HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Dynamo Moscow signs Omark and Harju

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
04-08-2009, 12:44 PM
  #201
Giant Moo
Registered User
 
Giant Moo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,110
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seachd View Post
This confirms there are more important things to them than playing in the NHL. Disappointing, and it's their decision, even though it seems pretty clear to be the wrong one.
The comments are merely creating a bargaining position, to make the Oilers come back with a stronger offer to overcome the "perceived" snubbing. Doesn't make them look very good personally, though. A PR counter by the Oilers would surely start seeding doubt within GMs in the NHL.

Giant Moo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 12:44 PM
  #202
Seachd
Registered User
 
Seachd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: The Fail
Posts: 13,931
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Major4Boarding View Post
The way I understand it is, because there's no transfer agreement with IIHF and the fact that the NHLPA lost it's challenge to the current CBA (Article 8.6 or i.e Cherepanov) back in late 2008, all unsigned drafted Europeans essentially turn "Defected Status". Which means each team (this case EDM and TB) still retain their rights (Indefinately)

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=546690

http://blog.mlive.com/snapshots/2008...ed_player.html

"November 4, New York Post: The league's victory in that grievance as awarded by arbiter Richard Bloch, essentially gives teams the rights to these players into perpetuity for as long as there is no IIHF transfer agreement between the NHL and international hockey federations."

"The NHLPA lost the grievance it filed against the league based on testimony by deputy commissioner Bill Daly as to communications with, and the intent of, former PA executive director Ted Saskin when the sides agreed via a letter agreement on July 22, 2005 to temporarily adopt "defected player" status in the absence of a transfer agreement."

"Though the letter agreement had expired and the PA did not agree to extend it, the NHL sent a May 19 memo to league general managers advising them that it was reinstituting "defected player" status."
And if this is the case, wouldn't Omark be subject to entry-level conditions whenever he signs his first NHL contract?

Even if it isn't the case, his salary could still be restricted in the future.

Seachd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 12:46 PM
  #203
Senor Catface
Registered User
 
Senor Catface's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Country: Nepal
Posts: 6,264
vCash: 1937
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seachd View Post
Is that an argument?
No no, I'm actually just curious. There's nothing wrong with it if you are.

Senor Catface is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 12:48 PM
  #204
vb
Registered User
 
vb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Miami, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 3,269
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
Isn't there a no-poaching agreement between the NHL and KHL now? I thought they did that after the Radulov debacle.
Interesting, I had no idea about that. I just don't understand why he would sign now and the only reason that makes sense is for him to buy some leverage with the Oilers.

Why wouldn't he wait until the Oilers rights expired?

vb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 12:48 PM
  #205
Seachd
Registered User
 
Seachd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: The Fail
Posts: 13,931
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Datsun View Post
No no, I'm actually just curious. There's nothing wrong with it if you are.
No, I believe Omark could be making a big mistake if there's no out-clause.

If your dream is to play in the NHL, you consider taking a contract when it's given, because it could be your last chance.

But this stuff about "my dream is the NHL" and "the Oilers must not want me" is obviously just garbage.

Seachd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:21 PM
  #206
Louiss
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 892
vCash: 500
maybe he didnt want to have the same season than Janne Pesonen, who was league leader in points SM-Liga last season.

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=62658

only a few games in the NHL and star looking numbers in the AHL.


As for the quotes by the player in the media I woulnd really care about that its probably pure garbage that is often invented by the medias.

Louiss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:23 PM
  #207
HuMz
Registered User
 
HuMz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Calgary, Canada
Posts: 2,444
vCash: 500
Just brutal... this team has trouble generating offence offence most nights and yet we let our most promising offensive prospect go atm over a few hundred thousand. Meanwhile we can overpay under achieving vets in the millions.

HuMz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:32 PM
  #208
Joe Hallenback
Registered User
 
Joe Hallenback's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 7,821
vCash: 777
Honestly I am glad he signed in Russian. The over hyping on these boards about him was reaching biblical proportions and he was bound not to reach the standards that people were already placing upon him.

Joe Hallenback is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:40 PM
  #209
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,211
vCash: 500
Omark did what was best for himself just like anyone else would have done.

He coulda signed for less than the rookie max here, let's be generous and say the Oil offered him $750k but it was probably less, and a whopping $65K in the ahl.
He signed for probably a couple Mill to play in Russia, the money here wasn't even close.


We all know that prospects fail at the nhl level, what if his star faded over here and at the end of his cheap contract he was only able to get $500K in Russia? Part of the reason the russians paid so much was because they were competing with the nhl. If Omark failed here he'd be going to a russian league that was only in competition against the other euro leagues. The money would be a lot less because they'd be competing dollar for dollar and not against the "elite league status" anymore.

I knew years ago that euro leagues were going to offer the nhl good competition on some fronts. They're passionate about hockey just like us and they aren't just going to be a 3rd rate hockey destination forever. The ahl isn't enough to get guys over the pond anymore and the chance of maybe playing a few games in the nhl w/rookie pay isn't enough to make the difference.

Oi'll say! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:42 PM
  #210
Freudian slips
Registered User
 
Freudian slips's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: dogville
Country: Canada
Posts: 933
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seachd View Post
No, I believe Omark could be making a big mistake if there's no out-clause.

If your dream is to play in the NHL, you consider taking a contract when it's given, because it could be your last chance.

But this stuff about "my dream is the NHL" and "the Oilers must not want me" is obviously just garbage.
From a respected poster such as yourself, your logic is truly gargbage. IF he is good enough to crack the NHL he will get there...playing in Moscow for a year doesnt preclude that.

If he isint good enough to play in the NHL then he is making a wise decision to take the payday now. Unless you're making millions of dollars a year, its utterly ridiculous for someone to say he is stupid to turn down that kind of money.

Have you seen him play? I havent - but, my concern is that this is potentially another, in a long series of mistakes, made by this organization. From the artilces Ive read, it seems the Oilers didnt do a good job selling him on the merits of go over to NA.

No one can predict the future, but arent you at least a little concerned that he has done something that NO ONE his age has EVER done in the SEL??? Doesnt it make you a little mad or disappointed in the Oilers not signing him? Or are you blinded by your sheeplike fandom?

Freudian slips is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:44 PM
  #211
The Polak*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,023
vCash: 500
Good, unlike the rah rah NOW NOW people I believe management should think with their heads not with flashy youtube videos.

Some fourth rounder in a lesser SEL league demanding the max and likely bonuses? Yeah no thanks enjoy russia.

This is freaking Omark not gagner (and even he only got half possible bonuses)

The Polak* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:44 PM
  #212
Freudian slips
Registered User
 
Freudian slips's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: dogville
Country: Canada
Posts: 933
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Polak View Post
Good, unlike the rah rah NOW NOW people I believe management should think with their heads not with flashy youtube videos.

Some fourth rounder in a lesser SEL league demanding the max and likely bonuses? Yeah no thanks enjoy russia.

This is freaking Omark not gagner (and even he only got half possible bonuses)

have u seen him play?

Freudian slips is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:44 PM
  #213
Vomiting Kermit*
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Edmonton, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,562
vCash: 500
I don't blame him. The Oilers are a ****ing trainwreck.

Vomiting Kermit* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:47 PM
  #214
Freudian slips
Registered User
 
Freudian slips's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: dogville
Country: Canada
Posts: 933
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Polak View Post
About as much as you have and a lot less than management and scouting
Then stop making claims about him as a player.

Freudian slips is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:48 PM
  #215
The Polak*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,023
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian slips View Post
have u seen him play?
About as much as you have and a lot less than management and scouting

The Polak* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:49 PM
  #216
Oil_Magic
Registered User
 
Oil_Magic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: ED MO NT ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 885
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Oil_Magic
Anyone think playing with his friend may have something to do with this?

Oil_Magic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:52 PM
  #217
Senor Catface
Registered User
 
Senor Catface's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Country: Nepal
Posts: 6,264
vCash: 1937
For those who haven't seen Omark play(on either side of the issue), it's neither difficult nor impossible to catch him playing on the internet. His team used to have youtube of periods, so look for it there...Or of course, pay for an online stream.

Senor Catface is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:57 PM
  #218
Replacement
Now with 9% more zen
 
Replacement's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Hockey Hell
Country: Canada
Posts: 39,460
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian slips View Post
From a respected poster such as yourself, your logic is truly gargbage. IF he is good enough to crack the NHL he will get there...playing in Moscow for a year doesnt preclude that.

If he isint good enough to play in the NHL then he is making a wise decision to take the payday now. Unless you're making millions of dollars a year, its utterly ridiculous for someone to say he is stupid to turn down that kind of money.

Have you seen him play? I havent - but, my concern is that this is potentially another, in a long series of mistakes, made by this organization. From the artilces Ive read, it seems the Oilers didnt do a good job selling him on the merits of go over to NA.

No one can predict the future, but arent you at least a little concerned that he has done something that NO ONE his age has EVER done in the SEL??? Doesnt it make you a little mad or disappointed in the Oilers not signing him? Or are you blinded by your sheeplike fandom?
No one has seen him play in this environment. One can't predict how he would perform here. It is an unknown.

Maximum rookie money in a capped league is a big decision and not one the Oilers were wanting to enter into given a plethora of likely similar talent and attribute in the ranks.

They made that decision.

Omark at this price was deemed expendable.

Mistake?

Who knows?

Replacement is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:59 PM
  #219
jadeddog
Registered User
 
jadeddog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Regina, Saskatchewan
Posts: 12,139
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HemmersaJemmer View Post
I don't get why everyone is so angry? He is still Oilers property. Just instead of playing in the AHL next year he will be in the KHL.
nopers, hes not.... he goes back into the draft this summer

jadeddog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 01:59 PM
  #220
Tyrolean
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Country: Austria
Posts: 6,733
vCash: 500
He did the logic thing and that is to get a lot of money early. Of course, if he bombs in the KHL, his future bargaining position will not be so bright for the NHL. The AHL is a not a great option for most players if they can't make the NHL.

Most fans here are deluded into thinking just because you have the best league in the world, that all players want to come here.

Tyrolean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 02:01 PM
  #221
Giant Moo
Registered User
 
Giant Moo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,110
vCash: 500
Of course we can make a prediction even though we haven't seen him play here. That sort of thing is done all the time, every day, in every industry possible.

What no one can make is a guarantee.

If he got 3rd/4th line minutes and some 2nd PP time, I could see 15-10-25. Which is about where he should start.

But he's posturing for a lot more than that.

We may miss out in that case... but there are plenty of other similar fish in the sea. The last thing we need right now is to take fliers on rookies who refuse to play in the AHL. Sends the wrong message on so many levels.

Giant Moo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 02:03 PM
  #222
Copperhead
Registered User
 
Copperhead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,772
vCash: 500
I like what Jonathan Willis said over on OilersNation.com

http://www.oilersnation.com/2009/04/...nd-for-russia/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan Willis
The fact that he isn’t coming over can only be regarded as a negative, and if in fact the reason for his defection was that the Oilers refused to guarantee an NHL roster spot (as has been reported), somebody should lose their job.

This is the same team that’s spent roster spots on marginal talents like Liam Reddox and Jeff Deslauriers just in this past season – there’s no reason not to guarantee Omark a spot as 14th forward. This was a low-risk, high-reward scenario, and if that was the sticking point it was a bad one.
He also mentions the Desjardins numbers for Omark based on his productions this year:
Omark: 82GP – 28G – 39A – 67PTS

I would have been very surprised if he had performed this well, but nonetheless it gives you some idea what one could hope from him.

I would like to note that the bolded line there doesn't exactly make sense to me. You do need fourth line players that can muck it up. And for half the year JDD was our backup. For the other half we would've lost him on waivers.

Nonetheless this is a mistake by Steve Tambellini. We could have easily afforded to pay him the max for an entry level deal. If he reaches the bonuses then great it means he played well.

Copperhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 02:05 PM
  #223
Tyrolean
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Country: Austria
Posts: 6,733
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hemskyfan83 View Post
I like what Jonathan Willis said over on OilersNation.com

http://www.oilersnation.com/2009/04/...nd-for-russia/



He also mentions the Desjardins numbers for Omark based on his productions this year:
Omark: 82GP – 28G – 39A – 67PTS

I would have been very surprised if he had performed this well, but nonetheless it gives you some idea what one could hope from him.

I would like to note that the bolded line there doesn't exactly make sense to me. You do need fourth line players that can muck it up. And for half the year JDD was our backup. For the other half we would've lost him on waivers.

Nonetheless this is a mistake by Steve Tambellini. We could have easily afforded to pay him the max for an entry level deal. If he reaches the bonuses then great it means he played well.
Oilers are a poorly managed organization and this proves it. There is no light at the end of the tunnel unless these clowns are gone.

Tyrolean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 02:08 PM
  #224
oilsands
shut 'em down.
 
oilsands's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Halland
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,776
vCash: 500
I am loving all these guys from Sweden in this thread (although good on ya for sticking up for a countryman).

Why should the Oilers offer him a 1way deal and $1+ mill?? He has not proven that he can play in the NHL. If he comes up here and stinks it up, we are stuck with a a contract and minus one roster spot. There are tons of Euros that light it up in less physical leagues, and yet cannot hold a candle in the NHL.

He has to prove that he can play in the NHL before he gets an NHL CONTRACT. Thats why players who are drafted at 18 usually see 1-4 years in the juniors or minors (with world tournaments like U20, etc). They are given an entry level two-way deal, so the team is shielded against poor performance. This is their time to prove themselves.

No offense, but lighting up the SEL as a 22yo is not proving you can play in the NHL. Who knows, this could bite the Oilers mngment in the behind. But, Omark is soon going to learn the fun of playing in the KHL:

- Your ass is owned by the team
- No union, you MAY get payed
- Intimidation and threats from your coaching staff
- Poor facilities
- Lower level of competition

Maybe he would have worked out if a team with the Islanders held his rights. But right now we have about 7 SMALL guys competing for four Top 6 roster spots..... want to introduce another one?

oilsands is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-08-2009, 02:09 PM
  #225
Pure
Registered User
 
Pure's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 9,955
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian slips View Post
have u seen him play?
Don't bother with him, Polak said Omark was going to be the best player in the Northwest Division.

Pure is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:29 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2015 All Rights Reserved.