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Knuble may not be a Flyer next year

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Old
03-31-2009, 01:05 AM
  #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Libertine View Post
When did Knuble stop being the board's whipping boy?
Your answer can be found in post #100.

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Old
03-31-2009, 01:07 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Flyersfan1216 View Post
For all of the people who want Knuble over Lupul... c'mon think about it.

Knuble will be 37 years old. He's good at standing in front of the net and cashing in rebounds..that's it. His skating is going down and his 5v5 play is pretty bad. We have enough Vets to replace him in the locker room.

Knuble didn't even score 30 goals until he was 30. Lupul is only 25 and has higher upside. I think next year he explodes kind of like Hartnell this year. Everyone hated that Hartnell contract too...
higher upside?
he is what he is and will always be. a streaky one dimentional hockey player. he can get you 25-30 goals no doubt. but when hes not scoring goals he is useless.
Every team needs a guy like Knuble. I guarantee you this, if we cant sign him he will not be unemployed for very long after July 1st. He is more valuable then you think.

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03-31-2009, 01:09 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Rebel Banker View Post
lupul played like **** the first month or so of the season but since then has played on one of the better lines in the NHL, he will end up w/ 25 goals or more most likely and can play on both special teams...he isn't an untouchable obviously, he is a streaky player but he isn't this a lazy, albatross around the flyers neck...people make like he is friggin' pavel brendl. he is a luxury due to our forward depth but there are other contracts i would explore moving before his, like paying carle or jones to be third pairing dman which they will likely be next season.
and if i am going to pay more then $2MM for knuble i would look at guys like moen or clowe first.
Yea, I hear what you're saying, and it still doesn't mean that Lupul is worth his "market value", and certainly not to the Flyers.

Look, I'm not trying to bash Lupul, but when he isn't scoring (like now, with only 2 points in 6 games), he brings nothing else to the ice. Nothing. He has the ability to do more, such as being physical, but doesn't do it nearly enough to justify his raise moving forward.

Would I rather move Jones than Lupul? Sure I would. What would be even better is moving both, because neither is worth what they are paid as compared to what they bring to the ice, no matter what the market dictates. Ridding ones self of players such as these is exactly how you win in a salary cap world. They simply aren't worth their market value (Knuble is worth every penny btw).

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03-31-2009, 01:14 AM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
Your answer can be found in post #100.


I know Lupul has replaced him but it seemed like everyone hated Knuble earlier in the season and now everyone wants to hang onto him.

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03-31-2009, 01:15 AM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Libertine View Post


I know Lupul has replaced him but it seemed like everyone hated Knuble earlier in the season and now everyone wants to hang onto him.
I think most people on here would take Knuble back over Lupul and that contract.

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03-31-2009, 01:18 AM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Libertine View Post


I know Lupul has replaced him but it seemed like everyone hated Knuble earlier in the season and now everyone wants to hang onto him.
Very true. I remember before the season a lot of people were saying they wanted lupul on the first line claiming he would score 80+ points and tons of people wanted Knuble on the 4th line! I was never one of them people, I always said I wanted Knuble to play with Gags, they always have played well together and he picks up the garbage as well as anyone in the league.

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03-31-2009, 01:24 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
Very true. I remember before the season a lot of people were saying they wanted lupul on the first line claiming he would score 80+ points and tons of people wanted Knuble on the 4th line! I was never one of them people, I always said I wanted Knuble to play with Gags, they always have played well together and he picks up the garbage as well as anyone in the league.
Honestly, I think too many people on these boards get caught up in things like age and potential upside, while forgetting to look at actual production, intangibles and how a player fits on a certain team, let alone how they fit within a salary cap structure.

Knuble continues to do what he always does, and continues to do it more consistently than most, all at a very reasonable cap hit.

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Old
03-31-2009, 07:42 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by FireStevensDotCom View Post
I would take Knuble and his "Knuble'd" any day of the week over the one dimentional Joffrey Lupul.
It would be a mistake to let Knuble walk away because we have an albotross of a contract in Lupul. I dont care what anyone says Lupul's contract is terrible. Never should have given him that contract. period.
WE shouldn't have, but I remain convinced that contract isn't that terrible for a young guy who will get you 25 goals a year with some regularity. Therefore, I think he's a guy we CAN trade if we really want to.

Knuble is fine as long as he's put in positions to succeed. That means not putting him on a line with Briere, who wants to play at a tempo that doesn't really work with Knubles problems. There's a reason Knuble has worked so well with Richards...Richards doesn't play at that fast a pace, and likes to work for those dirty goals.

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Old
03-31-2009, 10:00 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by ShadowFlyer View Post
I agree that the Lupul contract is "market value" when you take into account points as they compare to the other players you mentioned. That said, it doesn't mean the Flyers have to be the ones to pay that market value for Lupul, and I am of the opinion that they should not.

Its fine to look at players with similar numbers and similar ages and declare market value. But when you watch guys like Lupul on the ice, as compared to others you mentioned, there is a BIG difference in the "fire" they play with on every shift.

So while its fine and technically true to look at Lupul's production and declare it "market value", when you take into account his inconsistencies and lazy play, you are going to have a hard time convincing others on this board that the Flyers should be paying that "market value".

When exactly does inconsistent and lazy play affect market value in a negative fashion? Dustin Penner technically makes market value as well, but I bet the Oilers are as unhappy paying that value as most Flyers fans are about paying Lupul the same kind of coin.

I understand market value, and I also understand how the case can be made that Lupul will be paid correctly, as it pertains to that value. But after watching Lupul for 2 seasons in Philly, I can confidently tell you without any hesitation that he is not worth that amount of money, regardless of what the market says.

Very very good post. Xplained things well.

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Old
03-31-2009, 03:08 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
WE shouldn't have, but I remain convinced that contract isn't that terrible for a young guy who will get you 25 goals a year with some regularity. Therefore, I think he's a guy we CAN trade if we really want to.
There was a rumor that he almost went to Nashville at the deadline. There will be plenty of teams interested in him this offseason. He'll be on some middling team's first line next season, if the Flyers deal him.

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Old
03-31-2009, 03:28 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by blah View Post
There was a rumor that he almost went to Nashville at the deadline. There will be plenty of teams interested in him this offseason. He'll be on some middling team's first line next season, if the Flyers deal him.
Agreed. I think Lupul's value by every idiot on HF who is not a Flyers fan is completely incorrect. All those who think a 50+ point forward is a salary dump are the same people who think if we dumped Briere it'd be a salary dump. While it might appear that way from a Flyers' perspective it certainly isn't from the perspective of the GM acquiring a top line forward, which Lupul is on quite a few NHL squads.

IF we trade him we will get decent value.

That being said I really do expect one of Jones or Carle to be gone. Sbisa is coming up full-time so why drop a 50 point forward when we have redundancy on the backend?

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