HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must use the RUMOR prefix in thread title. Proposals must contain the PROPOSAL prefix in the thread title.

Thrashers 1st round pick

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-24-2009, 11:44 AM
  #76
JT 91 NYI*
 
JT 91 NYI*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 695
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CIsle View Post
To TOR:
4th overall

To ATL:
Kaberle and Stajan
I don't see the Thrashers doing that at all. Leaf fans will like it

JT 91 NYI* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 11:47 AM
  #77
Pukboy5kroner
Registered User
 
Pukboy5kroner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,444
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LIMITING REAGENT View Post
4th + mid porpect

for

Lecavalier


4th

for

toronto 7th + Kuemin

please be kind on the critisism
The 4th for Kulemin and the 7th is fair, maybe even a bit much from Toronto. However, that 4th plus a mid prospect for Vinnie is a bit off.

Pukboy5kroner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 12:04 PM
  #78
twenty2
 
twenty2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Lumberton, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 966
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Pucks View Post
And I can counter that with the amount of times this board had been inundated with Lupul proposals is beyond ridiculas. Virtually every thread which a goaile, dman or forward of any value is proposed, Lupul, Jones or Briere get brought up by the same people then they swarm the thread turning it into a debacle.

If I choose to aproach these threads that is up to me, if you choose to read them that is up to you.

By the way, I cant tell you if they are still hot, my wife keeps me away.
Actually 95% of the threads that Lupul comes up in are about Philadelphia to begin. The other 2-3 times they have been in a thread like this where people where wondering what something could get them. The Flyers fans who jump in are just throwing what the original proposal would be in terms of value from a Flyers' standpoint.

So basically...you're wrong.

Also most of those 95% of threads that do involve Philly, involve Philly getting ripped off or a player that the Flyers are not going to move. That is when players like Lupul come into play; ones that don't make sense for the Flyers to hold on to, but who would make other teams better.

twenty2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 12:17 PM
  #79
John Cena*
12x WWE CHAMPION!!!!
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Country: United States
Posts: 11,527
vCash: 500
What could a possible trade with Colorado be like ?

4th pick for Liles and Wolski ?

John Cena* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 12:41 PM
  #80
The Nemesis
Global Moderator
Semper Tyrannus
 
The Nemesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Langley, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 51,811
vCash: 500
no personal comments please. Debate the post and not the poster.

__________________

"Do you know what "nemesis" means? A righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent."
Sometimes I use Twitter: @Nemesis_HF
Sorry, I am not taking signature requests at this time.
The Nemesis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 12:56 PM
  #81
Giroux tha Damaja
Registered User
 
Giroux tha Damaja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mount Holly, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,239
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Giroux tha Damaja
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Pucks View Post
Virtually every thread which a goalie, dman or forward of any value is proposed, Lupul, Jones or Briere get brought up by the same people then they swarm the thread turning it into a debacle.
There has been a lot of talk, but I think you're overstating both the frequency with which Lupul or Briere are offered in situations where trade offers aren't solicited, and the unpleasant nature of the discussion that follows.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Pucks View Post
If I choose to aproach these threads that is up to me, if you choose to read them that is up to you.
Touche, though I think you underrate his value almost as severely as others do the opposite. That discussion is one you have had plenty of, and I am no more likely to sway you than other Philly fans, so I will just agree to disagree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Pucks View Post
By the way, I cant tell you if they are still hot, my wife keeps me away.
And Lupul thanks her for it, no doubt.

Giroux tha Damaja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 01:10 PM
  #82
fatschoonerrat
Registered User
 
fatschoonerrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Charleston
Posts: 1,417
vCash: 500
I like what Waddell said about taking on bigger, front-loaded contracts that have a high cap hit but the actual salary towards the end of the contracts is less than the cap hit. So any big name/salaried players would probably come to us with that kind of contract (Briere, Gomez(?), etc.).

So far the proposals in this thread aren't very appealling. Because of our self-imposed cap, I don't see us trading what will be a young, talented player with a smaller contract for many years. Especially for an older, well-compensated player.

fatschoonerrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 01:19 PM
  #83
Giroux tha Damaja
Registered User
 
Giroux tha Damaja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mount Holly, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,239
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Giroux tha Damaja
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatschoonerrat View Post
I like what Waddell said about taking on bigger, front-loaded contracts that have a high cap hit but the actual salary towards the end of the contracts is less than the cap hit. So any big name/salaried players would probably come to us with that kind of contract (Briere, Gomez(?), etc.).
The worst part of Briere's contract is over, though he still isn't cheap at 7million (6.5 cap hit). He could possibly be that first line center that Atlanta needs and the idea of playing a lot of minutes with a Kovalchuk would most likely be appealing to him, but I don't think he would waive his NTC unless he was strong armed, which is not an option I would employ were I a GM hoping to ever sign a UFA again. Add to that the fact that Briere is nowhere near the #4 pick in value and it gets sticky (Briere for a goalie is more likely).

There is also the internal budget you mentioned regarding Atlanta and the fact that Kovy is going to be making some decent coin already, and trading for a guy like Briere might require the ownership to spend more than they would like. What is the atmosphere like in Atlanta regarding hockey? Does it seem like the kind of place that could get sold out if they were given a play-off caliber team to watch? I.e. is there reason for the ownership to think they could get a return on their investment if the team starts clicking?

Giroux tha Damaja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 03:28 PM
  #84
Magnus Fulgur
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 7,354
vCash: 500
Atlanta will draw well if they have a good team. The same owners own the Hawks in the NBA and saw return on their investment when they became better. Philips arena was packed for their two playoff game losses and very full during that run up to the playoffs.

Magnus Fulgur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 05:32 PM
  #85
mytor4*
 
mytor4*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,175
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mercury View Post
Lehtonen and Valabik for JVR and Jones is not a terrible idea. Jeez, man, why don't you post more like that, and cut out the nonsense?
No More like Lehtonen and Valabik for JVR and Lupul.
And for the Pens Atl's 1st rd pick 4th overall and their 3rd pick for Staal and pitts 1st rd pick which is in the teens?

mytor4* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 05:42 PM
  #86
Ruiner058
Registered User
 
Ruiner058's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 99
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by AtlantaSportsFan View Post
What could a possible trade with Colorado be like ?

4th pick for Liles and Wolski ?
Co needs a goalie more than another pick... although Atl and Co could be good trading partners IMO. Colorado, especially if they draft Duchene, will be loaded at center and as a re-building team have plenty of assets that can be moved (although most have unfavorable contracts). Atl seems to be trying to move a goalie which Co desperately needs. You could probably work out a deal involving Wolski, Svatos, Salei, Clark, Hannan, Tucker, Arnason, or Liles. However, most of Colorado's players are currently severely undervalued because of how the team as a whole played, so Co fans generally over-value their players while everyone else undervalues them. To be honest, I don't think anyone has any idea what players like Wolski and Svatos could do if they were on another team. Mix that with some overpayed players and it'll be tough for armchair gms on here (HF) to make an agreeable trade. Anyways, Co is looking pref. for a goalie that can take over as a starter next season, if not then for sure by the season after next... b/c with the defensive prospects slated to start coming in then Co should be competitive again.

Ruiner058 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 05:54 PM
  #87
Norm MacDonald
Registered User
 
Norm MacDonald's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 4,460
vCash: 500
The reason I really doubt the Thrashers wouldn't pursue Staal, is because they would want a center who can play well with Kovalchuk. His ideal center is a quick playmaker who can make precise passes at high speeds, and preferably with a right handed shot. Jordan Staal doesn't really fit the bill. Even though he is talented, he wouldn't be an upgrade chemistry-wise over what they have for the top two lines.

Norm MacDonald is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 06:11 PM
  #88
Payaso619*
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Country: Mexico
Posts: 4,135
vCash: 500
How about 1st, Bieksa and Wellwood for the 4th + 3rd? I think Wellwood would excel very well with Kovulchuk, he's obviously not up to speed with Kovulchuk but, I think his smarts and his awareness will suit Kovulchuk just well.

Payaso619* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 06:28 PM
  #89
The Pucks
Registered User
 
The Pucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,594
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Payaso619 View Post
How about 1st, Bieksa and Wellwood for the 4th + 3rd? I think Wellwood would excel very well with Kovulchuk, he's obviously not up to speed with Kovulchuk but, I think his smarts and his awareness will suit Kovulchuk just well.
I dont see Vancouver moving Bieksa for picks unless they have a UFA dman signed. I suspect Wellwood could be aquired fairly easily during the season if Hodgson shows decent signs of progress.

The Pucks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 07:00 PM
  #90
Beesfan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,997
vCash: 500
I don't see Bergeron's health issues as being such a huge deal, as he quickly recovered from a second concussion this year, and was a very physical player in the playoffs. But someone raised a good point about it just being too risky for Atlanta, who needs a sure thing right now.

That said, a 4th overall pick is hardly a "sure thing." Here are the 4th overall picks since 2002:

Joni Pitkanen
Nik Zherdev
Andrew Ladd
Benoit Pouliot
Nik Backstrom
Thomas Hickey
Alex Pietrangelo

Even including health problems, Bergeron could be traded straight-up for anyone on this list except for Backstrom and Pietrangelo. While people talk of the risk in taking Bergeron, they forget that the draft every year is a crap-shoot. I recognize this is a deep draft, but if I had to bet, I would say Bergeron and the 25th overall would be viewed as a win for Atlanta 5 years down the line (and of course would help them more now).

Beesfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 07:19 PM
  #91
btn
Gone Hollywood
 
btn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: ATL
Country: United States
Posts: 15,677
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeepOrange View Post
The reason I really doubt the Thrashers wouldn't pursue Staal, is because they would want a center who can play well with Kovalchuk. His ideal center is a quick playmaker who can make precise passes at high speeds, and preferably with a right handed shot. Jordan Staal doesn't really fit the bill. Even though he is talented, he wouldn't be an upgrade chemistry-wise over what they have for the top two lines.
The Thrashers also need size, grit, and to improve their PK.

They score enough goals to compete as is, what they need is to tighten up the PK and prevent more goals against. Staal helps there.

btn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 07:25 PM
  #92
NHL33*
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: New York
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 7,873
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruiner058 View Post
Co fans generally over-value their players while everyone else undervalues them.
No, we don't. It depends on the fan you ask...and that's certainly not limited to our fan base.

It also depends on the trade or players involved, since in certain circumstances the value might be fair but an overpayment would be required for the offer to be accepted by one party.

NHL33* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 07:42 PM
  #93
Norm MacDonald
Registered User
 
Norm MacDonald's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 4,460
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by btn View Post
The Thrashers also need size, grit, and to improve their PK.

They score enough goals to compete as is, what they need is to tighten up the PK and prevent more goals against. Staal helps there.
But that's the role he already plays for the Pens. A team trading for Staal would be one ready to give him more opportunities offensively, because they can get more from him than the Pens are now.

If the Thrashers are making a move primarily to improve their penalty killing, size and grit, they can do better than the 4th overall for Staal. They can address those issue by signing veterans and use their first either as a trading chip to a much harder-to-fix problem (like acquiring a first line player) or to draft a potential franchise player.

Norm MacDonald is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 07:54 PM
  #94
Sunfire
Registered User
 
Sunfire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 82
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Pucks View Post
Yeah, your right on this one, a serious overvale on Spezza, undervalue on Carter, not a good deal for anybody except Ottawa.
I don't think Spezza is being overvalued. In 293 games he has put up 342 pts and has an average of +13 compared to Carter who played 307 games for 216 points and has an average of +5.

If the trade were broken down it would be a Spezza for a 1st, Esposito, and Lehtonen. Lehtonen then traded to Phillie. Based on what I have read so far Phillie fans are more than willing to overpay and give up some future to get Lehtonen if they did a straight up deal with Atlanta.

Sunfire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 07:56 PM
  #95
mercury
Registered User
 
mercury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: South Philly/SoCal
Country: United States
Posts: 11,140
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfire View Post
If the trade were broken down it would be a Spezza for a 1st, Esposito, and Lehtonen. Lehtonen then traded to Phillie. Based on what I have read so far Phillie fans are more than willing to overpay and give up some future to get Lehtonen if they did a straight up deal with Atlanta.
Since when? Also, Spezza has played 404 games, and has put up 418 points, and has a career average of +12. That deal was atrocious for Philadelphia. Carter for Lehtonen and Kelly? You cannot be serious. Carter for Lehtonen, Kelly, and Atlanta's 1st is more like it.


Last edited by mercury: 05-24-2009 at 08:03 PM.
mercury is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 08:09 PM
  #96
Sunfire
Registered User
 
Sunfire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 82
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mercury View Post
Since when? Also, Spezza has played 404 games, and has put up 418 points, and has a career average of +12. That deal was atrocious for Philadelphia. Carter for Lehtonen and Kelly? You cannot be serious. Carter for Lehtonen, Kelly, and Atlanta's 1st is more like it.
The numbers are based on the past 4 seasons to make the comparisons similar.

Sunfire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 08:11 PM
  #97
mercury
Registered User
 
mercury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: South Philly/SoCal
Country: United States
Posts: 11,140
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfire View Post
The numbers are based on the past 4 seasons to make the comparisons similar.
But that's not fair to Carter, who has only been in the league for 4 seasons. You can't compare two big centers by using one's 3rd through 6th seasons and the other's 1st through 4th. You have to include Spezza's first two seasons in the comparison.

mercury is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 08:20 PM
  #98
catters078
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Australia
Country: Australia
Posts: 3,084
vCash: 500
To Atlanta: Pick 8 + pick 38 plus Trevor Daley

To Dallas: Pick 4 and Pavelec

?? Just threw one out there, probably not enough for Atlanta

catters078 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 08:57 PM
  #99
MarryMarner
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,839
vCash: 500
Tomas Kaberle
Mikhail Grabovksi

for

4th Overall
Colby Armstrong

MarryMarner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-24-2009, 08:59 PM
  #100
Giroux tha Damaja
Registered User
 
Giroux tha Damaja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mount Holly, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,239
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Giroux tha Damaja
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfire View Post
If the trade were broken down it would be a Spezza for a 1st, Esposito, and Lehtonen. Lehtonen then traded to Phillie. Based on what I have read so far Phillie fans are more than willing to overpay and give up some future to get Lehtonen if they did a straight up deal with Atlanta.
We may be willing to overpay slightly for Lehtonen, but your proposal is way past the point of reasonable. There is overpayment, then there is just getting fleeced. If Philadelphia is willing to part with Carter for a goalie they can get a better return than Lehtonen. We do worse in your deal than we would just dealing with Atlanta in a one on one basis. No offense, but that proposal just doesn't take into account what is fair for Philadelphia.

Giroux tha Damaja is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:04 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.