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Old
04-08-2009, 06:34 PM
  #26
Dark Knight
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I'd keep Kubina in Toronto.

He's not the problem. And with Burke saying he'd like to make the playoffs next year, I think he could be a very valuable defenseman. He's a good player. I'll keep him.

If the proposal somehow involves a solid goaltending prospect like Varlamov, or a more solid D prospect like Carlson, I'll think about it.

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Old
04-08-2009, 07:39 PM
  #27
Schenn
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washington could throw in nylander to dump slary too, leafs could take it on

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04-09-2009, 08:28 AM
  #28
Drake1588
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Morrisonn is very available. Decent player, if a little inconsistent, but there is room to move him to make roster space for a prospect or two, starting with Alzner (who will be a regular next season).

The Capitals are right at the salary cap. Tomas Fleischmann makes $725K this year, will make $725K next year, and has scored 20 goals this year. He isn't going to be anywhere but Washington next season. He is too valuable versus his cap hit for Washington to move him.

I am a Kubina fan, but that salary doesn't fit, not unless the Caps can trade Nylander first or deal away a significant salary or two.

That said, if a team is taking a salary on the books like Nylander, Clark, Pothier or something, there is more room to maneuver.

This proposed deal, however, has more salary going to Washington than going the other way, and in a single player to boot, and that is a deal breaker. Washington certainly needs defensive help, but it can't break the bank in addressing that need. Tricky.

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04-09-2009, 08:59 AM
  #29
DougGilmour93
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Not a bad offer, just not one I'd pull the trigger on.

Maybe Osala and a 2nd in 09

for

Kubina


????

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Old
04-09-2009, 09:06 AM
  #30
Drake1588
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Originally Posted by DougGilmour93 View Post
Not a bad offer, just not one I'd pull the trigger on.

Maybe Osala and a 2nd in 09

for

Kubina


????
The Caps have to take on even more salary in that proposal than in the original proposal, for which there is no cap room. The Caps are also very high on Osala's potential to replace depth wingers in a year or less.

If this is somehow envisioned as a way in which the Maple Leafs shed salary while picking up some young talent, the Caps are a terrible trade partner. The Caps are going to need to shed salary themselves. They can do some of that by letting UFAs walk and dressing ready-for-prime-time prospects for 2009-10, and they will have to make hard choices in Summer 2010.

They can't take on $5M players, not unless Nylander goes the other way. They certainly can't take on $5M in exchange for pure futures.

The bottom line is that a team that needs to shed veteran contracts (Washington) is a terrible trade fit for a rebuilding club looking to trade veterans and acquire prospects and youth (Toronto).

Toronto and Washington are not sound trading partners, unless the Maple Leafs are prepared to take a dump, probably Nylander.

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04-09-2009, 09:28 AM
  #31
DougGilmour93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588 View Post
The Caps have to take on even more salary in that proposal than in the original proposal, for which there is no cap room. The Caps are also very high on Osala's potential to replace depth wingers in a year or less.

If this is somehow envisioned as a way in which the Maple Leafs shed salary while picking up some young talent, the Caps are a terrible trade partner. The Caps are going to need to shed salary themselves. They can do some of that by letting UFAs walk and dressing ready-for-prime-time prospects for 2009-10, and they will have to make hard choices in Summer 2010.

They can't take on $5M players, not unless Nylander goes the other way. They certainly can't take on $5M in exchange for pure futures.

The bottom line is that a team that needs to shed veteran contracts (Washington) is a terrible trade fit for a rebuilding club looking to trade veterans and acquire prospects and youth (Toronto).

Toronto and Washington are not sound trading partners, unless the Maple Leafs are prepared to take a dump, probably Nylander.

maybe add in another dump, just not Nylander. And with whatever dump you add in you'd have to add in asset for us to take that dump on. The higher the salary, longer the contract, the better the asset.

As for teh Kubina deal, replace Osala with Fehr perhaps?


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Old
04-09-2009, 09:39 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588 View Post
That said, if a team is taking a salary on the books like Nylander, Clark, Pothier or something, there is more room to maneuver.

This proposed deal, however, has more salary going to Washington than going the other way, and in a single player to boot, and that is a deal breaker. Washington certainly needs defensive help, but it can't break the bank in addressing that need. Tricky.
Yeah, the cap situation in Washington is something that I was unsure of. There's certainly no problem with Toronto taking on salary, assuming it isn't long-term. I didn't see any easy candidates for that in Washington though, excluding Nylander, who is probably unlikely to waive his NTC. Poti gets a big salary, but he plays a huge role on the team, and I don't know what Pothier's status is health-wise.

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04-09-2009, 10:13 AM
  #33
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Washington can drop almost $8 million next season in the form of Fedorov, Kozlov and Brashear. All 3 can be replaced from within. Add Morrisonn and we're up to $10 million.

They don't have to move the untradeable Nylander to bring in Kubina.

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Old
04-09-2009, 10:20 AM
  #34
DougGilmour93
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Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Washington can drop almost $8 million next season in the form of Fedorov, Kozlov and Brashear. All 3 can be replaced from within. Add Morrisonn and we're up to $10 million.

They don't have to move the untradeable Nylander to bring in Kubina.
Nice. Thanks

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Old
04-09-2009, 10:50 AM
  #35
Drake1588
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Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Washington can drop almost $8 million next season in the form of Fedorov, Kozlov and Brashear. All 3 can be replaced from within. Add Morrisonn and we're up to $10 million.

They don't have to move the untradeable Nylander to bring in Kubina.
Now add the cap hits of the players who replace those guys. Explain who plays second-line center. Maybe that's Nylander, but he's shown an inability to perform in that role consistently this season. Whenever healthy, that role has gone to Fedorov. Who in the system can replace Fedorov? Clark is going to be a $2.633M cap hit next year, so subtract him from the savings as well.

They probably bring Kozov back, for his ability to play a utility role at center or wing on the top three scoring lines. Pothier will be on the Capitals' books all next year.

If I had to guess, I would suggest that it is the Washington "acquisitions" for the blueline next year that will come from within: Brian Pothier for a full year ($2.5M) and Karl Alzner ($1.6M). Maybe someone like Morrisonn or Jurcina is let go to make room.


Last edited by Drake1588: 04-09-2009 at 10:56 AM.
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Old
04-09-2009, 11:00 AM
  #36
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The original trade is a very good one, something I'm not used to seeing around these parts. Really, kudos on a job well done.

But as Drake points it out, the nitty-gritty details on exactly what Washington Management wants to do with the team next year will make it a lot more complicated to get somthing like this done. A lot of it depends on what Washington does in the post season this year.

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Old
04-09-2009, 11:04 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588 View Post
Now add the cap hits of the players who replace those guys. Explain who plays second-line center. Maybe that's Nylander, but he's shown an inability to perform in that role consistently this season. Whenever healthy, that role has gone to Fedorov. Who in the system can replace Fedorov? Clark is going to be a $2.66M cap hit next year, so subtract him from the savings as well.

They probably bring Kozov back, for his ability to play a utility role at center or wing on the top three scoring lines. Pothier will be on the Capitals' books all next year.

If I had to guess, I would suggest that it is the Washington "acquisitions" for the blueline next year that will come from within: Brian Pothier for a full year ($2.5M) and Karl Alzner ($1.6M). Maybe someone like Morrisonn or Jurcina is let go to make room.
I just don't think we have a choice about playing Nylander as the 2nd line center. No one's going to take him unless McPhee's a magician. And Fedorov's neither a $4 million player nor a reliable option at 2nd line center. He'll be 40 and he's missed 40% of the games this year with lower body injuries.

I guess they could bring back Kozlov for his position flexibility, but it kind of seems a waste since we're flush with NHL RWs and we have 2-3 more in Hershey with a real shot to make the team out of camp.

Relative to today's roster:

Out: Feds $4.0 + Koz $2.5 + Mo $2.0 + Brashear $1.3 + Jurcina $0.9
In: Clark $2.7 + Alzner $1.6

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Old
04-09-2009, 11:07 AM
  #38
Drake1588
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Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
I just don't think we have a choice about playing Nylander as the 2nd line center. No one's going to take him unless McPhee's a magician. And Fedorov's neither a $4 million player nor a reliable option at 2nd line center. He'll be 40 and he's missed 40% of the games this year with lower body injuries.

I guess they could bring back Kozlov for his position flexibility, but it kind of seems a waste since we're flush with NHL RWs and we have 2-3 more in Hershey with a real shot to make the team out of camp.
The question isn't purely whether they play Nylander at #2 center, or bring back an aging Fedorov. Option #3 is bringing in another center.

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Old
04-09-2009, 11:10 AM
  #39
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The question isn't purely whether they play Nylander at #2 center, or bring back an aging Fedorov. Option #3 is bringing in another center.
There's an idea I can get behind. But looking at the UFA centers, this would probably necessitate a trade.

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Old
04-09-2009, 11:31 AM
  #40
Drake1588
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There's an idea I can get behind. But looking at the UFA centers, this would probably necessitate a trade.
To make it work in a numbers sense, it might have to be a risk and a reclamation project sort of move, but I agree that it's not as simple as wading into UFA and picking up a sure thing at center.

I'm not really sure what the team will do. There are some high-octane players on the roster, some of whom are cheap for a year, some of whom are going to get big raises the year after. Next year, Backstrom, Semin and Fleischmann are bargains. In Summer 2010, all three get big raises as RFAs. Backstrom will be a $6M+ player. Semin could come in around the same. Fleischmann? Maybe $2.5M. Something gives at that point, probably starting with a buyout of Nylander's final season, but probably also including a big trade (Semin in June/July 2010, would be my guess).

To the extent that the club can keep around its young talent, I think it chooses to do so. Osala, Fehr, Fleischmann... these are players whose value is high as replacements for players the team might not be able to keep after a year, even if they are seeming luxuries at the moment.

Something I might like even more than a move at center is a move to pick up a reclamation project on defense... a guy you could get for $1.5M to $2M whose game has gone stagnant somewhere, but who could thrive in a new environment.

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Old
04-09-2009, 12:52 PM
  #41
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Value wise its a great deal but i think the leafs would want a draft pick back

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Old
04-09-2009, 01:47 PM
  #42
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Hey if we trade flash, don't resign Koz, we can keep Semin permenantly on AO's line and use the Laich-Nyls-Fehr line as a 2nd line! They've been clicking enough for 2 games to give it a shot as a plan for the entire year!

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