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Demers: They have burnt Price !

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Old
03-21-2009, 08:02 AM
  #51
Kirk Muller
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
first of all, a little harsh considering you have no idea who this person is, what they do etc. They might be your boss some day and far more successful than you. Just saying, can we not bash each other personally just cuz we're all suffering?

second, I don't think the organization's theme song should be "Who let the Price out? Who? Who? Who? Who?"...i'm sure they have tried to nurture him. Things like this just happen, moreso to goalies. Price is not damaged, he is not scarred, he will eventually be a top class goalie, maybe as early as next year (consistency-wise) and puh-lease, I would kill to be in Price's place with all his talent. He just needs to do what pros do, and he will, it's just a bad season. Enough already, move on to Halak for now.

Question...who did Roy have?
But its not harsh for people to pile on Price or any youngster for that matter despite not knowing what its like for a young athlete to have the weight of the city on his shoulders, living across the country, new city, no family. Its easy for people to say it on the internet but its another to live it but I guess its all fair to do that cause he plays goalie for the habs.

Its about putting the player in the best situation to succeed. Thats it. Not leaving a young 20-21 year old alone in a city with millions of dollars under media and fan scrutiny is probably not the smartest.

Who knows who Roy had but it could of been different considering his family were likely a stones throw away as well as all his home town friends, less obtrusive times without internet, no language issues and when Roy came in he wasn't looked as the Savior of this franchise.

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Old
03-21-2009, 08:21 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Kirk Muller View Post
But its not harsh for people to pile on Price or any youngster for that matter despite not knowing what its like for a young athlete to have the weight of the city on his shoulders, living across the country, new city, no family. Its easy for people to say it on the internet but its another to live it but I guess its all fair to do that cause he plays goalie for the habs.

Its about putting the player in the best situation to succeed. Thats it. Not leaving a young 20-21 year old alone in a city with millions of dollars under media and fan scrutiny is probably not the smartest.

Who knows who Roy had but it could of been different considering his family were likely a stones throw away as well as all his home town friends, less obtrusive times without internet, no language issues and when Roy came in he wasn't looked as the Savior of this franchise.
His mom or Dad should be living with him...at least for a couple of years. Kid needs a mentor or some stabilizing influence in his life.

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03-21-2009, 09:46 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
so what exactly was different about last year? hey team: check up on what you were doing and just do that. Seems we didn't have these problems and no one was complaining back then about price, kovy, koivu, etc. Some seasons just suck. It's a lot worse when it's your most highly touted and marketed one...ever? (didn't really need to seel 'em before)

Love Demers, but a little hypocritical imo if you yourself go on about comment t'as diriger un des meilleurs gardiens...cough cough...(Roy) et je vois un semblence. Easy to say he suffered a (very common) sophmore jinx (Cam Ward after Conn Smyth) in retrospect. Every one wanted him in the net this year. No body had a problem until he cracked . Still think he's been playing ok, not as bad as people make out. Some nights, incredible. Halak for now though.

Price had Montreal's finest women to take care of him. I havn't seen a pic, but i'd take that over Ovie's mom (no offense, she was a great athelete). Does Mario let Sid play NHL 09 past 11?
I think that you're over-simplifying things here. What Demers is saying is dead on. You're questioning what happened this year that's different from last year? It started last year. Remember the 28 pounds he had to shed? This tells me that he was 25-30 labs overweight! Remember the cigarette smoking, partying pictures? That's from this summer and others are from Halloween! It's just catching up to him now, but the turnaround started a last year.

Is it the only reason for Price's downspiral? Absolutely not as I think that the major reason for his poor play has to do with a goalie coach trying to change his style. But it doesn't take away the fact that good mentorship is very valuable.

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03-21-2009, 09:48 AM
  #54
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Sick of all these excuses. Where its mattered most this year he's been terrible, that's just the fact of the matter.

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03-21-2009, 10:04 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Row View Post
Sick of all these excuses. Where its mattered most this year he's been terrible, that's just the fact of the matter.
Like in anything else in life, you can't fix the problem if you refuse to look at what the problem is...

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03-21-2009, 10:08 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
Like in anything else in life, you can't fix the problem if you refuse to look at what the problem is...
Yeah, exactly. I think the biggest mistake Bob has made as GM was trading Huet last year. Regardless of who starts in the playoffs, I think CP would have been in a better state of mind with a veteran to share his first playoff experience with, even if he wasn't starting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
I think that you're over-simplifying things here. What Demers is saying is dead on. You're questioning what happened this year that's different from last year? It started last year. Remember the 28 pounds he had to shed? This tells me that he was 25-30 labs overweight! Remember the cigarette smoking, partying pictures? That's from this summer and others are from Halloween! It's just catching up to him now, but the turnaround started a last year.

Is it the only reason for Price's downspiral? Absolutely not as I think that the major reason for his poor play has to do with a goalie coach trying to change his style. But it doesn't take away the fact that good mentorship is very valuable.
The goalie coach has never changed his style. They have tried to make adjustments and improve stuff but his style has not changed.

Some of the bad goals he gives up has nothing to do with his style. In the Rangers game, in the shootout, he was making the first move, you can't do that against NHL shooters.

Against Ottawa, the Ruttuu goal he was going down for no reason, the player had nothing to shoot at. The Spetza goal, he did not have his paddle down to cover the 5 hole.


Last edited by Habs10Habs: 03-21-2009 at 04:22 PM.
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03-21-2009, 10:14 AM
  #57
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While I have respect for Demers I disagree that Price is ruined or anything like that. If someone here has links to Some video of Price last year or at the Worlds we could see the difference in his game.
1. He is trying to play more of a butterfly style than he did in the past.
2. He is no longer able to shake off a bad goal, which in turn makes you question your positional play and your anticipation.
3. He seems to be 1/2 step behind the play sometimes, either it's the anticipation aspect or he may be having problems with his vision.

Simple fixes for these :
1. Stop trying to change him into Patrick Roy, the game has evolved and so must the player.
2. His team mates and coaches need to rally around him when he makes those great saves(he does) and feed off them, when he lets a stinker in(he will) they need to reassure him they will get it back.
3. His positioning is one of his best attributes so this is a big concern. His defenders must give him room to make these saves. We have been giving up alot of odd man rushes, goals being scored from the door step etc.. if we keep teams to the outside, not much will get by him. Lastly, change his eye contacts.

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Old
03-21-2009, 10:16 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Yeah, exactly. I think the biggest mistake Bob has made as GM was trading Huet last year. Regardless of who starts in the playoffs, I think CP would have been in a better state of mind with a veteran to share his first playoff experience with, even if he wasn't starting.
The bigger mistake was to keep him in Montreal at the beginning of the 07-08 sesson instead of letting him play at least half a season in Hamilton. Huet and Halak were more than able to hold the fort. Gainey and the organization wanted so much to have a potential All-Star after having missed the playoffs by a couple of points the spring before. Just happened that Kovalev and most players had one of their best season + there was minimal injuries to all key players.


Another mistake: starting him before the All-Star game this year while he had not totally recovered from his ankle's injury. He came back (or someone convinced Carbo to play him ???) because he wanted to play in the All-Star Game that next week-end in Montreal.

Since that week, he has just been mainly awful. The team in front of him has been mediocre for reasons we will eventually learn about !

Quote:
Originally Posted by habfan1968 View Post
While I have respect for Demers I disagree that Price is ruined or anything like that. If someone here has links to Some video of Price last year or at the Worlds we could see the difference in his game.
1. He is trying to play more of a butterfly style than he did in the past.
2. He is no longer able to shake off a bad goal, which in turn makes you question your positional play and your anticipation.
3. He seems to be 1/2 step behind the play sometimes, either it's the anticipation aspect or he may be having problems with his vision.

Simple fixes for these :
1. Stop trying to change him into Patrick Roy, the game has evolved and so must the player.
2. His team mates and coaches need to rally around him when he makes those great saves(he does) and feed off them, when he lets a stinker in(he will) they need to reassure him they will get it back.
3. His positioning is one of his best attributes so this is a big concern. His defenders must give him room to make these saves. We have been giving up alot of odd man rushes, goals being scored from the door step etc.. if we keep teams to the outside, not much will get by him. Lastly, change his eye contacts.
Demers also said that the kid is not ruined for his whole carreer as long as some of his problems are adressed, and quickly.


Last edited by Habs10Habs: 03-21-2009 at 04:32 PM.
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Old
03-21-2009, 10:19 AM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
The goalie coach has never changed his style. They have tried to make adjustments and improve stuff but his style has not changed.

Some of the bad goals he gives up has nothing to do with his style. In the Rangers game, in the shootout, he was making the first move, you can't do that against NHL shooters.

Against Ottawa, the Ruttuu goal he was going down for no reason, the player had nothing to shoot at. The Spetza goal, he did not have his paddle down to cover the 5 hole.
Price was more standing up and less going down before, we see him down alot this season, that is clearly Melanson. That Spezza goal is scored all over the league every day, some one should have knocked him down before he shoots, he had too much time and too many options. To say Melanson has not changed his style is not accurate. He has had his influence and we can see the changes in recent games. Price is a big body and it's tempting to paly him more butterfly than anything however that is not the style that got him here in the first place.

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03-21-2009, 10:19 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
I think that you're over-simplifying things here. What Demers is saying is dead on. You're questioning what happened this year that's different from last year? It started last year. Remember the 28 pounds he had to shed? This tells me that he was 25-30 labs overweight! Remember the cigarette smoking, partying pictures? That's from this summer and others are from Halloween! It's just catching up to him now, but the turnaround started a last year.

Is it the only reason for Price's downspiral? Absolutely not as I think that the major reason for his poor play has to do with a goalie coach trying to change his style. But it doesn't take away the fact that good mentorship is very valuable.
Another classic Everyone's Fault But Price message.

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03-21-2009, 10:25 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Yeah, exactly. I think the biggest mistake Bob has made as GM was trading Huet last year. Regardless of who starts in the playoffs, I think CP would have been in a better state of mind with a veteran to share his first playoff experience with, even if he wasn't starting.
But Huet would have been gone after that season... I think that the mistake was more to chose not to sign a veteran like Kolzig in July to help Price develop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
The goalie coach has never changed his style. They have tried to make adjustments and improve stuff but his style has not changed.

Some of the bad goals he gives up has nothing to do with his style. In the Rangers game, in the shootout, he was making the first move, you can't do that against NHL shooters.

Against Ottawa, the Ruttuu goal he was going down for no reason, the player had nothing to shoot at. The Spetza goal, he did not have his paddle down to cover the 5 hole.
That is bullcrap! Price was a hybrid goalie and he's now a butterfly goalie struggling with the new style. I've explained that in length in the Melanson thread.

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Originally Posted by earl the habs fan View Post
Another classic Everyone's Fault But Price message.
Another classic of not reading the posts and making things up. Price has his faults, but doesn't have the needed support.

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03-21-2009, 10:25 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Row View Post
Sick of all these excuses. Where its mattered most this year he's been terrible, that's just the fact of the matter.
That actually is not a fact, he has issues since the All Star break. His play previous to the break was more than just good. The whole team was playing well on top of that, now they are not.

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03-21-2009, 12:26 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Kirk Muller View Post
Its very easy to say this from your comfortable chair in your parents basement where all you have to do is get some passable grades at your local community college and have a part time job to pay for your drinking binges on the weekends.

Fact is, if I am going to put millions into a young person I sure as hell am going to make sure he is put in the situation to succeed. To me it only makes sense to have him stay at a teammates or some one in managements house. It only makes sense to me to have someone put him under his wing.

If not doing this for Price's well being as a person, do it for your organization whose investing in this person.

As an organization it makes ZERO sense not to do this but maybe this is yet another reason why this team hasn't developed a star player since Patrick Roy.

Comfort of my chair in my parents basement ???

I'm 31 years old, I work as a software developer, am married, have a kid, and rent a house, and support my extended family. And I lived in montreal for 10 years. Started to **** up my life there, failed out of unversity because of drugs, then bingo, my parents decided to stop supporting me and my irresponsible ways. That's when I got my life together, when I hit bottom.It was a hard lesson, but I learned and am better for.But I never sat there and cried about how I didn't get support.

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03-21-2009, 01:07 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
But Huet would have been gone after that season... I think that the mistake was more to chose not to sign a veteran like Kolzig in July to help Price develop.


That is bullcrap! Price was a hybrid goalie and he's now a butterfly goalie struggling with the new style. I've explained that in length in the Melanson thread.
Now it's Halak's fault. I think it should be pointed out that your Blame Everyone but Price obsession has taken your credibility from low down to nil. Actually it's below nil.

Now tell me that you coach bantam houseleague or something that will really impress me.

It should also be pointed out that the backup-that-is-not-Kolzig is now the only hope the team has for post season, and is quite frankly carrying the team.

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03-21-2009, 02:49 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by earl the habs fan View Post
Now it's Halak's fault. I think it should be pointed out that your Blame Everyone but Price obsession has taken your credibility from low down to nil. Actually it's below nil.

Now tell me that you coach bantam houseleague or something that will really impress me.

It should also be pointed out that the backup-that-is-not-Kolzig is now the only hope the team has for post season, and is quite frankly carrying the team.
You're really reading what you want now, do you? I'm done debating with someone who can't take what's written at face value.

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03-21-2009, 02:58 PM
  #66
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Broke, yes in the latter days. Alone, depends on what you mean. Getting laid.. no. Even been to Montreal ? Go there sometime, it might even help a sorry chap like yourself out.

Okay... we need to straighten this out once and for all for the sake of the whole thread. Did Analyzer have trouble getting laid while in Montreal or not? I can't tell by the above post. Thanks for the help!

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03-21-2009, 03:09 PM
  #67
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Really? You put too much value in Gainey, and not enough in the men behind the scenes. Its BG who failed to solidify the defense, let the FA's walk, make some very questionable trades, and do nothing at the deadline besides Metropolit (lol)

He's made a lot of really bad moves, this is his mess. I won't fault him for some of the players having horrible years, because thats not really his issue.

I mean, Higgins and the defense have taken three steps backwards, so has SK, Kovalev, Koivu etc.

He looks like a lost man who has no idea what type of team he wants to build, so he just stands still.

I mean, I could have hired Timmins and ran this team to this point in BG's shoes. How many coaches will he burn through till he admits his strategy is a failure? How many till he admits he never ever got the character he needed to withstand a long season in Montreal?

I'm tired of the excuses, I wish he would man-up and just admit his failures, I'd have an ounce of respect left for the man that way.
This is a team that finished first last year and was doing fine up until Lang was hurt.

Has he been perfect? No. I've ripped him for a few of his moves but this club has a ton of young players that are playing well and we've haven't even seen McDonnaugh or Subban yet. We've got one of the best collection of younger players in the league.

You can't just expect the guy to work miracles.

And yes other people have helped but you can't just throw the blame for the team's recent weak play and not give him any credit for the players that we have now. I know I'm a lot more excited about the team now than I was before he came here.

He could've taken shortcuts at the expense of long term success and he didn't. Sorry, but its hard to build a dynasty, esp. from the ground up. We might as well have been an expansion time eight years ago it was that bad. He's done an awesome job, give him some credit here.

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
DUDE!!!

Haven't seen you around here in a long time. Nice to see you back.


And I totally agree, and would also like to add.... Price is young, life is long (relatively) and he'll either learn from his mistakes and be better for it, but he's got plenty of time to get back up. He did win 40 games in his 66th first starts in regular season play, before injuring himself this season. He's 21, he isn't burnt.
Thanks.

Had a daughter, don't get much time to post anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Row View Post
Sick of all these excuses. Where its mattered most this year he's been terrible, that's just the fact of the matter.
There are other facts to consider too. He was fine until he got injured. In fact he was one of the best goalies in the league.

Yes, he's been poor since returning. That doesn't mean we should write him off.


Last edited by Habs10Habs: 03-21-2009 at 04:39 PM.
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03-21-2009, 03:56 PM
  #68
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They should have put Price in Hamilton for a full year before making him the #1 goalie in a city like Montreal where if you don't stand on your head every game, you get boo'd for it.

By forcing Price to keep playing while his confidence is so low, its just going to make him worse. He needs to sit on the bench, forget about playing and all the pressure that goes with it and just work on things in practice. He needs to get his mind off other distractions and focus just on how he plays the game and moves in the net.

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03-22-2009, 12:53 AM
  #69
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They should have put Price in Hamilton for a full year before making him the #1 goalie in a city like Montreal where if you don't stand on your head every game, you get boo'd for it.
People were pretty happy with him before the injury though weren't they?

The guy's NHL ready, but he hasn't been the same since coming back. For sure he hasn't been all that sharp but the team hasn't played well in front of him either. The collapse isn't his fault.
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Originally Posted by Puckhead58 View Post
By forcing Price to keep playing while his confidence is so low, its just going to make him worse. He needs to sit on the bench, forget about playing and all the pressure that goes with it and just work on things in practice. He needs to get his mind off other distractions and focus just on how he plays the game and moves in the net.
I think we might've brought him back from the DL too early. I'm not sure what else explains his sub-par play. Hopefully he snaps out of it sooner or later because it doesn't look like Halak was the answer tonight.

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