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Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

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Old
04-10-2009, 02:41 PM
  #26
Please
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this is sarcasm...if its not....

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Old
04-10-2009, 02:54 PM
  #27
Jaded-Fan
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I love to hear how overrated Staal is when there have been 500 trade proposals for him over the last couple of years here including at least 30 from Oiler fans. How many proposals have Pens' fans made for Oiler players? And if he is so overrated why do you all keep making proposals, however moronic, to get him?

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Old
04-10-2009, 03:07 PM
  #28
Giggli G
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
I love to hear how overrated Staal is when there have been 500 trade proposals for him over the last couple of years here including at least 30 from Oiler fans. How many proposals have Pens' fans made for Oiler players? And if he is so overrated why do you all keep making proposals, however moronic, to get him?
You simply restated what I showed you were being ridiculous about. Am I supposed to respond when you won't engage in a real discussion?

Enjoy your prejudice.

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Old
04-10-2009, 03:11 PM
  #29
Jaded-Fan
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Originally Posted by Giggli G View Post
You simply restated what I showed you were being ridiculous about. Am I supposed to respond when you won't engage in a real discussion?

Enjoy your prejudice.
Intense sustained interest in aquiring over a long period of time = evidence of percieved value. Is that so hard to understand?

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Old
04-10-2009, 03:15 PM
  #30
Giggli G
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
Intense sustained interest in aquiring over a long period of time = evidence of percieved value. Is that so hard to understand?
Yeah, it is. Probably because the people who have sustained interest are the very same people you just generalized as being stupid. You negate your own point, proving that you really haven't thought this through.

Cheers

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Old
04-10-2009, 03:19 PM
  #31
Captain Hook
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Originally Posted by Giggli G View Post
No, it isn't even close to fair value based on current play. Visnovsky was on pace to easily outscore Jordan Staal as a #1 Defenseman playing against top lines with a ridiculously low goals against/60. Trading Vis for Staal straight up would set our franchise back at least three years. Even taking to account Staal's likelihood of improving the Oilers don't do this deal.
Good points. I haven't seen much of him since he left L.A. Good to hear he's doing so well in Edmonton.

Staal also plays a lot against top lines though. He's the Pens top pk'er + he's really picked it up offensively the last month or so. He's finally started to realize some of that potential.

Both teams wouldn't do this deal. As you say, Vis is outplaying Staal right now and the Pens don't have a need for another D-Man, especially if it cost Staal.

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Old
04-10-2009, 03:19 PM
  #32
Giggli G
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Good points. I haven't seen much of him since he left L.A. Good to hear he's doing so well in Edmonton.

Staal also plays a lot against top lines though. He's the Pens top pk'er + he's really picked it up offensively the last month or so. He's finally started to realize some of that potential.

Both teams wouldn't do this deal. As you say, Vis is outplaying Staal right now and the Pens don't have a need for another D-Man, especially if it cost Staal.
Exactly. Thank you for being reasonable! I understand there are reasons why the Pens might not do the deal.

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Old
04-10-2009, 03:48 PM
  #33
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one of the worst trades ive seen

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Old
04-10-2009, 03:53 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Ghostbuster View Post
Picking up Staal gives us a backup of centers as well.
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Originally Posted by JTG32005 View Post
Edmonton doesn't need more centers.
This is just painful to read.

It has driven me mental to read Oiler fans talking about how many centers the team has, yet read the same Oiler fans talking about how Horcoff's crappy season is because he had to be on the ice for every defensive zone faceoff and every penalty kill and every time the opponent's top line was on the ice.

Yeah, we've got loads of centers! And except for Horcoff, none of them can win a faceoff or kill a penalty or go head to head against quality opposition. It's painful.

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Old
04-10-2009, 03:55 PM
  #35
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Haha ... no.

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Old
04-10-2009, 05:34 PM
  #36
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to Pens fans laughing at this? The laugh should be coming frmo edmonton. Visnovsky is a top 15 D, who is underrated defensively and can play on the PP. Jordan Staal is a 50 point 2nd liner at best who also plays on the PK. Tangradi wipes Nilsson away I agree with that but Tangradi over Nilsson does not make up the difference between Visnovsky and Staal, no way! Visnovsky's injury is the reason we aren't in the playoffs. With the loss of Whitney Visnovsky would be a nice fit there.

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Old
04-10-2009, 06:02 PM
  #37
Giggli G
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Originally Posted by OilGagner89 View Post
to Pens fans laughing at this? The laugh should be coming frmo edmonton. Visnovsky is a top 15 D, who is underrated defensively and can play on the PP. Jordan Staal is a 50 point 2nd liner at best who also plays on the PK. Tangradi wipes Nilsson away I agree with that but Tangradi over Nilsson does not make up the difference between Visnovsky and Staal, no way! Visnovsky's injury is the reason we aren't in the playoffs. With the loss of Whitney Visnovsky would be a nice fit there.
Don't worry, the Pens fans on this board categorically overrate Jordan Staal. I just wish more would be less arrogant and uninformed when they are doing it.

They treat him as though he is Eric Staal.

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Old
04-10-2009, 07:20 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Giggli G View Post
Don't worry, the Pens fans on this board categorically overrate Jordan Staal. I just wish more would be less arrogant and uninformed when they are doing it.

They treat him as though he is Eric Staal.
So condescension is ok, but arrogant and uninformed isn't? I'll have to remember that.

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Old
04-10-2009, 07:31 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Giggli G View Post
Don't worry, the Pens fans on this board categorically overrate Jordan Staal. I just wish more would be less arrogant and uninformed when they are doing it.

They treat him as though he is Eric Staal.
This perception arises from the fact that there have been about 500 different proposals for a Staal trade and Pens fans have started about 10 of them. If the guy is overrated only by Pens fans, then why don't I see 500 trade threads for Max Talbot, another player that we can be accused of overrating?

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Old
04-10-2009, 07:33 PM
  #40
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Lol I love the guy sitting here thanking people for being reasonable while he declares that "the Pens fans on this board" overrate Staal, not just some but evidently all of us. This is how Staal has apparently become overrated around here

proposal

Team A sends
some **** 3rd liner
a late pick
some expensive has been the Pens don't need

Pens send

Stall

so Pens fans come in and are quick to point out that this retarded proposal won't be getting you anything, they then discuss the merits of Staal and then the guy who makes the proposal comes in to say oh you are overrating him you would be stupid to not take this deal. If it wasn't for so many idiots posting poorly thought, moronic Staal proposals nobody would rant on about Pens fans overvaluing Staal, but because we shoot down basically any Staal proposal (almost entirely because they are stupid at best) that equates to Staal being overrated evidently.


Last edited by Morozov: 04-10-2009 at 07:42 PM.
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Old
04-10-2009, 07:39 PM
  #41
Morozov
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OilGagner89 View Post
to Pens fans laughing at this? The laugh should be coming frmo edmonton. Visnovsky is a top 15 D, who is underrated defensively and can play on the PP. Jordan Staal is a 50 point 2nd liner at best who also plays on the PK. Tangradi wipes Nilsson away I agree with that but Tangradi over Nilsson does not make up the difference between Visnovsky and Staal, no way! Visnovsky's injury is the reason we aren't in the playoffs. With the loss of Whitney Visnovsky would be a nice fit there.
Visnovsky would be a nice fit here if we could spend as much money as we wanted and there was no cap. "the loss of Whitney" was because he was surplus to our needs just like Visnovsky would be. I don't care about the merits of Visnovsky because we have somebody who is better right now and we have two young ones being groomed to take over. We don't have 5.6 million to spend every year for the next four seasons after this one on a guy who would be our second best dman, taking on 1.6 million extra, limiting our cap space to fix our wing issues and creating a hole of 20 minutes a night up front does not work for the Pens whatsoever. There is more to a trade than simply Visnovsky betta dan Stall so stupid Pens shuld do da deal. Also 50 point 2nd liner at best yes, but that is at best right now, he is 20 ffs, or do you really think his potential is that low.

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Old
04-10-2009, 08:04 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Giggli G View Post
Don't worry, the Pens fans on this board categorically overrate Jordan Staal. I just wish more would be less arrogant and uninformed when they are doing it.

They treat him as though he is Eric Staal.
That may be so...but we are not the ones always including him in trade proposals. If we overrate him so much, why the hell does everyone seem to want them on their team...

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Old
04-10-2009, 09:01 PM
  #43
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As a Pens fan i agree Vishnovsky has greater value now then Staal. Staal is still basically considered a prospect and it is hard to say what his ceiling is. He may never be as valuable or as big of an impact player on Pittsburgh as Vish is for Edmonton.

Saying that however i would argue that Gonchar is as good, if not better then Vishnovsky is at this point in their careers. In order to add Vishnovsky the Penguins would have to move Gonchar because that blueline cannot hold that much salary between those 2.

So basically what would have to happen is the Penguins would lose Staal and Gonchar to add Vishnovsky to their pro roster in order to make this work. I am sure Gonchar could fetch a decent return but why replace equal parts at the expense of Staal????


Too me the most laughable part of the deal is Nilsson for Tangardi. Tangardi is now our #1 prospect and Nilsson has been the wanna-be prospect whipping boy for the last 4 years between NY and Edmonton. Why would the Penguins EVER consider making this swap is beyond me.

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Old
04-10-2009, 10:06 PM
  #44
WickedWrister
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Originally Posted by OilGagner89 View Post
to Pens fans laughing at this? The laugh should be coming frmo edmonton. Visnovsky is a top 15 D, who is underrated defensively and can play on the PP. Jordan Staal is a 50 point 2nd liner at best who also plays on the PK. Tangradi wipes Nilsson away I agree with that but Tangradi over Nilsson does not make up the difference between Visnovsky and Staal, no way! Visnovsky's injury is the reason we aren't in the playoffs. With the loss of Whitney Visnovsky would be a nice fit there.
News Flash. Staal is a 50 point player RIGHT NOW. It's idiotic to think that he has peaked.

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Old
04-10-2009, 10:21 PM
  #45
Morozov
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WickedWrister View Post
News Flash. Staal is a 50 point player RIGHT NOW. It's idiotic to think that he has peaked.
20 is the new 30 if you hadn't heard.

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Old
04-11-2009, 09:41 PM
  #46
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This makes no sense at all from the Pens' perspective. Gonchar is only 2 years (and chance) older than Visnovsky and signed for one more year at a lower cap hit than V. There is no need to trade for an offensive defenseman. And especially not if it costs two 20 year old, big forwards. One of which has already played 270 NHL games and posted two 20 goal seasons.

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Old
04-12-2009, 10:31 AM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OilGagner89 View Post
to Pens fans laughing at this? The laugh should be coming frmo edmonton. Visnovsky is a top 15 D, who is underrated defensively and can play on the PP. Jordan Staal is a 50 point 2nd liner at best who also plays on the PK. Tangradi wipes Nilsson away I agree with that but Tangradi over Nilsson does not make up the difference between Visnovsky and Staal, no way! Visnovsky's injury is the reason we aren't in the playoffs. With the loss of Whitney Visnovsky would be a nice fit there.
Is Gagner a 41 point player at best who does not play on the PK?

Just curious.

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Old
04-12-2009, 10:43 AM
  #48
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this is beyond awful for pit

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