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Higgins to the Islanders

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Old
03-26-2009, 07:52 AM
  #76
Blind Gardien
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCH View Post
...
A lot of habs fans like to rectify Gainey's decision by saying Streit wanted to play D and he wasn't good enough for the habs in that department. Well, fact is he was better on D for us then Brisebois, Bouillon and O'Byrne. I would have rated him as our 5th best in his own end(behind Markov, Hamrlik, Komo and Gorges).
That's not a fact, that's your opinion. The opinion of the Montreal coaching staff is that those guys were better than him. I would probably come in somewhere in between... I don't think he was any better than them, but I'm not sure he was worse either. And then he *was* a better forward than any of them would have been.
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Originally Posted by Kencaid View Post
What I have never understood about higgins in montreal is that he has been an Assistant captain for most of his stay in montreal, and was only 25?? Not only is he young, but hes also one of your best defensive forwards on your team, and yet he is always thrown into trade rumours regularly. I do not understand montreals logic with their players.
I presume you mean "Montreal fans' logic". But the whole thing is, it's *not* logic. It's just short-term emotional overreactions that fuel the way many fans evaluate the players.
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Some guys seem to idolized who are not actually that great, and are way over rated (every team does this, but i will say montreal has recently been doing this alot more, even more then my maple laffs). A great example is lapierre (an untouchable idol in montreal), who has 6 more pts than higgins in 22 more games. This is keeping in mind that higgins has had a terrible year. Not to mention the team is being lead in points by a d-man.......only other team doing that is NYI????? Getting rid of higgins after a down year is a bad idea. Montreal needs to stack up on some more character players (i know lapierrre is one of these guys, i actually like his game as a whole, but he is over rated), getting rid of higgins would be a bad move.
I never heard of Lapierre being idolized to that extent, but he is being appreciated. Begin and Kostopolous and others of that ilk have gone through similar periods of being appreciated, which I don't think should count as idolisation either. But anyway, I agree that there is no sense for the Habs to trade Higgins at low value, he's a much better player than he has shown this season. Although if another GM out there is willing to overlook this season's performance and value him at what we think his real value is, then it's not out of the question for me that Higgins could be dealt. You'd have to find that GM, though, and at the same time he'd have to be a GM with an asset you were looking to trade for. And that asset would most assuredly not be a draft pick (not even a 1st, never mind a 2nd per the OP).

And with the FA shopping season looming, about the only thing the Habs would be in the market to trade for would be an impact star player. All the other complementary bits and pieces you look for on the FA market first. So what impact star player is available whose GM is willing to accept Higgins at his "real" value as one component of that trade? Hrm. I'm guessing the odds can't be high. Higgins re-signs. (And cheaper than we were fearing when the season started). And we'll see what next season brings.

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03-26-2009, 09:14 AM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
That's not a fact, that's your opinion. The opinion of the Montreal coaching staff is that those guys were better than him. I would probably come in somewhere in between... I don't think he was any better than them, but I'm not sure he was worse either. And then he *was* a better forward than any of them would have been.
Ok fine i'll play. My opinion is that he was better then those guys on D last year. And what has he gone on to prove? That when given a real opportunity, he is in fact better! The guy went on to be an all star this year, while O'Byrne and Brisebois continue to be healthy scratches on a regular basis as they were last year, and Bouillon is and has always been just meh.

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03-26-2009, 10:20 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Konk View Post
How is a career 20 goal, 40 point 2nd/3rd liner that has had injury problems going to fetch a 1st round pick?
Career high is 27 goals and 52 points at 24 years old. Please try again

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Old
03-26-2009, 10:22 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by 4cups View Post
No wonder the Leafs haven't won a Cup in almost 50 years, their fans is as dumb as their organization! Schenn at best is Brendan Witt, so that trade with the Isles was terrible on Torontos part & Bailey is already better then Schenn & Filatov. Bailey will be a better version of Doug Weight once this kid has developed. The question is will Shenn be better than Witt?? I highly doubt it!!
Yes and by FAR.

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03-26-2009, 10:31 AM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyrrus147 View Post
Career high is 27 goals and 52 points at 24 years old. Please try again
Joe Juneau had a career high of 102 points, does that make him an elite 100 point player?

You try again. Just because his career high is 52 points doesn't automatically mean he'll score 50 points every season.

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03-26-2009, 10:39 AM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konk View Post
Joe Juneau had a career high of 102 points, does that make him an elite 100 point player?

You try again. Just because his career high is 52 points doesn't automatically mean he'll score 50 points every season.
No, but it doesn't automatically mean that it'll be the highest he will ever get. Its pretty rare that a player achieves his career high in points at the age of 24.. I'm not saying it won't happen, just that its pretty rare.

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Old
03-26-2009, 10:46 AM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4cups View Post
No wonder the Leafs haven't won a Cup in almost 50 years, their fans is as dumb as their organization! Schenn at best is Brendan Witt, so that trade with the Isles was terrible on Torontos part & Bailey is already better then Schenn & Filatov. Bailey will be a better version of Doug Weight once this kid has developed. The question is will Shenn be better than Witt?? I highly doubt it!!
Schenn is already better than Witt in his prime, and he is only 19-YO.

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03-26-2009, 11:58 AM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyrrus147 View Post
Career high is 27 goals and 52 points at 24 years old. Please try again
Ryan Malone and Gary Roberts fetched a 2009 third-round pick from Tampa Bay. Islanders giving a 1st round pick for him is not happening, unless quality prospects or picks are included in the deal.

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Old
03-26-2009, 12:01 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Matt714 View Post
Ryan Malone and Gary Roberts fetched a 2009 third-round pick from Tampa Bay. Islanders giving a 1st round pick for him is not happening, unless quality prospects or picks are included in the deal.

The isles aren't trading their first. That isn't even on the table.

I think that poster was simply suggesting that Higgins could return a first, perhaps late first, in this draft. I think he is probably correct and believe that some Hab fans are underestimating Higgins' market value.

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Old
03-26-2009, 12:34 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury View Post
The isles aren't trading their first. That isn't even on the table.

I think that poster was simply suggesting that Higgins could return a first, perhaps late first, in this draft. I think he is probably correct and believe that some Hab fans are underestimating Higgins' market value.
We only underestimate his value because for once others haven't got on that this guy can' bury ****.

This guy couldn't bury a rock in a hole already dug for him without 3, or 4 tries.

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Old
03-26-2009, 12:44 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury View Post
The isles aren't trading their first. That isn't even on the table.

I think that poster was simply suggesting that Higgins could return a first, perhaps late first, in this draft. I think he is probably correct and believe that some Hab fans are underestimating Higgins' market value.
Maybe he was talking about the Isles first that they have from the sharks i think it is?

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03-26-2009, 12:58 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by TheCH View Post
Maybe he was talking about the Isles first that they have from the sharks i think it is?
Yes I was talking about the Sharks first round pick as a best case scenario, but I was actually looking at the Islanders high second rounder.

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03-26-2009, 01:22 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konk View Post
Joe Juneau had a career high of 102 points, does that make him an elite 100 point player?

You try again. Just because his career high is 52 points doesn't automatically mean he'll score 50 points every season.
Higgins had 72 goals in 223 games (1 goal every nearly 3 games) between the age of 22 and 24 years old. And you called him a career 20 goals scorer ?

I love the way you think. It make everything much more simple. Taking one extreme exemple to show your point ! Next time, try to use some arguments, it might make your position a little more understandable.

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Old
03-26-2009, 01:32 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by FrankMTL View Post
Yes I was talking about the Sharks first round pick as a best case scenario, but I was actually looking at the Islanders high second rounder.
Why would you trade Higgins for some guy that may never even make the nhl?

The habs need nhl talent right now with all their UFA's this summer. Higgins isn't going anywhere for a pick, and his career is far from over. Even last year when he had just as good a season as Andrei Kostitsyn, despite being bounced all over the lineup while Kostitsyn played on a great line most of the year, he was still bashed to high hell. And Higgins actually plays a 2 way game unlike Kostitsyn who is completely one dimensional and even his one dimension has left a lot to desire this year.

Don't get my wrong, i love both Kostitsyn and Higgins. I just don't understand the double standard there is with those 2 guys. There is no reason why Higgins can't/won't bounce back next year.

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03-26-2009, 01:38 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by TheCH View Post
Why would you trade Higgins for some guy that may never even make the nhl?

The habs need nhl talent right now with all their UFA's this summer. Higgins isn't going anywhere for a pick, and his career is far from over. Even last year when he had just as good a season as Andrei Kostitsyn, despite being bounced all over the lineup while Kostitsyn played on a great line most of the year, he was still bashed to high hell. And Higgins actually plays a 2 way game unlike Kostitsyn who is completely one dimensional and even his one dimension has left a lot to desire this year.

Don't get my wrong, i love both Kostitsyn and Higgins. I just don't understand the double standard there is with those 2 guys. There is no reason why Higgins can't/won't bounce back next year.
Like all the posts on this forum, its all hypothetical. We have a lot of young forwards who might be able to step in at one point soon. This all depends on how many UFA's we re-sign or sign obviously. If it looks like we won't be able to attract many UFA's or even sign our own, then I would not trade him. There are a lot of variables to consider..

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03-26-2009, 02:02 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankMTL View Post
Yes I was talking about the Sharks first round pick as a best case scenario, but I was actually looking at the Islanders high second rounder.
Not happening, unless Higgins is in a package deal with prospects or picks.

They aren't going to trade a high value pick for someone that isn't guaranteed to sign, especially when his name is Chris Higgins.


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Old
03-26-2009, 02:16 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Matt714 View Post
Not happening, unless Higgins is in a package deal with prospects or picks.

They aren't going to trade a high value pick for someone that isn't guaranteed to sign, especially when his name is Chris Higgins.
He is guaranteed to sign...he's an RFA.

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Old
03-26-2009, 08:49 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by FrankMTL View Post
Yes I was talking about the Sharks first round pick as a best case scenario, but I was actually looking at the Islanders high second rounder.

I'd move San Jose's pick for Higgins, but then I think Higgins is going to return to form next season.

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03-26-2009, 11:33 PM
  #94
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I am totally against trading Higgins, even more so giving him away! He's getting his game back lately and the only way I'd consider sacrificing him would be in a bigger package deal for a star player.

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03-26-2009, 11:41 PM
  #95
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the habs aren't trading higgins to the islanders and if wang doesn't get his money the islanders will be in KC in 2010 anyway

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03-27-2009, 12:14 AM
  #96
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What kind of money does Higgins get this off season?

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03-27-2009, 12:23 AM
  #97
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What kind of money does Higgins get this off season?
I'm guessing between $1.5-2.5 M...

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03-27-2009, 08:14 AM
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Predanerd View Post
What kind of money does Higgins get this off season?
Can't really give an RFA a paycut, so probably around $1.9M or $2M on a short-term contract that bridges him both to UFAdom and (hopefully) to a return to his form of previous seasons.

But I guess maybe if the Habs are ultra-confident in him they could end up adding more years, though they'd probably have to pay more for it, ironically, to buy out some UFA time. I don't think he'd be *that* much of a risk, but still, you don't really like to pay a guy money that he didn't really earn after a bad season. Heading into this year, a contract similar to what Andrei Kostitsyn got last year probably would have been a reasonable expectation. I don't know that the Habs can overlook this season and still give him that now. But I don't think it's *completely* impossible that they might... Gainey usually has a tendency to pay the guys he wants generously enough. The shorter term bridge deal is probably more likely, though.

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Old
03-27-2009, 05:24 PM
  #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emb24 View Post
the habs aren't trading higgins to the islanders and if wang doesn't get his money the islanders will be in KC in 2010 anyway

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Old
03-29-2009, 12:52 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by FrankMTL View Post
I never make these trade proposals, but with Higgins an RFA at the end of the year, and the Habs prospects coming up. Higgins may be expendable. I'm sure the Habs will try to sign him, but if the sides are too far apart, they may be willing to trade him. Since the Islanders have a lot of cap space and he's a hometown boy, i'm sure they would be interested.

Would the Isles do..

Islanders: Chris Higgins

Canadiens: Islander 2nd round pick 2009 (30-35 range) + mid range prospect

Or maybe just drop the mid range prospect and get the Islanders "second" first round pick (27-30 overall) aquired from the Senators.
I would do that as an Islander fan

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