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Old
05-05-2009, 06:15 PM
  #1
All_blueandwhite
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Phx-tor

If left on the board are Cowen and Schenn, and Phx wants to take Schenn...

To Toronto
6th Overall pick
2nd round pick

To Phoenix
D Pavel Kubina
7th overall pick

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Old
05-05-2009, 06:16 PM
  #2
zyllyx
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Deal. I mean, as far as we're concerned, you're giving us Kubina for a 2nd round pick. I doubt Maloney and co. are too concerned about dropping down a spot.

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Old
05-05-2009, 06:17 PM
  #3
Alberta Yote
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T.O. would need to take David Hale and Todd Fedoruk back in the same deal. The Coyotes might still have trouble fitting in the salary but it would be close.

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Old
05-05-2009, 06:18 PM
  #4
rt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by All_blueandwhite View Post
If left on the board are Cowen and Schenn, and Phx wants to take Schenn...

To Toronto
6th Overall pick
2nd round pick

To Phoenix
D Pavel Kubina
7th overall pick
Good proposal. We haven't the slightest idea what the Coyotes budget may be like, though.

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Originally Posted by Alberta Yote View Post
T.O. would need to take David Hale and Todd Fedoruk back in the same deal. The Coyotes might still have trouble fitting in the salary but it would be close.
Even then, five million for one player is probably stretching it quite a bit. We have other holes to fill, and no money to fill them with.

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Old
05-05-2009, 06:27 PM
  #5
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I don't see the Coyotes being able to make this deal with their current financial issues. They won't be allowed to add significant salary like that without sending salary back unless the ownership issues are resolved.

From the Phoenix side it makes sense overall though, but I'd be curious to see if the Toronto fan base is excited about getting a 2nd rounder for Kubina.

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Old
05-05-2009, 06:30 PM
  #6
Milan the God*
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Do you not think that the Leafs give up too much to move up one spot and get a 2nd?

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Old
05-05-2009, 06:33 PM
  #7
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Originally Posted by Converse View Post
I don't see the Coyotes being able to make this deal with their current financial issues. They won't be allowed to add significant salary like that without sending salary back unless the ownership issues are resolved.

From the Phoenix side it makes sense overall though, but I'd be curious to see if the Toronto fan base is excited about getting a 2nd rounder for Kubina.
It's the difference between Cowen and B. Schenn, though. That's assuming that Burke even likes B. Schenn anymore than he does Cowen. He seems to like having two big time defensemen on his top two pairings, anyway. Jovo and Ohlund then Pronger and Nieds. Maybe L. Schenn and Cowen are the next generation of Burke's towers of power on the blueline. I think fans probably consider the brothers connection more than Burke does. Especially if Phoenix really likes Schenn a whole lot better than any of the other players left on the board, and Toronto would really have to overpay, like that. Burke's nothing if not stubborn. If he doesn't like the price, he won't make the deal. He gave up Bryzgalov for free just because he didn't like the offers he got. He was insulted by what potential return he could've had, so he just simply gave Bryz away. To a division rival, no less. That is the epitome of stubborness. If teams are asking too much for him to move up, he'll stay put. No way he gets caught up in the Brotherly hype and does something he doesn't want to do. It's not his style. Not at all.

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Old
05-05-2009, 07:22 PM
  #8
Nizdizzle
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This is horrible, why are we giving up a top-4 D-man for a 2nd round pick, just to move up 1 spot? It's only one spot. Not worth it at all.

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Old
05-05-2009, 10:49 PM
  #9
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Toronto fans need to also consider the implications from a salary cap standpoint. If such a move freed up enough capital to land Cammelleri and the Sedin twins does it all of a sudden become workable?

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Old
05-05-2009, 11:02 PM
  #10
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pass... I'd happily draft Cowen. Kubina's worth more than just a 2nd rounder.

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Old
05-05-2009, 11:08 PM
  #11
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All Brian Burke is trying to do is give up players for draft picks so i think that it is a good deal for Toronto.

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Old
05-05-2009, 11:09 PM
  #12
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Not sure if Pheonix is in the position to take on big contracts now

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Old
05-06-2009, 08:25 AM
  #13
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it's not too bad really ...though more $$ would need to come to Toronto, perhaps make the deal bigger, and add Stajan from Toronto, and take Jovo back ...though, I'd think Phoenix would like a Jovo/Kubina top pairing ...he was the only big salary guy i noticed though.

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Old
05-06-2009, 09:52 AM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsInsideOut View Post
Not sure if Pheonix is in the position to take on big contracts now
Once they get that RIM $$$ they will be!

I dont like the deal. I would rather keep Kubina, unless it does allow us to free up space and sign the Sedins.

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Old
05-06-2009, 10:49 AM
  #15
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Kubina, 2nd (NYR) '09, Tlusty


To Toronto: 6th overall pick, Fedoruk, Hale


Leafs can draft Cowen and Schenn and stop worrying about getting Luke's brother.

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Old
05-06-2009, 12:05 PM
  #16
Nizdizzle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hbk View Post
Toronto fans need to also consider the implications from a salary cap standpoint. If such a move freed up enough capital to land Cammelleri and the Sedin twins does it all of a sudden become workable?
So that fact that it gives us more cap space makes it ok to not get full value? There are plenty of ways to get cap space, and Kubina certainly wouldn't be that difficult to move

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Old
05-06-2009, 12:13 PM
  #17
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Good deal for Phx if it wasn't for there financial problems.

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Old
05-06-2009, 12:17 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kmart8 View Post
All Brian Burke is trying to do is give up players for draft picks so i think that it is a good deal for Toronto.
By this theory, Kaberle for a 7th rounder is a fair deal?

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Old
05-06-2009, 12:44 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hbk View Post
Toronto fans need to also consider the implications from a salary cap standpoint. If such a move freed up enough capital to land Cammelleri and the Sedin twins does it all of a sudden become workable?
Cap space isn't an issue for the Leafs currently (nor will it be next season).

Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeylove View Post
Kubina, 2nd (NYR) '09, Tlusty


To Toronto: 6th overall pick, Fedoruk, Hale


Leafs can draft Cowen and Schenn and stop worrying about getting Luke's brother.
Leafs give up too much. Tlusty does not belong in that proposal. Also, Fedoruk and Hale have negative value. If Phoenix wants to dump salary, then they have to pay (with assets).

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Old
05-06-2009, 03:41 PM
  #20
Cool Hand Luke
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Quote:
Originally Posted by All_blueandwhite View Post
If left on the board are Cowen and Schenn, and Phx wants to take Schenn...

To Toronto
6th Overall pick
Calgary's 1st 2009/2010 (whichever Calgary choses)
Fedoruk (Salary Dump)

To Phoenix
D Pavel Kubina

7th overall pick
Edit. We take some salary back, and you up that 2nd rounder to the late 1st rounder that you got in the Jokinen deal.


Last edited by Cool Hand Luke: 05-06-2009 at 06:08 PM.
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Old
05-06-2009, 04:56 PM
  #21
Snip Genos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cool Hand Luke View Post
Edit. We take some salary back, and you up that 2nd rounder to the late 1st rounder that you got in the Jokinen deal.
Love it

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Old
05-06-2009, 05:40 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathan311 View Post
This is horrible, why are we giving up a top-4 D-man for a 2nd round pick, just to move up 1 spot? It's only one spot. Not worth it at all.
It's not "one spot". It's the difference between one player and another. You have to try and look at the end game here. In 2000, Scott Hartnell was picked 6th overall, followed by Lars Jonsson (who played a grand total of 8 games in the NHL). I know what you're gonna say: I'm using one draft to help illustrate my point and that's twisting the facts in my favor. You can also say: Hey, but there were better players who were available at 7 too (Frolov, Boyes, Volchenkov, Justin Williams etc). That's all true. But you have to take the draft for what it's worth. You're dealing with probability and even one spot higher can make all the difference. You just have to hope the scouting staff doesn't eff up.

I don't really care for this trade and it's not something I'm willing to address to a great extent. I just want to throw in the fact that it's not the upgrade from "7th" to "6th" but rather "Cowan" to "Schenn" as that was the OP's intent all along. The Leafs need some size and strength down the middle and that's what Schenn provides. Uniting the brothers would be cool too. That all said, it's a shame the Kings are taking Braydon at 5.

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Old
05-06-2009, 05:56 PM
  #23
Nizdizzle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DapperDan View Post
It's not "one spot". It's the difference between one player and another. You have to try and look at the end game here. In 2000, Scott Hartnell was picked 6th overall, followed by Lars Jonsson (who played a grand total of 8 games in the NHL). I know what you're gonna say: I'm using one draft to help illustrate my point and that's twisting the facts in my favor. You can also say: Hey, but there were better players who were available at 7 too (Frolov, Boyes, Volchenkov, Justin Williams etc). That's all true. But you have to take the draft for what it's worth. You're dealing with probability and even one spot higher can make all the difference. You just have to hope the scouting staff doesn't eff up.

I don't really care for this trade and it's not something I'm willing to address to a great extent. I just want to throw in the fact that it's not the upgrade from "7th" to "6th" but rather "Cowan" to "Schenn" as that was the OP's intent all along. The Leafs need some size and strength down the middle and that's what Schenn provides. Uniting the brothers would be cool too. That all said, it's a shame the Kings are taking Braydon at 5.
They rankings for prospects in that range are up in the air, how often at the draft do teams make a deal to move up 1 spot? I honestly can't think of one instance. If the Leafs do intend to trade up in a deal to land Schenn it won't be for one spot, they'll make a run for the 5th, or 4th overall.

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Old
05-06-2009, 06:33 PM
  #24
My Sweet Shadow
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I wouldn't think Burke would waste Kubina on a trade like that... moving up a spot and gaining a third 2nd would be nice, but its not worth it at the expense of a top pairing defenseman.

Not to mention the fact that declaring bankruptcy then going out and gaining 5M in salaries doesn't really go hand-in-hand.

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Old
05-06-2009, 06:39 PM
  #25
rt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by My Sweet Shadow View Post
I wouldn't think Burke would waste Kubina on a trade like that... moving up a spot and gaining a third 2nd would be nice, but its not worth it at the expense of a top pairing defenseman.

Not to mention the fact that declaring bankruptcy then going out and gaining 5M in salaries doesn't really go hand-in-hand.
But Balsillie has billions, and just think of what stealing Kubina from the Leafs would do for the attendance in Hamilton. All those thousands upon thousands of Kubina fanatics would jump ship, in an instant


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