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How high of a first rounder could kaberle get at draft?
I don't think a non-playoff team would want him at the expense of a top 15 prospects in this years draft so your looking at something in between pick 15 and pick 30.
if toronto has the 7th or 8th pick and want to move up to 1-5 range then I can see some team in that range trading there pick for toronto's pick and kaberle.
say isles trade 1st overall pick- toronto for 8th pick and kaberle
or say tb pick (2nd or 3rd pick) -- toronto for 8th pick and kaberle
thats how the leafs get in the top 5 in draft
Explain to me why a team like the Isles would trade down in this draft unless being totally overpaid. Kaberle and To`s 1st won`t get you the Isles pick. Not even close.Isles are in complete rebuild and they want another 30yo d-man thats a UFA in 2 years WHY?
Kaberle's value at the draft will be lower than his value at the deadline... teams still have the UFA option (JBo) where they don't have to give up anything... and most teams drafting high will be rebuild modes anyways, where a high 1st rounder will be given more value than a veteran defender.
if Toronto moves him at the draft, they will get a lot less for him than waiting till the deadline.
I'm not sure if his value will necessarily be lower, but you are right that there will be alot of teams that will be looking at the UFA options before deciding on the trade route.
If nobody bites on draft day, I could see a trade happening in the offseason once the big UFA's are gone... And the bargaining chip will be the 2010 first round pick. Sure, teams like Ottawa and Dallas might not be interested in trading their 2009 top 10 draft pick. But, there are a few teams like this that underperformed this year. And will be expecting to do MUCH better next year. They might be willing to play the odds and trade their 2010 1st rounder, hoping that their team, with the addition of Kaberle, could put them, at least, into the playoffs and a worse drafting position for next year. And Burke might be willing to take that risk too, depending on the team...
So, I could definitely see, after the UFAs are gone, a team like Buffalo, Ottawa, Florida, Dallas (and probably a few others) looking at their D, and thinking they are a good puck moving Dman away from moving up the standings into a playoff spot. So, in my opinion, they'll be willing to trade 2010 first round pick + good prospect (+ maybe a redundant younger roster player for Kaberle).
Which is expected to be a weak draft year (at least in comparison to the 2009 draft class).
Agreed... but, Burke might not have the choice. This year's 1st round picks are seemingly over-valued (at least on these boards), so he might not get a good package.
His choice might be Kaberle for 2009 1st round pick (15-20 overall)
OR
Kaberle for 2010 1st round pick (? overall) + good prospect
Unless Burke has his eye on someone specific in this year's draft, he might be willing to take the latter...
However, having said that, Burke will value 2009 picks > 2010 picks, not just because this year is supposed to be deeper, but because a 2009 pick will most likely play in the NHL earlier than a 2010 pick. This seems to be something Burke does value...
a Kas trade will be 1st+, and that pick will be below 15.
Using him to move up from 7-8 is interesting, but they wont get Tavares. It would (and i doubt it happens) be more like Kab + Tor 1st for #3-5 + something (top prospect, young roster player, etc..).
Toronto blew their chance at Tavares/Hedman by winning so dang much (i kid i kid)
If any team gives up a first-rounder for Kaberle, they're getting screwed. Just because he's the best player on a bottom-feeder doesn't mean he's automatically worth a first-rounder (and the number of Leafs homers who come around here won't change that). He's suspect defensively and his offense doesn't reconcile for that.
Further, it's a deep draft and the cap is lowering in coming years. Therefore, the value of a first-round pick (and even an early second) is higher than it has been in recent years.
if toronto has the 7th or 8th pick and want to move up to 1-5 range then I can see some team in that range trading there pick for toronto's pick and kaberle.
say isles trade 1st overall pick- toronto for 8th pick and kaberle
or say tb pick (2nd or 3rd pick) -- toronto for 8th pick and kaberle
Just because he's the best player on a bottom-feeder doesn't mean he's automatically worth a first-rounder (and the number of Leafs homers who come around here won't change that).
Conversely, just because he is on the Leafs doesn't mean he's not worth a first-rounder (and the number of Leafs haters who come around here won't change that).
But seriously, there is a chance we see his value this summer. If Burke decides to keep him, we'll never really know and all this speculation will be just that... speculation.
Conversely, just because he is on the Leafs doesn't mean he's not worth a first-rounder (and the number of Leafs haters who come around here won't change that).
But seriously, there is a chance we see his value this summer. If Burke decides to keep him, we'll never really know and all this speculation will be just that... speculation.
If the action potential threshold for Burke to move Kaberle is a first-rounder, expect to see him back next year. He's just not that good of a player.
If the action potential threshold for Burke to move Kaberle is a first-rounder, expect to see him back next year. He's just not that good of a player.
Sure, you are entitled to that opinion... Doesn't make it the truth. And I don't think you'll find that the majority of people (Leafs fans or otherwise) will agree with you.
Heck, I would guess that the majority of people who make a living off of hockey (players, coaches, scouts) would also disagree with you.
honestly I wouldn't mind if Dallas took a look at Kaberle, but I'd prefer the Stars give up one of their high rank prospects and a solid roster player .. maybe something like Ivan Vishnevskiy and Trevor Daley for Tomas Kaberle
Brenden Morrow - Brad Richards - Fabian Brunnstrom
Steve Ott - Mike Ribeiro - Loui Eriksson
James Neal - Mike Modano - Jere Lehtinen
Brian Sutherby - Tom Wandell - Raymond Sawada
Tomas Kaberle - Nicklas Grossman
Sergei Zubov - Matt Niskanen
Mark Fistric - Stephane Robidas
This is complete BS. Where are you getting this information from?
Kaberle on an off year was still on pace fo 47 points. Not bad considering he plays on a bottom feeder and he supposedly losing his skill at 30 years old.
Kaberle is by no means a top defender in the league but I tend to find Kabby is either overrated by Leafs fans and very underrated by all others.
Kaberle is a tremendous top 4 dman who can log 25 mins a night, instantly improve your PP and transition game and give you 50+ points a season. If a team is looking for a puck mover in hs prime that will improve the PP then Kabby is your man.
A 1st and a team's 2nd or 3rd best prospect is a great return. I'm using the typical "Carle, Wishart, 1st" default and taking out the "Carle". Wishart was the Sharks 2nd (or maybe 3rd) best prospect, behind Couture (and maybe Petrecki), and a 1st went to Tampa for Boyle.
Kaberle is worth quite a bit more to any team than Antropov. I like Antropov, but he's not Top 20-25 at his poisition, as Kaberle is.
I think Kaberle can get a first-rounder, but I doubt it's anything higher than a 10th, for the reasons most often cited in this thread.
The Blues, for example, should be drafting between 13th and 16th, and I doubt very seriously they'd give up that pick for Kaberle.
That's just looking at the Blues' situation specifically, though, and there's nothing to suggest that another team also drafting in that same range -- your Nashvilles, Anaheims, Edmontons and Columbuses -- wouldn't be interested.
(i kid i kid)
