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Interesting thought from Zipay in today's chat

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Old
04-14-2009, 04:40 PM
  #26
HoosierDaddy
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I let him walk for far less than that. If the Rangers pay him a cent over 4 million per on a multi year deal, Id be incensed.

He's still relatively young, but Zherdev strikes me as the kind of guy who is perfectly content being a 60 point complimentary player despite a boatload of talent.
You mean the underacheiving Nick Zherdev that tied for the team scoring lead despite playing around 5 minutes (16.49 ATOI) less than the co-leader Gomez (21.03 ATOI) and nowhere near as much PP time?

Would you walk if other mediocre players get paid over $7MM? Why all the Z hate? He's a freakin bargain. Even at $4MM.

But if he can get us a boatload of #1's I'll help him pack. Ooops, never mind. I forget sometimes the Baffoon from Banf-f-f is running the draft.

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Old
04-14-2009, 05:08 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by HoosierDaddy View Post
You mean the underacheiving Nick Zherdev that tied for the team scoring lead despite playing around 5 minutes (16.49 ATOI) less than the co-leader Gomez (21.03 ATOI) and nowhere near as much PP time?

Would you walk if other mediocre players get paid over $7MM? Why all the Z hate? He's a freakin bargain. Even at $4MM.

But if he can get us a boatload of #1's I'll help him pack. Ooops, never mind. I forget sometimes the Baffoon from Banf-f-f is running the draft.
Dont really know what Gomez has to do with this considering he was an UFA and our GM is an idiot when it comes to signing those types of players.

Theres no hate for Z either, but how can you argue that hes not a complimentary 60 point player who hasnt shown a willingness to get better on a consistent basis? The fact that hes one of the best forwards on a team that cant score and has no elite talent is inconsequential. In fact, it makes him part of the problem. Torts has shown that he embraces the guys that give it their all despite their talent level. He challenged Vinny Lecavalier and he answered the bell....I hope Zherdev does the same, but I have a feeling he wont.

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Old
04-14-2009, 06:31 PM
  #28
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He challenged Vinny Lecavalier and he answered the bell....I hope Zherdev does the same, but I have a feeling he wont.
agreed.

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Old
04-16-2009, 07:54 PM
  #29
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I don't think he's going back to Russia but I don't think he's back here either. Need $ to sign Antro and just not Torts' kind of player. Someone will take a flyer on his (still unrealized) potential.

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Old
04-16-2009, 08:14 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
If we get rid of Rozsival though our defense is going to be even worse than it is this season. The guy isn't anything special, but he does eat up minutes in a lot of games.

I think we might have to live with the reality that our defense and offense might take a bit hit this offseason, which sucks since both are only average as it is. I have faith, but my gut feeling is we don't make the playoffs next year because the team will be crippled more than ever by the contracts.

There is still a chance that Morris, Mara, and one or even both or Zherdev and Antropov might not return. Sather is going to have to work some miracles, because if that happens we'll be the Islanders next year.
i dont think so. in fact potter if he continues to play like he did this season, will be just like rosival, if not better. he is calm under pressure and in my opinion is better defensively than rosival. he is also faster and more physical. in my opinion rosival and morris are both goners. mara i think the rangers will retain on a 1 or 2 year deal. the reason i think this is because it seems to me like sauer and potter are due a legit chance to perform in the nhl. and if one of them doesnt then sanguietti is just about ready as well. we dont have hte money to get everyone body we want, so personally i think morris' 4 mill will be ogne as well as rosivals 5. orr probably wont be returning due to his recently diminished role.

in addition i would think valiquette will not be resigned, and i also believe naslund might be traded for a late draft pick, unless he somehow scores 7+ goals in the playoffs this year and the rangers can actually get some value from him.

that clears roughly around 14 mill for the rangers. and dont forget that redden's salary is decreasing 1.8 mill and hanks salary is decreasing around 1 mill as well.

so overall around 16 mill to spend in the offseason...

antropov-- 4.5 mill
zherdev-- 3.5 mill
mara-- 1.5 mill
betts-- 1.5 mill
callahan-- 2 mill
dubinsky-- 2 mill
sjostrom-- 1 mill

there is our offseason

if we trade redden as well. well then we can make a run at gaborik but our defense would be in shambles.

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Old
04-16-2009, 08:56 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
i dont think so. in fact potter if he continues to play like he did this season, will be just like rosival, if not better. he is calm under pressure and in my opinion is better defensively than rosival. he is also faster and more physical. in my opinion rosival and morris are both goners. mara i think the rangers will retain on a 1 or 2 year deal. the reason i think this is because it seems to me like sauer and potter are due a legit chance to perform in the nhl. and if one of them doesnt then sanguietti is just about ready as well. we dont have hte money to get everyone body we want, so personally i think morris' 4 mill will be ogne as well as rosivals 5. orr probably wont be returning due to his recently diminished role.

in addition i would think valiquette will not be resigned, and i also believe naslund might be traded for a late draft pick, unless he somehow scores 7+ goals in the playoffs this year and the rangers can actually get some value from him.

that clears roughly around 14 mill for the rangers. and dont forget that redden's salary is decreasing 1.8 mill and hanks salary is decreasing around 1 mill as well.

so overall around 16 mill to spend in the offseason...

antropov-- 4.5 mill
zherdev-- 3.5 mill
mara-- 1.5 mill
betts-- 1.5 mill
callahan-- 2 mill
dubinsky-- 2 mill
sjostrom-- 1 mill

there is our offseason

if we trade redden as well. well then we can make a run at gaborik but our defense would be in shambles.

this isnt far off.

disagree with you on the morris thing. i actually think hes been one of our best dmen since hes been here. ive been very impressed with his overall game.

i want him resigned.

agree on orr and i would let betts walk too. i like him but he may want to test the waters to see if he can play more. hes gonna play less under torts im afraid and im sure he wants a shot at more minutes than our 4th line. my only problem with losing betts is his solid pk work and his faceoff ability. then again anisimov is a solid faceoff guy so he will help.

agree on vally. well be in the market for a cheap backup or perhaps zaba or wiikman. either way, well need to save some dough here.

rozys gotta go. hes over rated and an underperformer. and too expensive staal/girardi/redden/morris/mara/sauer/potter works for me.

and i do believe some of our youngsters will take less money to get guys signed in return for a wink wink agreement that once we have some cap room, they will be signed to long term deals. young guys like dubi and cally are rangers for life. these guys love this team and want to stay here long term.

good luck moving wade redden. that contract is toxic. hes not going anywhere. and even if we did move him, which we wont, why make a move for athe oft broken gaborik. the guy is brittle and too risky to bet the farm on. no thanks. rather make a play for kovy over go-broke-ik.

bottom line. we need to build around a core of gomez- unless we can move him and drury as our top 2 centerman and zherdev and antro. thats our core.

cannot wait to see anisimov playing 3rd line for us next season and would not be surprised if he got some 2nd line time as well.

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Old
04-16-2009, 09:02 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I let him walk for far less than that. If the Rangers pay him a cent over 4 million per on a multi year deal, Id be incensed.

Hes still relatively young, but Zherdev strikes me as the kind of guy who is perfectly content being a 60 point complimentary player despite a boatload of talent.
So you wouldn't pay a cent over 4 million for a guy who with 60 points would be the highest scorer on the team...a team that already has two forwards making over 7m per season?

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Old
04-16-2009, 09:07 PM
  #33
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So you wouldn't pay a cent over 4 million for a guy who with 60 points would be the highest scorer on the team...a team that already has two forwards making over 7m per season?
The latter is the reason we won't be able too.

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Old
04-16-2009, 09:12 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post
So you wouldn't pay a cent over 4 million for a guy who with 60 points would be the highest scorer on the team...a team that already has two forwards making over 7m per season?
So just because our management made a terrible mistake with the Gomez and Drury contracts means its OK to make another one with Zherdev?

At least Gomez and Drury work hard.

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Old
04-16-2009, 09:13 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post
So you wouldn't pay a cent over 4 million for a guy who with 60 points would be the highest scorer on the team...a team that already has two forwards making over 7m per season?
Different situation... I rarely defend these guys, but Drury and Gomez are both vets in their "prime" years, both have won Cups and shown some some consistency in the NHL.

Zherdev is still young and hasn't reached his potential, and he is nowhere near the talent of guys around his age being paid $7 million. If Z demands that type of money, he will get laughed at. Just as Drury & Gomez do not deserve $7 million, Zherdev doesn't deserve it either. And I can't imagine any franchise would offer that type of money to him.

Also, contract salaries are what the market dictates, not what the other players make on the team. Let's just take Drury & Gomez out of the equation here. When Z is negotiating, he will be comparing himself to other players around his age and around his skill level. He will not be compared to two centers who are around 6 years older than him and play an entirely different game than him.

Just because our GM is an idiot doesn't mean that Zherdev should be the highest paid player on the team.

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Old
04-16-2009, 09:49 PM
  #36
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Zherdev = 3.5 - 4 mil maximum. If he wants more than that he can look elsewhere.

Players should be paid based on what they've already shown they can do, not on what they might do in the future.

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Old
04-16-2009, 09:57 PM
  #37
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Torts likes Rozy, i.e. he isnt going anywhere, despite what you naysayers say.

Torts does not like Naslund IMO. I think he is the guy that leaves.


Edit; Anyone who thinks Potter is or will be even half the defenseman Rozy is is absolutely nuts.

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Old
04-16-2009, 10:36 PM
  #38
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I hope someone signs him to an offer sheet, big or small.

I doubt it happens thiugh, he isn't the type of player that you give up that many picks for.

I could see them trading his rights.

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Old
04-16-2009, 10:59 PM
  #39
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And what does that make zherdev if he walks?
the same. it'll be radulov 2.0 as he begs to crawl back here.

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Old
04-17-2009, 08:46 AM
  #40
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i dont think so. in fact potter if he continues to play like he did this season, will be just like rosival, if not better. .
I stopped reading your post right there. It is a HUGE stretch at best, and delusional at worst.

Too many people act as if it would be simple to replace Roszival, who has been our de facto #1 defenseman for the past 4 seasons and logs 20+ minutes a night. They guy is probably the most underrated Ranger.

Frankly, it sucks that he might be the salary casuality of the offseason out of the big 5 contracts because, besides Henrik, hes the only one that even comes close to equal value. Saying Potter can easily replace him is mindboggling.

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Old
04-17-2009, 11:18 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
i dont think so. in fact potter if he continues to play like he did this season, will be just like rosival, if not better. he is calm under pressure and in my opinion is better defensively than rosival. he is also faster and more physical. in my opinion rosival and morris are both goners. mara i think the rangers will retain on a 1 or 2 year deal. the reason i think this is because it seems to me like sauer and potter are due a legit chance to perform in the nhl. and if one of them doesnt then sanguietti is just about ready as well. we dont have hte money to get everyone body we want, so personally i think morris' 4 mill will be ogne as well as rosivals 5. orr probably wont be returning due to his recently diminished role.

in addition i would think valiquette will not be resigned, and i also believe naslund might be traded for a late draft pick, unless he somehow scores 7+ goals in the playoffs this year and the rangers can actually get some value from him.

that clears roughly around 14 mill for the rangers. and dont forget that redden's salary is decreasing 1.8 mill and hanks salary is decreasing around 1 mill as well.

so overall around 16 mill to spend in the offseason...

antropov-- 4.5 mill
zherdev-- 3.5 mill
mara-- 1.5 mill
betts-- 1.5 mill
callahan-- 2 mill
dubinsky-- 2 mill
sjostrom-- 1 mill

there is our offseason

if we trade redden as well. well then we can make a run at gaborik but our defense would be in shambles.
although i like your assessment, i highly doubt mara is going to take another paycut to stay here. hes played very well this year and he's due for a raise. he makes 1.9 this year, i can see him wanting around 2.5mil....betts makes 600K a year, hes not getting over 1 mil for a fourth line center....he earns his money but i dont see him getting that much in a deal.

as much as i want to keep zherdev, he really has to show in the playoffs that he deserves a raise. if he does, i wouldnt be surprised to see a team come in and offer him a rather large offer sheet. hes got the talent and if hes on a team like detroit, san jose, or even the Kings, he wouldnt be a focal point of the offense. he would be a complimentary player who then would be able to really produce at his will, rather then have pressure on him to produce. if someone came in and we were to get a 1st, 2nd and 3rd, id think about it. but what are the chances of those picks panning out to be great? id rather match the offer and keep what we know we have in zherdev, he was the most consistent player this year offensively. i forget where i read it but the longest streak of games without a point by him was like 4 games. yea he had stretches where he didnt score, but he was still setting up plays which is his main forte.

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