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Holmgren: "kind of cavalier attitude where it's like, 'What's the big deal'"

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Old
04-18-2009, 12:05 PM
  #101
GKJ
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It has less to do with Upshall, and more to do with not fixing the problems that ailed this team. Fixing the problem was not limited to only trading for Bouwmeester.

If they traded Upshall and a 2nd for Mathieu Schneider, they're not pouting and crying or whatever they're doing.

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04-18-2009, 12:09 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
If by blow up they mean trade Lupul, Jones, Biron and grab a goalie like Vokoun and bring up JVR and Sbisa, then by all means blow it up.
Panther fan trolling by, we would gladly trade you Vokoun, if the return was good enough. However, we would not be interested in acquiring the players that create your salary cap issues (i.e. Briere, Lupul, Carle) about the best thing we have going for us, besides DeBoer, is cap room.

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04-18-2009, 12:34 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Dig Out Your Soul View Post
You realize of course that posters on a message board just made this up as an excuse for their poor play, right?
(Yes, I do. And, those posters are wrong. Whatever we lost amounts only to what Upshall directly would've contributed. I don't think the Flyers fell into a post-deadline slump because they miss their beloved brosef.)

Talking to my brother about this has made me start thinking...

Is it possible this was a secondary cause for the Upshall trade?

Was Holmgren attempting to shake up the frat house by evicting the most expendable among the bros?

Perhaps he thought he could dump our hair gel-forward for an angry thumper that had no interest in sandals and cute Olde City condos.

Maybe Holmgren was trying to break up the bromance.

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Old
04-18-2009, 12:54 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Snider had his own friendship issues with Clarke...not saying I think Clarke should have been canned (I don't), but the Flyers have a well established network of former players, etc. that they are very loyal to...from Snider on down (Holmgren being one of 'em).
I thought Clarke resigned because he was burnt out.
I dont have a problem with being loyal. But if a move needs to be made, and if someone isnt getting the job done, then he has to go.
I am sure Barber and Clarke were pretty tight and we know how that went.
Granted it was a different scenerio but yeah, I would seriuosly hope like I said earlier of friendship getting in the way of doing whats right or making a fair evaluation on what needs to be done.

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04-18-2009, 01:33 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Scarfo View Post
(Yes, I do. And, those posters are wrong. Whatever we lost amounts only to what Upshall directly would've contributed. I don't think the Flyers fell into a post-deadline slump because they miss their beloved brosef.)

Talking to my brother about this has made me start thinking...

Is it possible this was a secondary cause for the Upshall trade?

Was Holmgren attempting to shake up the frat house by evicting the most expendable among the bros?

Perhaps he thought he could dump our hair gel-forward for an angry thumper that had no interest in sandals and cute Olde City condos.

Maybe Holmgren was trying to break up the bromance.
The thought has crossed my mind as well.

But, it's tough to say where the so-called "cavalier" attitude comes from. Do they party too much? I'm not able to make that call.

What I do see is that we have played the exact same way under Stevens for three seasons, despite numerous personnel changes.

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04-18-2009, 01:40 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Panther fan trolling by, we would gladly trade you Vokoun, if the return was good enough. However, we would not be interested in acquiring the players that create your salary cap issues (i.e. Briere, Lupul, Carle) about the best thing we have going for us, besides DeBoer, is cap room.
Vokoun and Deboer for whatever it is the Panthers want, outside of a few untouchables. We'll throw in lots of cash and fan support, if that's what it takes.

No?

Okay, then just PD. What he could do with this group....

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Old
04-18-2009, 01:58 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
It has less to do with Upshall, and more to do with not fixing the problems that ailed this team. Fixing the problem was not limited to only trading for Bouwmeester.

If they traded Upshall and a 2nd for Mathieu Schneider, they're not pouting and crying or whatever they're doing.

True

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Old
04-18-2009, 03:08 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
Vokoun and Deboer for whatever it is the Panthers want, outside of a few untouchables. We'll throw in lots of cash and fan support, if that's what it takes.

No?

Okay, then just PD. What he could do with this group....
Very True. The Flyers talent level is sick.

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Old
04-18-2009, 03:25 PM
  #109
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For the sake of discussion, let's pretend that Stevens is shown the door...who is his replacement?

- Probably a little bit of a hard ass? That 'type' of coach would make sense, yes?

Well, here's my issue. If these clowns are still upset that Upshall was traded, how do they respond when a hard ass coach comes in and takes their fun away? I'm not saying it won't work, perhaps it will...maybe it won't.

That remains to be seen.


Personally, I think some of the team has to go...and I can't imagine the reaction around here, because I'm not thinking of a 3rd liner, and we all saw (and still do see) the outcry for Upshall.

Can you imagine if it were a more skilled player?
Not sure if I'm agreeing or disagreeing with you here. Bottom line to me is this. I think it's pretty much universally agreed that this core has the talent to win us more than one cup over the next few years. Maybe it's the overly dramatic reality show society we live in these days but we're treating these grown men like they're a bunch of heartbroken school girls. If they can't bring themselves to react to a situation (Upshall's trade, the playoffs) or a hardass coach to bring them closer to the ultimate goal then they're only going to dissapoint us year after year. I think we owe them some respect, give them that next level coach. If they end up sulking in the corner as a result then it's time to start weeding those players out, no matter who they may be.

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Old
04-18-2009, 08:16 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Scarfo View Post
I'm finished with them.
Not just yet. But Richards or Carter better produce in the next two games or they will have to wear the Loser Jacket until next April.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarfo View Post
If I was Holmgren, I would've found the names of each player that was crying over Upshall, and I would've burnt their cute little Olde City condos to the ground. Get the **** out of this city.
That's right.

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Old
04-18-2009, 08:19 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Very True. The Flyers talent level is sick.
The Flyers talent level sucks. Didn't you see the last two games? Player for player, the Flyers aren't even in the same realm with the Penguins.

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04-18-2009, 08:23 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Panther fan trolling by, we would gladly trade you Vokoun, if the return was good enough. However, we would not be interested in acquiring the players that create your salary cap issues (i.e. Briere, Lupul, Carle) about the best thing we have going for us, besides DeBoer, is cap room.
I think we can trade Lupul to some team that needs scoring for picks or something.

I would love to send Jones but I doubt that will work.

This offseason will be interesting, but I personally would like Vokoun in Philly.

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Old
04-18-2009, 10:15 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by JXC View Post
The Flyers talent level sucks. Didn't you see the last two games? Player for player, the Flyers aren't even in the same realm with the Penguins.
I beg to disagree. The Flyers outplayed the Penguins in Game 2. You lost because of lack of discipline, not lack of talent.

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04-18-2009, 10:31 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
I beg to disagree. The Flyers outplayed the Penguins in Game 2. You lost because of lack of discipline, not lack of talent.
Yep.

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Old
04-18-2009, 10:48 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
I beg to disagree. The Flyers outplayed the Penguins in Game 2. You lost because of lack of discipline, not lack of talent.
momentary lack of discipline

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04-19-2009, 06:04 AM
  #116
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Keep Vokoun. I want his back-up.

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Old
04-19-2009, 09:35 PM
  #117
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Maybe Pat Quinn is a good option for coach

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Old
04-19-2009, 09:39 PM
  #118
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Maybe Pat Quinn is a good option for coach
Pat Quinn round 2!

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Old
04-19-2009, 09:40 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
I beg to disagree. The Flyers outplayed the Penguins in Game 2. You lost because of lack of discipline, not lack of talent.
Wouldn't bother arguing with JXC


Last edited by HoverCarle*: 04-19-2009 at 09:46 PM.
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Old
04-19-2009, 09:53 PM
  #120
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My biggest fear is that we're wasting our "Golden Years". The time when our core is still young and lethal, and our supporting cast is good enough to win a cup. Im afraid we're going to waste it b/c of poor coaching and no system. I hope Im wrong. But I feel like somewhere out there is a parallel universe where we have a real system, and real discipline, and real championships.

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Old
04-20-2009, 12:02 AM
  #121
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But I feel like somewhere out there is a parallel universe where we have a real system, and real discipline, and real championships.
And real defensemen and real forwards who are good defensively, presumably.

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Old
04-20-2009, 12:46 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by JXC View Post
And real defensemen and real forwards who are good defensively, presumably.
Did Gagne refuse to give you an autograph? There's so many players you could have picked on in the last few months. Why'd you choose Gags?

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Old
04-20-2009, 09:04 AM
  #123
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Did Gagne refuse to give you an autograph? There's so many players you could have picked on in the last few months. Why'd you choose Gags?
The last few months? Try the last few games.

He's really not good defensively, and people should stop their idol worship and see him for what he really is.

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Old
04-20-2009, 09:31 AM
  #124
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Originally Posted by JXC View Post
The last few months? Try the last few games.

He's really not good defensively, and people should stop their idol worship and see him for what he really is.
Gagne, to me, looks like he will play out his contract here and then be on his way somewhere else. That's the feeling I get. And frankly, if it means keeping Giroux (granted if he continues to improve, and only then) then I guess I will pick Giroux over Gagne.

We also have JVR on his way up, and as a number 2 overall pick, I think he will play extremely well. We need a better system with stronger more consistent defensive play and solid goaltending and we could win it the next 2 years.

Our forward depth is nasty, and in fact, too deep in many ways as it hurts us in other areas.

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