandon Dubinsky. He is outworked every night by Ryan Callahan. Ryan Callahan is more physicaly then him every single night basically. Brandon Dubinsky have been voted "Biggest pest" in the WHL twice. In the AHL, Brandon Dubinsky was always more feisty and physical then Ryan Callahan. This season in the NHL though, Dubinsky is playing like he is as talented as a young Mike Modano. Thats a player IMO that should be expected to work harder and be more feisty. Not a 36 y/o slow scoring winger who never in his career have been more physical then he is now. And who in his prime, had to have someone like Bert do the dirty work for him. Even in his prime, without someone like Bert I think its doubtful that Näslund would have scored 70 pts. He did it darn well in the right enivorment, but he have never been that mega talented player who could do it by himself.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:43 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
I love how people are criticizing Naslund and praising Avery, and praising Torts for demanding "accountability".

If it had been Renney, he would have been criticized for changing the lines. And I guess memories are selective. No one remembers Avery costing us 2 power plays against carolina? That should be rewarded? Everyone ragged on Girardi because of an errant play with his stick against boston. Avery's penalties were worse IMO, because it was 2 bad plays rather than 1.

But whatever. People will read whatever they want into the line changes.
i agree, avery hurt the team against carolina and almost KILLED us against boston with that last minute penalty. If boston scores there, people are having different discussions today.

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