HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

Ot Nedved Signs With Phoenix

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-28-2004, 10:59 AM
  #26
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 20,486
vCash: 500
Barnaby...

I don't know where this came from 'So you have never heard of a defenseman with above-average offensive skills'. I say I don't know where you get the idea that Tanabe has above-average offensive skills...I also just say he's a #5/6, a different thought, mind you. Tanabe has average to below average offensive skills. That's my only point there.

AG...like I said, they're going from basement-dweller/lottery pick-land to playoff contender, IMO, and not Stanley Cup contender. There's a decent mix, but like I mentioned, I believe Hull will contribute, but still is on the wrong side of 40 and you can't expect too much. He's not going to lead anybody anywhere. Ricci too, I believe, is slowing down, as are a few other 'key' guys including O'Donnell and Hulse. It's a good lineup, but Stanley Cup contending is a phrase with which I have a little trouble.

And Barnaby...never said I wouldn't want Doan...but he's not Forsberg, Hejdk, Yzerman, [Modano, who should turn things around], Naslund, [Bertuzzi, if he plays again], and many others who are a notch above, and those are the teams PHX will compete against.

Fletch is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 06:51 AM
  #27
melisa
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 88
vCash: 500
True. Do you even have a clue how old Hull is? Not to mention he went from a team that has a long history of keeping old players productive to a team that is poorly run. Talk to me at the end of the season. You will see Hull with a huge minus ratio with maybe 20 goals and 35 points. That's it.

As for Tanabe. I love how guys on this board rip a prospect like Wiseman and trash players like Poti and Ortmeyer yet praise a guy in Tanabe who is terrible defensively and has done jack points wise for a guy with all this offensive skill

Does anybody look at production anymore? Guy has had 16,13 and 12 points the last 3 years going a combined -35. Last year he was hurt. He is poor defensively. We have people on this board trash Poti left and right. Poti the last 3 years 25,48 and 24 points with a -17

Yet Tanabe is a solid 5th defenseman and Poti is a pile of garbage.

Oh that cracks me up. We have so many fans here that are so bitter on this team that can't look at anything objectively. All these other teams players are solid yet our players stink. If you are so bitter go jump on the Devil bandwagon. This team has had no commitment to youth and no coaching the past few years. Look at players like Zidlicky, Ekman, Petrovicky and Doig. Look how well they did when they left here. Maybe we should stop praising other teams old players and below average players and believe that we have the talent here if we just play it.

I mean, True is saying Hull who is 40 YEARS OLD and is going to a crappy team isn't washed up yet Wiseman who is a guy despite getting better each year in the AHL, has no chance of being a decent pro. Pathetic.

It's almost mind boggling to see this board praising a complete bust like Tanabe who has done nothing offensively in his career and has stunk defensively in his career while Poti is the second coming of Kamensky.

melisa is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 07:22 AM
  #28
True Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,669
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by melisa
True. Do you even have a clue how old Hull is? Not to mention he went from a team that has a long history of keeping old players productive to a team that is poorly run. Talk to me at the end of the season. You will see Hull with a huge minus ratio with maybe 20 goals and 35 points. That's it.
I mean, True is saying Hull who is 40 YEARS OLD and is going to a crappy team isn't washed up yet Wiseman who is a guy despite getting better each year in the AHL, has no chance of being a decent pro. Pathetic.

It's almost mind boggling to see this board praising a complete bust like Tanabe who has done nothing offensively in his career and has stunk defensively in his career while Poti is the second coming of Kamensky.
Let's get some things squared right off the bat, shall weA? Never did I say that Wiseman has no chance at being a decent pro. All I said was that right now, the kid is a fringe 4th liner on all other NHL teams. Sure, he could develop and his numbers have improved with every level of competition. But how could can he still turn out to be, that is the question. I just do not see much potential past the hard-working 3rd/4th liner type. And we have those types in waves.
Now, onto Hull. I would say that I have a pretty good clue as to how old he is, judging by the fact that latter on in your post you say that I mentioned that he is 40. If you already know the answer, then why ask the question. You said that the guy was washed up. Period. I asked you for an explanation about how a guy who has scored no less than 24 goals in each of his full seasons in the NHL is washed up. Period. How a guy who has only scored under 30 goals 4 times is washed up. Period. How a guy who has only twice scored under 27 goals is washed up. Period. If you are going to make such blanket statements, you have to be able to back them up with something factual. Do you have anything that will back up your statement? Can you show a trend perhaps? Some other astute analysis, besides saying Period?
As for the Tanabe debate, no one is saying that he deserves mounds of praise. All people are saying is that he is a 3rd pairing defenseman. And Poti is what Poti is. A gifted player who shows no aptititude whatsoever for defense. An offenseman who shrugs off his defensive responsibilities because he is an "offensive guy". A defenseman whom not 5 coaches nor 3 GM's have been able to play a lick of defense.

True Blue is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 09:32 AM
  #29
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 20,486
vCash: 500
Tb...

I'm not convinced that Hull's going to flourish in Phoenix, personally. He played well last season and for the most part, played on a second line. I think how well he does this season depend son what role he plays. I think he does best on a second line, away from checkers, away from top defensemen. But if Nedved is on that second line, I don't see him meshing well with Nedved as Nedved, to me, is not crafty enough to get him the puck where he's used to getting it, which has made him successful (he's done well while playing with some pretty decent playmakers). I actually like Hull and two seasons ago wasn't totally against bringing him in to play with Lindros, as I did think he had a couple more seasons in him.

Fletch is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 09:36 AM
  #30
Vic Rattlehead*
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: St-Hubert, Quebec
Country: Canada
Posts: 40,788
vCash: 500
Maybe you Ranger fans should actually ASK how coyotes fans feel about Tanabe. Stats mean JACK SQUAT sometimes. Tanabe is more than a #5-6 defenceman in ranger fans eyes.


EDIT---- pair Tanabe with one of Hulse, O'donnel, or Gauthier, and I'm sure Tanabe won't have as much defensive mistakes.

Vic Rattlehead* is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 09:50 AM
  #31
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 20,486
vCash: 500
I do believe...

only one poster was basing opinions on stats alone. Others, I believe, are basing opinions on what they saw.

Fletch is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 10:10 AM
  #32
True Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,669
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
I'm not convinced that Hull's going to flourish in Phoenix, personally.
Actually, I am not convinced that he will either. However, to say that he is washed up is erroneous. Him and Nedved COULD work, however. Petr's stats would have looked a lot better if Hlavac could have hit the broad side of a barn. He couldn't and they didn't. Hull will finish what Hlavac could not.

True Blue is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 12:20 PM
  #33
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,342
vCash: 500
Awards:
Not all that surprising that Nedved signed in PHX. Gretzky has always been a Nedved supporter and Barnett was Nedved's agent.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 05:06 PM
  #34
melisa
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 88
vCash: 500
Phoenix fans live in the sand. Like they know hockey. LOL. Tanabe stinks. Period.

Hull won't do jack away from Detroit

At the end of the year you will see.

melisa is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 05:15 PM
  #35
barnaby63
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Long Island
Posts: 860
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by melisa
Phoenix fans live in the sand. Like they know hockey. LOL. Tanabe stinks. Period.

Hull won't do jack away from Detroit

At the end of the year you will see.
Do you say anything else besides period?

barnaby63 is offline  
Old
08-29-2004, 05:44 PM
  #36
melisa
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 88
vCash: 500
Yeah but I would get banned for it here.


If Tanabe had the exact same year on the Rangers as he had in Phoenix he would get trashed worse the Poti did. People in Phoenix know little about hockey and don't care if players aren't great. If you play for the Rangers you are under a microscope all the time.

I loathe Poti but you would have to be on drugs to trade him for a bust like Tanabe

melisa is offline  
Old
08-31-2004, 02:57 AM
  #37
edmontonoilers89
Registered User
 
edmontonoilers89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,250
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by melisa
Yeah but I would get banned for it here.

People in Phoenix know little about hockey and don't care if players aren't great.
Why don't you stop talking out of your ass? You seem to know less than the person you're debating with. He's trying to make an argument and you're rebuking with "oh well, people in phoenix don't know anything anyway."

Get off your stereotypes. No wonder this board is going down the crapper lately.

I personally think Phoenix will contend for a playoff spot if they can find a good coach and their goaltending stays adequate. I don't see them higher than 5th, even with the group they have simply because I don't know if the team will develop chemistry fast enough with all the new acquisitions. But they could seriously make a splash.

edmontonoilers89 is offline  
Old
08-31-2004, 07:45 AM
  #38
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 20,486
vCash: 500
You're right, TB...

in regards to calling Hull 'washed-up'. Although I think the meaning of him being washed-up and other players being washed-up could be different. Meaning, if he scores less than 20 goals, he is washed-up. It's a tough one to call, although if played properly, he can be a contributor, but I don't think anyone should expect 25-30 goals out of him, nor do I believe that over the long-haul, he should be facing top defensive alignments.

One thing I don't believe, though, is that he and Nedved would mesh well together, as I previously stated. I don't think the styles will be best-suited and I don't think Nedved is a crafty playmaker, which I believe is the type of player with whom Hull has the most success. Much like Nedved and Kovalev played horribly together because of the incompatible styles, I think the same could possibly be said for Petr and Brett too.

Fletch is offline  
Old
08-31-2004, 08:44 AM
  #39
True Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,669
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
but I don't think anyone should expect 25-30 goals out of him, nor do I believe that over the long-haul, he should be facing top defensive alignments.

One thing I don't believe, though, is that he and Nedved would mesh well together, as I previously stated. I don't think the styles will be best-suited and I don't think Nedved is a crafty playmaker, which I believe is the type of player with whom Hull has the most success.
Last year was only the 2nd year he scored less than 27 goals. If he can score in the 20-25 range, I would not say that he is washed up. I agree that he should not be facing top defensive assignments, nor do I think he will be. That will be Doan's job. For better or worse, I believe that he WILL be paired with Petr, at least until they prove to be ineffective. Is Nedved overly creative? No, certainly not in an Adam Oates style. However, let's recall how many opportunities we've seen Hlavac & Devorak squander because they could not put the puck into an ocean. Now, if we take your theory of "similar and disimilar styles", they one could say that they were in an opportunity becuase of their similar styles with Nedved. They just could not finish. But I would tend to think Hull will also do what Hlavac & Devo could not. He WILL be able to grab a rebound and convert it, whereas neither Hlavac nor Devo could ever be found within 5 ft. of the net.

True Blue is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:23 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.