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The Post Kovalev Era

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Old
03-21-2009, 09:28 AM
  #251
m00ks
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Originally Posted by LostMyGlasses View Post

Who's getting paid the big $$$?

Who's the veteran and Stanley Cup winner with the most experience?


Who's wearing an 'A' on their sweater?

Who is Captain when Koivu is injured?
Oh what a crock of *****. Andrei's been brutal and he stood out even before getting reunited with Kovalev. The kid's getting paid 3.2 million per season, he should start earning that money regardless of his linemates. If not in point production but at least, the very least in effort. He's skating like a tourist with amnesia.

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03-21-2009, 09:56 AM
  #252
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
Oh what a crock of *****. Andrei's been brutal and he stood out even before getting reunited with Kovalev. The kid's getting paid 3.2 million per season, he should start earning that money regardless of his linemates. If not in point production but at least, the very least in effort. He's skating like a tourist with amnesia.
And that excuses Kovalev how exactly?

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03-21-2009, 09:59 AM
  #253
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Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
And that excuses Kovalev how exactly?
who's talking about Kovalev? I was talking about someone making an excuse for Akost.

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03-21-2009, 10:02 AM
  #254
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
who's talking about Kovalev? I was talking about someone making an excuse for Akost.
This thread is about Kovalev, not Kostitsyn. Not that he hasn't been brutal either, but there's already a seperate thread about him being benched.

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03-21-2009, 10:11 AM
  #255
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Originally Posted by smon View Post
This thread is about Kovalev, not Kostitsyn. Not that he hasn't been brutal either, but there's already a seperate thread about him being benched.
Lmao, what's your point. Conversations often go off on a tangent, that's a regular occurrence on msg boards. Who died and gave you badge?

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03-21-2009, 10:14 AM
  #256
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
Lmao, what's your point. Conversations often go off on a tangent, that's a regular occurrence on msg boards. Who died and gave you badge?


Well, criticize or support Kovalev now or get outta here

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03-21-2009, 10:20 AM
  #257
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
who's talking about Kovalev? I was talking about someone making an excuse for Akost.
YOU were accusing LostMyGlasses' comment saying that what he was saying about making the big dollars was a crock of ****! Since the topic is on Kovalev and it was comparing to Kostitsyn, you were referring to his comment being a crock of ****, excusing Kovalev.

No one here is saying that Kostitsyn is playing up to par, we're talking about living up to your experience and salary. Kovalev is part of that!

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03-21-2009, 10:36 AM
  #258
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Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
YOU were accusing LostMyGlasses' comment saying that what he was saying about making the big dollars was a crock of ****! Since the topic is on Kovalev and it was comparing to Kostitsyn, you were referring to his comment being a crock of ****, excusing Kovalev.

No one here is saying that Kostitsyn is playing up to par, we're talking about living up to your experience and salary. Kovalev is part of that!
My post before LostMyGlasses quoted me was responding to a merged thread from the last game. My initial response was driven by someone calling for Kovalev's head following a game when the whole line sucked magnificently, most noticeably AKost. If me saying that the whole line sucked (which cannot be argued) is excusing Kovalev to some, then lol fine. But then in doing so, those same people are blaming Kovalev for Price's horrible showing.

Living up to experience and salary? I think Kovalev's doing fine if spoken in the same breath as Koivu, Hammer and Schneider.

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03-21-2009, 10:48 AM
  #259
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
Living up to experience and salary? I think Kovalev's doing fine if spoken in the same breath as Koivu, Hammer and Schneider.
Again, attempting to diffuse the blame on Kovalev by shining the light on others who aren't performing to expectations (or to their salary). No one here is saying that only Kovalev doesn't perform to expectations, but he simply isn't.

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03-21-2009, 12:06 PM
  #260
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Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
Again, attempting to diffuse the blame on Kovalev by shining the light on others who aren't performing to expectations (or to their salary). No one here is saying that only Kovalev doesn't perform to expectations, but he simply isn't.
Sorry man, I just don't buy into the notion that Kovalev is the root of all evil. You say I'm attempting to diffuse the blame on Kovalev, all I'm saying is there's a lot of room under that spotlight.
Expectations of Kovy is to be a ppg player even though he isn't getting paid for it. That's not to say he couldn't do any better but that goes for 90% of that team. People are expecting him to single handedly carry this team to the SC. That ain't right when you have other players on the roster not living up to their roles.

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03-21-2009, 02:52 PM
  #261
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
Expectations of Kovy is to be a ppg player even though he isn't getting paid for it.
Correction: Expectations of Kovy giving a more constant effort game in, game out. Results would come if/when he does that as it was clearly proven last year.

Proof? Koivu who's not taking as much heat because he's giving the effort in spite of the net results not always being there.

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03-21-2009, 03:04 PM
  #262
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It is baffeling to me that there are so many of you (not really) scapegoat seeking anti-christ fans out there. But I'm confident most of you reside on these boards. Here's a message to the majority. No one cares about the opinions of sellout hacks like yourselves. And WE know who you are. Incoming trolls bash and faceroll keyboards plz.

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Old
03-21-2009, 03:30 PM
  #263
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Originally Posted by CaptainKoivu11 View Post
It is baffeling to me that there are so many of you (not really) scapegoat seeking anti-christ fans out there. But I'm confident most of you reside on these boards. Here's a message to the majority. No one cares about the opinions of sellout hacks like yourselves. And WE know who you are. Incoming trolls bash and faceroll keyboards plz.
Good job dear fairweathered fan, now let the fair-minded fans talk.

--------------------------------------------------

What some people can't understand is, Kovalev is not the root of all evil on this team, but he isn't part of the solution. He led the team last season, I admit I was in love with him, but despite proving me wrong for one season (after the terrible 06-07 campaign), he has reverted back to being an inconsistent player making way too many mistakes and not giving much of an effort on numerous occassions. I don't want to sign him this offseason hoping he will come back stronger.

I can understand the argument that Kovalev is indeed one of our best players, but in reality, if he's your best player, what does that say about our team? I honestly think this team needs better role players but also other pieces not named Kovalev or Koivu. I'd like to see Koivu come back for old times sake, but both these players aren't impacting the team. If they played lesser roles, we may not have to point out their failures, but truth be told, you can't have Kovalev or Koivu playing lesser roles without replacing one or the either or both.

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03-21-2009, 03:35 PM
  #264
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what happens is that we go back to that time pre 2004 when the habs had no game breakers. During kovalev`s 4 plus years in montreal, gainey has failed to find another game breaker to pass the torch to.

Kovalev is obviously maddening to watch but the fact of the matter is that he`s the only guy on our team with game breaking abilities, and although letting him go will be the right thing to do, we will still miss him because when he is on his game, he can literally put the team on his back, something no other hab is capable of.

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03-21-2009, 03:37 PM
  #265
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Originally Posted by Pascal View Post
I can't believe someone had the e-balls to compare Kovalev to anything even remotely related to the great Beliveau. I wouldn't even let Kovy lace his skates.
You're totally missing the point. I lived the Jean Beliveau era. I was a great Beliveau fan. I didn't jump on and off his bandwagon because he had seasons that were 30 points less productive than other seasons.

People expect Kovalev to "be consistent" but some are not happy unless he is scoring two or three points per game consistently.

It's ridiculous. It's totally unrealistic. It's irrational. Almost every scorer in the history of the game of hockey has been "inconsistent". Of course! Who here thinks Darryl Sittler should have scored ten points every game just because he proved he could do it once?

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03-21-2009, 03:53 PM
  #266
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Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
Correction: Expectations of Kovy giving a more constant effort game in, game out. Results would come if/when he does that as it was clearly proven last year.

Proof? Koivu who's not taking as much heat because he's giving the effort in spite of the net results not always being there.
You act as though you didn't know the player in question. Kovalev will create chances as much as he'll give the puck away. And he'll show up on some nights and stink it up on others. That's just the type of player he is. To expect him to work as hard as Tom Kostopoulos night in and night out is to expect the latter to score every other night. It's retarded and it just won't happen.

So I don't expect it. I take the good and expect the bad. As frustrating as he is at times, he pulls his weight and everyone's happy to have him on their team when playoff comes. But to blame the team's shortcomings solely on Kovy for being Kovy, everyone else in that dressing room is losing out on accountability when there should be plenty to go around.

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03-21-2009, 04:30 PM
  #267
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yes. well said. I agree.

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03-21-2009, 04:39 PM
  #268
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Originally Posted by Jack Bourdain View Post
If Kovalev doesn't sign with the Habs, and personally that's exactly what I want to see happen, what will be the effect of his departure on the Habs?

We've always talked about Kovalev keeping the kids in the locker room down and whatnot, so we might actually find out if we have kids that will step up at this occasion. I see Andrei (Kostitsyn), Maxim (Lapierre) AND (hopefully) Max (Pacioretty) being potential leaders (add to the list of Koivu, Komisarek, Higgins, Markov, Kostopoulos).

Also, and this is actually the important point of my post that I wanted to discuss, don't you have the feeling that once Kovalev signs with another team, he will actually be an above average player that he often was in Montreal, despite last season's performance? I just have a feeling that getting away from Montreal will catalyze his game, and he'll be proving skeptics wrong... I honestly believe in this. Don't get me wrong, I don't want him to stay with the team, since it's mutually benefitial for both Habs and Kovy to call it quits, but expect to get a lot of "Oh my god, Habs were so stupid to not re-sign this guy!!!" kind of comments.

Anyone say yay or nay?

kovy's fault because our young guns aren't playing well ? are you serious ?


as for the main ''point of your post'' , I strongly believe that with good pptime and decent 5 on 5 icetime, Kovy could be a force. He was the only player that could play on our PP , with Markov ... and the only thing the coaches did this year , is find a way that they wouldn't be able to pass the puck to each other ...brilliant isn't it ?

on a PP with decent puckmovers and a great chubby ass in front of net , kovy could rack up 15-20 goals and 50 points on the pp/year.

but ask him to dump and chase , split his pp time with koivu, play him on pk , and expect him to carry the team at 36 years old ... and he might well be a disapointing player indeed.

wake me up when you see another team that plays their 4rth liners on the pp and their top six on the pk.

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Old
03-21-2009, 05:19 PM
  #269
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
You act as though you didn't know the player in question. Kovalev will create chances as much as he'll give the puck away. And he'll show up on some nights and stink it up on others. That's just the type of player he is. To expect him to work as hard as Tom Kostopoulos night in and night out is to expect the latter to score every other night. It's retarded and it just won't happen.

So I don't expect it. I take the good and expect the bad. As frustrating as he is at times, he pulls his weight and everyone's happy to have him on their team when playoff comes. But to blame the team's shortcomings solely on Kovy for being Kovy, everyone else in that dressing room is losing out on accountability when there should be plenty to go around.
I know what we got when we traded for Kovalev. I was fine with it for a playoffs' push. But since re-signing him to his current contract, I've been against it for the very reason of this discussion. He's been inconsistent not only with his points, but with his effort throughout his entire career and THAT is the reason why I could never stand the guy and I still can't today for the exact same reason. I can't wait for us to part ways with him again for the same reason. So don't pretend to know what I am expecting or not as you obviously don't have a clue, and I mean that in the most respectful way possible.

BC wanting to compare Beliveau to Kovalev? It's still a bunch of BS as NEVER was Beliveau's dedication and effort been questioned. Why? Because he was dedicated and was putting the effort.

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03-21-2009, 05:58 PM
  #270
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Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
I know what we got when we traded for Kovalev. I was fine with it for a playoffs' push. But since re-signing him to his current contract, I've been against it for the very reason of this discussion. He's been inconsistent not only with his points, but with his effort throughout his entire career and THAT is the reason why I could never stand the guy and I still can't today for the exact same reason. I can't wait for us to part ways with him again for the same reason. So don't pretend to know what I am expecting or not as you obviously don't have a clue, and I mean that in the most respectful way possible.

BC wanting to compare Beliveau to Kovalev? It's still a bunch of BS as NEVER was Beliveau's dedication and effort been questioned. Why? Because he was dedicated and was putting the effort.
Frankly, I don't really want "effort", nor do I particularly want what YOU choose to call effort.

What I want is RESULTS. There are offensive results, and there are defensive results, and there are special team results.

Whatever "effort" you THINK you see, the results are the following:

Kovalev gets between 45 and 95 points per year, usually in the 60 range.

Except for 06-07, Kovalev has fairly decent all the way to very good +/- record meaning that his so-called lack of effort as judgmentally characterized by amateurs on an Internet forum does not seemn to RESULT in the many goals against. This should be a clue that the guy is not so lacking in effort as his critics claim. True lack of effort results in a FLOOD of goals against. This rarely happens with Kovalev. And that's because, while not a Selke favourite, Kovalev does put in a decent defensive contribution.

Kovy, when used a a PKer, has one of the best ratios of goals against to PK minutes played on the team. Again, gives the lie to the "lack of effort" label.

Kovy on the PP, while making the occasional giveaway (not unlike most guys who stickhandle and try to create things offensively), is a dangerous force. Some years he is out of this world, other years he is above average.

In the four years he has played on the Habs, the team has had a WORSE record when Kovy is not playing than when he is playing.

All the above are the true RESULTS for this man. They are far below the unrealistic expectations of some, but they are still the mark of a useful player.

My reason for comparing him to Beliveau is the following: Beliveau was a far bigger star, yet once in his thirties he had trouble producing "consistently". It didn't stop people from considering him an excellent contributor, and mathematical "inconsistency" shouldn't stop us from considering Kovalev a good contributor.

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Old
03-21-2009, 08:47 PM
  #271
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M.I.A since the All-Star game.

This "era" smells more like a bad "ora" and I can't wait for the smell to go away!

Even the CBC commentators agreed, that's how bad he is!


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Old
03-21-2009, 08:48 PM
  #272
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10 more games.

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Old
03-21-2009, 09:25 PM
  #273
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Wait until playoffs, they say... 2006-07 all over again.


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Old
03-21-2009, 09:35 PM
  #274
Jack Bourdain
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Higgins, Lapierre and Tanguay showed flashes of genius. Tanguay doing dekes and losing pucks = bad. Kovalev doing same thing = trying something for the team. Guillaume, Kostopoulos and Plekanec all trying hard.

This leaves Kovalev, Koivu and Andrei Kostitsyn on the blame boat. Shall the lynching commence?

-------------------------------------------------------------------

In all honesty, these players are capable, but none show desire. Get this season over with.

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